Byzantium 1.5 Cheese

[Blastaz]

Yep. That's exactly what I did. I suppose RNG just hated me for a moment


Oh yea, already had like a 3 rounds of galleys slowly building thanks to looting. Ottomans give plenty of gold But... then RNG decided to call a GG on me. ~_~ That's fine, will try again

It's not rng it's rules. you either had 2 units in Anatolia or didn't notice the scorch ran out...

 

[Viperswhip]

Yep. That's exactly what I did. I suppose RNG just hated me for a moment


Oh yea, already had like a 3 rounds of galleys slowly building thanks to looting. Ottomans give plenty of gold But... then RNG decided to call a GG on me. ~_~ That's fine, will try again

Looting is not based on their treasury, it's based on the tax value of the province. Even after they go bankrupt you still loot half the value of the tax.

 

[Aethis]

Finally got this to work and got the Basileus achievement :laugh:

 

[StatikShocker]

edit: "I went the wrong way"

 

[Bibor]

This strategy apparently works IF Ottos don't get dragged into another war that makes them get right of passage through literally every country.

 

[Kraxis]

Oh yes. The Ottomans tends to ally Crimea, and that is dangerous, but generally the war has been on for a year or so when they ally up. But then the Ottomans also like to ally Algeria, who in turn often gets into a war with Marocco or Tunisia. And welcome to the war to Crimea. But if you put enough hurt on the Ottomans, they will decline the new war.

@StatikShocker: I think somewhere Justinian, and all the other great emperors are looking down on you with pleasure. That's one enormous empire. How the heck did you manage that? Multiple wars at a time? I presume no colonisation, even with the colonist. I can tell you picked, Expansion, Diplomacy and Religious. Seems logical enough to me.

 

[Viperswhip]

This strategy apparently works IF Ottos don't get dragged into another war that makes them get right of passage through literally every country.

It still works, it's even better because it leeches their manpower, which we all know, is expensive to replace. This normally only happens in the first year or two, if they do come over to their side, just scrap those troops and wait for them to go back to Greece, which they will. This is a twenty year strategy. In any case, I find it better to take out Candar after they have taking over Treb. If you are worried about it, take Treb in the peace deal instead of vassalizing them entirely. That way you can scorch Treb as well. Mostly the eastern side is guarded by nations big enough to resist the 20 or so troops the Ottos can send there. If you are looting them, including Greece when you can, they can't build any more troops than that.

 

[jrk264]

It still works, it's even better because it leeches their manpower, which we all know, is expensive to replace. This normally only happens in the first year or two, if they do come over to their side, just scrap those troops and wait for them to go back to Greece, which they will. This is a twenty year strategy. In any case, I find it better to take out Candar after they have taking over Treb. If you are worried about it, take Treb in the peace deal instead of vassalizing them entirely. That way you can scorch Treb as well. Mostly the eastern side is guarded by nations big enough to resist the 20 or so troops the Ottos can send there. If you are looting them, including Greece when you can, they can't build any more troops than that.

If this happens during the loot stage of the process you can just duck your guys out of the way and dock your fleet at Constantinople. The Ottos then walk over to Europe to patiently wait for the scorched earth to run out so they can finally win the war...

It's a little more awkward if it happens while you're trying to siege them, it seems a little random whether they prioritize sieging you (or waiting to) or de-sieging their stuff.

 

[Viperswhip]

I tested tonight, 100% of the time their navy comes over to Const if I turn the naval support slider down to save money. It doesn't matter though, their troops don't cross unless they get into a war and as long as you keep your looter away from them (1 whole province between) they won't chase him. Once the war is over they will go back over to Erdine.

 

[Encak]

edit: "I went the wrong way"

Na, you went the best way.

 

[Kraxis]

I tested tonight, 100% of the time their navy comes over to Const if I turn the naval support slider down to save money. It doesn't matter though, their troops don't cross unless they get into a war and as long as you keep your looter away from them (1 whole province between) they won't chase him. Once the war is over they will go back over to Erdine.

Yes, I found that as soon as Albania was taken the fleet did come to Constantinople. But it shouldn't take long before you have the fleet requite to take them out. You can also lure the fleet away by taking your ships in Achaea and blockade Epirus. It requires a bit of micromanagement, but doesn't everything in this strategy require that? I mean one of my greatest challenges is not causing the 'Looted' crash when you mouseover the tooltip.

 

[Viperswhip]

Yes, I found that as soon as Albania was taken the fleet did come to Constantinople. But it shouldn't take long before you have the fleet requite to take them out. You can also lure the fleet away by taking your ships in Achaea and blockade Epirus. It requires a bit of micromanagement, but doesn't everything in this strategy require that? I mean one of my greatest challenges is not causing the 'Looted' crash when you mouseover the tooltip.

Well, I did have my two kings die (they weren't even generals) and a 2 year old take over. That nerfed that playthrough, by the time I got over there was a 10 stack of pretender rebels. But generally, there isn't too much luck in the strategy, just lots of micro management. But ya, I've crashed a few times with the looted thing as well.

 

[Caewil]

So, once survival is established, what's a good next move?

I've just had some very good luck on my third run - venice got into a war with austria and aragon and I was able to take their fleet out, netting me naxos and crete - still during my first ottoman war. Rebels popped and I took all the ottoman's greek provinces. Then bosnia reduced serbia to an OPM, so I diplovassalised serbia, attacked bosnia for those cores back and force vassaled both them and wallacia. All this before 1462! Unfortunately, I'm almost out of manpower.

So, the ottomans have no troops on the european side - a dow for bulgaria will be easy with blockading. But Candar has trebizond - I can probably take them, get trebizond, then hopefully diplovassalise OPM georgia and release it from AQ. Is this a better option than taking asia minor? My last playthrough I took asia minor fairly early, but got bogged down with rebels as I couldn't convert it.

Problem is I'd rather go for innovative than religious. Does anyone have any good expansion plans for an innovative byzantium or is religious necessary? Long term goal is to reform Alexander + Justinian's empire.

 

[Kraxis]

Well, Religious isn't required, but it is certainly a good choice. The extra missionary and strength will make sure you run close to 100% RU. With a single missionary and 3% less, you might have to pick some of the less desirable decisions to get the percentage up, and you will still be slow. But it is doable. Innovative will help you if you want to just be aggressive and stomp all over the place rapidly. +1 Leader and the ticking WE reduction are godsent, but even the otherwise limited tech bonus is great for Eastern (it is often slightly wasted for Western).
Picking it and Administrative later on (when you have run out of vassals to feed) will mean you get loads of cheap mercs (extremely useful for stomping weaker enemies or preserving the standing army for stronger enemies) and easy expansion. Religious is for a more internally secure empire.

First expansion should whatever you can take. Byzantium needs to get stronger and fast! So where you can you should grab a vassal or a few cores.

 

[Panzerschiffe]

First expansion should whatever you can take. Byzantium needs to get stronger and fast! So where you can you should grab a vassal or a few cores.

If you can get Kaffa early somehow, it will save you a lot of grief against Russia later. Muscovy rarely ever fails to form Russia and become a huge pain to deal with. Lucky nations tends to do that.

I tried to go around by way of Georgia since I didn't want to go to war with Poland or Lithuania who had HRE allies (Austria at times, which was also my ally) but I was too slow and got bogged down by the Mamluks and their friends. That one province haunted me for the longest time until finally I was able to get Russia to DOW me and get Austria on my side. Austria was also allied to Russia, so the aggressor was gonna get beat.

Time is of the essence! Grab what you can! Save Kaffa for later at worst.

 

[StatikShocker]

eh. once I had anatolia and egypt and westernized, I just planted 8 stacks of 40 in a cluster, and russia couldn't do SHIT. I annexed almost all of russia; that's my empire up a few posts. Once you westernize, your army is on par with france, with your NI's. plenty of manpower as well...

 

[TheMeInTeam]

eh. once I had anatolia and egypt and westernized, I just planted 8 stacks of 40 in a cluster, and russia couldn't do SHIT. I annexed almost all of russia; that's my empire up a few posts. Once you westernize, your army is on par with france, with your NI's. plenty of manpower as well...

Not to mention you can just walk through Uzbek and seize Muscovy's 2nd colony, peace out, and warn them. Much weaker Asian nations can do this trivially, so it's not much for Byzantium.

 

[StatikShocker]

Not to mention you can just walk through Uzbek and seize Muscovy's 2nd colony, peace out, and warn them. Much weaker Asian nations can do this trivially, so it's not much for Byzantium.

well, I thought I could ally them, and we could be orthodox buddies to the end of time, while I rebuilt rome. but the bastards turned on me. I should have known better. Actually, THEY should have known better.

I got my revenge.

 

[aragonFTW]

It doesn't really save much grief grabbing Kaffa early if you don't contain Muscovy or surgically strike Crimea too. Russia will frequently get a mission claim on Kaffa and the entire north black sea region for as long as the Crimean Khanate is alive. Cue much wailing and gnashing of troops.

Your Georgia plan sounds good. Once I had Georgia and Kaffa secured I basically picked off the remaining Turks in AM and took a few years to consolidate and build up to level 2 everywhere. At which point the logical way to expand is south to the Mamlukes for Antioch, Jerusalem and Alexandria, as you will easily be much stronger than them despite their size and won't get any AE in Europe for taking them on.

 

[Ferric_Oxide]

Just used this lovely scorched earth tactic to win a war of independence against England playing as Wales.
Burgundy supported me and they did all the fighting, with the entire English army just standing right next to Wales for the entire war.