Byzantium 1.23

[Sandmann]

Seems harder in 1.23. The Ottomans doesen't go for their easy cores anymore except the one that is left in Albania. I didn't even have time to ally Hungary and Poland before they DoWed me. Can't rival the Ottos from start anymore makes it slower to get big allies. I think you have to ally someone small like Wallachia quick so you won't be on the top of the Otto kill list. Albania got guaranteed and allied by Hungary so they picked me first..

 

[Sfan]

Ally Treibzond and Wallachia to delay the Ottomans attack, hope that they attack Albania first (restart until they do). Now, the Albanian war will actually be hard, jump on them at the right moment during their war vs Albania+Venice+potentially Hungary. If you do so the Mamluks will probably add to that, and the Ottos are basically dead. Or try to ally Albania and hope that they still attack Albania, get the occupations and separate peace. These are my two ideas right off the bat.

 

[Valynor]

Try until you get lucky, as always

 

[Sandmann]

Try until you get lucky, as always

Of course, but what ways to make it easier is good to know.

 

[schondetta]

Straighttrap .trick
Releaseandplay.trick

Both still seem valid

 

[Sandmann]

Straighttrap .trick
Releaseandplay.trick

Both still seem valid

For straighttrap you have to outnumber their fleet right?

 

[schondetta]

For straighttrap you have to outnumber their fleet right?

Not necessarily you just have to scare them enough for them to not engage you. You can destroy there entire fleet with 3 heavies for example

 

[Viperswhip]

It is funny, but you can, for example, given the timelines, retreat to your port to arrive on the last day of the month and come out again on the first of the month, rinse and repeat, repairing your ships while the AI army sinks due to attrition.

 

[Rafaelito]

I´ve spent the whole day trying to win the first battle against the Ottos but it´s impossible.

Ps: Im playing on Very Hard.

In this difficulty there is no way to ally with Hungary/Poland or anyone big.
Skanderberg strat doesn´t works since they outnumber us by 2-1

 

[Sfan]

In VH winning a fair fight without extreme circumstance has always been almost impossible. Either restart unless they lose vs Albania, or exile?

 

[Sandmann]

3rd attempt and got a nice start! Weekend is saved . Normal iron man. Hope to make Mare Nostrum and Basileus achievements, never tried them before.

Lithuanian collapse. Muscowy annoyingly got a core event on Yedisan while occupying it. This is a province I will need to take from them for Mare Nostrum..

A beautiful Kiev will probably have to fend off Russia knocking on the door but at this point the Muscovitian ruler is diplomatic and has no vital interest in Ukraine, only strategic..

Largest AI Brandenburg I've seen this early so far. Will be something to fight with their quality armies! Megamamlucks aswell. BBB too.

 

[HydroAC]

In my current game as Mamluks, Otto attacked Albania and was getting their head handed to them by Venice and Hungary. I jumped in and grabbed about a third of Anatolia right to Constantinople (which the Ottos hadn't attacked). The Venice-Hungary attack resulted in more Byzantium lands being released in the peace deal. Then I took Constantinople and some of the newly released Byzantium land.

So the advice for Byzantium of delaying alliances and hoping they attack Albania is a good one. You could either get lucky and have some of your cores released by Venice/Hungary, or you can jump in and take land for yourself. If the Mamluks jump in then the Ottos are toast.

So it seems to me that the Albania/Hungary/Venice alliance-guarantee web is a trap for the Ottos, which the AI will fall into. A human player realizes that Constantinople should be taken ASAP.

 

[Quickslow87]

Turn off Cossacks DLC (to remove favors unless you're comfortable calling allies into to war and refusing to give them promised land).

Restart until Poland (and Hungary or Austria if you're feeling patient) is (are) rivaled towards Ottomans.
Improve relations with Poland, Hungary or Austria (depending on set rivals), and Wallachia.
Ally targets as they become available.
Build to army and navy force limits (while improving relations).
Send newly available diplomat to fabricate on Negroponte.
By the time the fabrication is done, you should be done allying at the very least Poland in PU with Lithuania.

At this point, Venice should already be embroiled in war with Albania. If they attacked early, they probably only secured a single ally. If it's one without a large navy such as Florence. Then your navy plus an admiral will be able to easily defeat Venice using the end of month retreat/repair trick (they don't start with very many galleys unless that changed from 1.22 to 1.23).

By the time you're done defeating Venice (and the Knights if you're feeling lucky), the truce timer between Ottomans and your big allies should be up. Move your forces into allied land, wait until Ottomans are at war in Anatolia, and then declare war. Make stacks small enough that your allies feel inclined to attach. Then proceed to occupy at the very least everything on the Balkans side.

 

[GapingLotus]

3rd attempt and got a nice start!...

Looks like it would be a fun game.

 

[szmik]

game 1 - Ottomans DoW within a year despite max FL army and 3 small allies
game 2 - Hungary rivals me... wtf? Ottos go for Dulkkadir, then me.... game over. No one big wants to ally because too many relations -> common theme, so advice to ally Pol/Hab/Mam is kind of unrealistic most of the time
game 3 - Lithuania rivals me.... wtf? (really, player cannot rival much bigger/smaller nations anymore Ottos<->Byz, but AI still does)... looks promising, Hungary/Venice rough them a bit.... but they just recover like nothing hit them, then DoW me, then Genoa also DoWs ... game over

I'm too tired, will try again another time

anyone saying they're nerfed..... go play Byzantium then tell me again... also how many restarts you needed to succeed <salt_off>

I'm not the best player, but don't see what I could do differently.... it's one of those RNG starts, I hate those... but still come for more

 

[schondetta]

every restart is unusually different which i think is a good thing. one game i was testing i missed a good opportunity where Ottos declared on Albania and got ran over by venice aragon and friends and returned cores to me. other games im getting fucked by the stupidly unnecessary "too many diplomatic realtions" modifer which btw is the second biggest cancer given to the game next to forts. one game france allied ottos in one year lol.

 

[schondetta]

ok some constructive input

essentially allied Hungary. Otto went after an Anatolian baylik (the white one) giving them a border with Mamluks. Allied a couple other orthodox minors and Karaman to puff the chest. Mamluks declared war on Ottos i think around 1452. I started the game building up the navy with galleys and one heavy so i can dominate the straight . I watched the Mamluks war closely. after the Mamluks just barely one a huge engagement i declared with Hungary on a promise of land. I had all his units stacked on mine to siege down Edrine to discourage the Ottomans from trying to cross to attack us ( they tried on another run and utterly destroyed us every time #ottosstillop).

whats funny is the day after we got Edrine sieged down Hungary got PUd over Austria THAN 2 days after that Austria got the BI lol. short term that was good since i didnt have to give land to Hungary long term Austria is christian ottos lol. i peaced out a 69% even though i had 12 more from war score to get as i wanted to just be done whit it and work on the economy so that is where the screenshot below is. As you can see i haven't even finished the two cores yet. got Austria as a alliance shortly before the below was taken. I think i ended up with ~10 loans altogether. hope this helps