Bullets, tanks shells and supplies in general

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mavannis

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If you are at war, units spend bullets and shells and whatever they use? And by that i mean you have to produce them or are they included on weapons and tanks productions if you exclude, well... Losses.

My problem is, if in a ideal fight you kill one million soldiers and lose none, you have some losses on weapons, tanks, planes and similars? Because if you dont have to replace anything it seems to me a bit unrealistic.
 

Vidkjaer

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Some of the equipment (tanks, planes, maybe trucks?) has a reliability stat. This means it breaks down when used. not only in combat, but in training - and i think also when just moving.
Planes get destroyed by this by taking off when on duty.

Regarding ammunution. It is modelled in the game that the resources it takes to produce a unit is included everything in its lifetime. Ammunition and fuel.
 
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Alexander Suvorov

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Good post vidkjaer, you are correct the cost of ammunition, fuel, etc. is modeled in game as part of the cost of the equipment produced. but there is also supply lines, which can cause penalties as well. this is how they model say, being out of bullets or gas due to circumstances that cut your units off from the (already paid for) supply.

When a unit finds itself out of supply it has a short period of time where they can live off their own supplies, after that their situation will gradually get worse up to about 30 days when things get very bad. Being out of supply makes you lose organization, move slower, not fight as effectively and take a lot more attrition. Veteran players of HOI know that the best way to beat the enemy is to cut off their supply, encircle them and then destroy them, and this remains true in HOI4.
 

LordOfWar16

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If you are at war, units spend bullets and shells and whatever they use? And by that i mean you have to produce them or are they included on weapons and tanks productions if you exclude, well... Losses.

My problem is, if in a ideal fight you kill one million soldiers and lose none, you have some losses on weapons, tanks, planes and similars? Because if you dont have to replace anything it seems to me a bit unrealistic.
Aside from what @Vidkjaer said it is also important to mention that units also need to be in supply to be suffiently, well, supplied. If they are out of supply they wont be effectively resupplied and eventually will suffer heavy manpower attrition since they run out of food, water etc.
 
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Vidkjaer

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Aside from what @Vidkjaer said it is also important to mention that units also need to be in supply to be suffiently, well, supplied. If they are out of supply they wont be effectively resupplied and eventually will suffer heavy manpower attrition since they run out of food, water etc.

And this can be seen in the 4th video (Youtube) at time 54:50 where the battledialog is shown. Lets break it down.


Under the general picture for the german side there are 3 icons shown. A plane (green), a bunker and a 3-point attack. I believe this is
  • Plane - Air superiority (bonus)
  • Bunker - attacking a bunker (penalty)
  • 3-way attack (bonus)
On the French side there is only a red plane, which i believe indicates a penalty due to not having air superiority.
On the very top is the air war for this attack on this province. Since Germany has 19 planes (bombers and and fighters?) and France zero, Germany has air superiority. Damage in green and yellow i cant find out what this means. Maybe green damage is how much damage to the French troops bombers has dealt and the yellow damage is plane damage dealt from defending AA? Shot down is well, shot down planes on each side.

The front width is 60. One front is 40, so if Germany is attacking from 3 sides, each new front adds 10 frontage and a additional bonus for attacking on more fronts from the 3-way attack icon.

Germany has 2 infantry divisons, 1 tank division and 1 cavalry division. They eqaul a total frontage of 61. The french side eqauls 62.
Germanys 2 infantry divisions has 3 marks on it. I cant figure out number 1 and 3, but the number 2 is a red gascan, meaning they are not getting supply. The tank division also has a shield. Maybe that means it has an armor advantage over a defending division.
The french side also is on low supply (red gascan), surrounded (the red circle), and are dug in (the shovel).

The stats for each divison is a sword (softattack), Pincher? (hard attack) and a shield (breakthrough for attacking (Germany) and defense for defending (French)). These stats are not the divisions stats but the stats after bonus and penalties has been applied. So the German player is attacking a fort, with dugin defenders while having supply problems. This makes the stats go so low. they are apparently noneexisting. Furthermore we know from the video that Jacob was in deficit of weapons II. so maybe further on the infantry and cavalry divsision were i lack of weapons furthering lowering the stats.

Reserves are divisions that can enter combat when another divisions is pulled out. So assuming the reserves has enough weapons and are supplied - Jacob should have selected 1 division at a time and pullede them out of combat so a reseve division could enter combat - time to do this depends on the division stat that a signal company boosts.

Come to think about it.. Jacob has 16 reserve divisions. In HOI3 a lot of reserves resulted in a penalty. Maybe Jacob is having this penalty here also?
 
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Joebobpants

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, interesting how cavalry is not suffering supply issues.
Wonder if that's because it has just entered combat or because it's cavalry.
I remember reading this somewhere that when units are in a city they don't run out of supply nearly as fast, I think it's supposed to be a sort of "stockpile" in the the city that's trying to be simulated. Also and I know Victor Cortez didn't mention this but I belive thats also the reason those units held out for so long as it was a "siege" of the city.
 
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Vidkjaer

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I remember reading this somewhere that when units are in a city they don't run out of supply nearly as fast, I think it's supposed to be a sort of "stockpile" in the the city that's trying to be simulated. Also and I know Victor Cortez didn't mention this but I belive thats also the reason those units held out for so long as it was a "siege" of the city.

A city in it self generates supply. So basically a unit will never run completely out of supply, just not have enough if there are many divisions in the city province.
The reason why it took so long was that the german units had a very low effective stat. they are nearly zero. The result was a combat stalemate.
 
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Will Steel

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Regarding ammunution. It is modelled in the game that the resources it takes to produce a unit is included everything in its lifetime. Ammunition and fuel.

Ah, the classic issue of fairy dust.
 
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