[BUG.. or not?] Cities Skylines Traffic.. serious issues!!

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Zalym

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I did look at the original pictures. I don't have this problem except for one intersection due to improper planning and design.

Here's my one problem intersection:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408040244

The traffic coming off the freeway on the right of the image has two lanes that allow left turn movements, so at face value, it looks like a bug. However, the problem is that all that left turning traffic is making a U-Turn to get on the paralleling freeway to the right because I placed no connector for those movements. Therefore, the AI is making two immediate left turns movements to make the U Turn. The street in the middle has only one left turn lane, so presto, all that U-Turning traffic is pushed into one lane coming off the freeway. Same with the traffic going along the middle of the image. There's only one left turn lane, and the intersections close together are causing a back up. I literally have no other issues in my city except for this intersection.

Now, I'm not saying the conditions are completely realistic, but I certainly don't think it's a bug at all.

The AI is much better in CSL than CiM2 about using all lanes. I simply don't have this problem unless it's due to poor planning. It seems fairly simple to me, though I'm a Civil Engineering Major specializing transportation engineering. FYI, putting down a bunch of 6 lane highways everywhere =/= good planning.

Now, here's that same intersection after I rebuilt the interchange and eliminated all the U Turn traffic coming off the freeway:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408055581

Jesus, proper planning and design is F---ing magic in this game.

What you did should almost always be possible, and inefficient planning is likely the issue in a majority of cases of traffic problems.

But, your screenshots also show, what I think is, the underlying annoyance that is being categorized as a bug here as well. Your cross-street (going N/S in your first shot, and E/W in the second one) shows a long line of cars waiting to presumably turn left at that same intersection, as their lane ends there. Next to them, on their right, is a lane that travels through that intersection before also turning left to go under the highway. We know the assets pick their travel plan before they leave the house, so I think the big question is, "Why do more of those stacked up cars not choose to use the second option for turning left at that intersection?"

Certainly they can tell how many lanes turn left there when they set their plan. So why not have some plan to take the second lane and then change lanes later? There's no way every asset could have real-time decision making. But surely some sort of calculation could be performed during the planning stage to see how many cars are using that route and which lane they chose. Then they could pick the least busy lane. There's always going to be points of heavier traffic and no sim will ever be perfect. I'm not disagreeing that planning is vital. But surely there is some sort of problem (either unknown or unsolvable) if the AI is unwilling or unable to take an alternate, perhaps only marginally less efficient route, to head the same direction.
 

BStyles

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+1

Laying out roads efficiently is admirable in the bigger picture, but one can't help but notice that there are three turning lanes on a 6-lane two way, and the cars are merging to only use one, to create a one-lane line that backs up towards something important. We all know that this is not the case, since in normal cases, all three turning lanes are used and cars merge within the intersection, if necessary. Perhaps OP meant to say that it is a pathfinding issue rather than a traffic issue.
 

C40LFR

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What you did should almost always be possible, and inefficient planning is likely the issue in a majority of cases of traffic problems.

But, your screenshots also show, what I think is, the underlying annoyance that is being categorized as a bug here as well. Your cross-street (going N/S in your first shot, and E/W in the second one) shows a long line of cars waiting to presumably turn left at that same intersection, as their lane ends there. Next to them, on their right, is a lane that travels through that intersection before also turning left to go under the highway. We know the assets pick their travel plan before they leave the house, so I think the big question is, "Why do more of those stacked up cars not choose to use the second option for turning left at that intersection?"

Certainly they can tell how many lanes turn left there when they set their plan. So why not have some plan to take the second lane and then change lanes later? There's no way every asset could have real-time decision making. But surely some sort of calculation could be performed during the planning stage to see how many cars are using that route and which lane they chose. Then they could pick the least busy lane. There's always going to be points of heavier traffic and no sim will ever be perfect. I'm not disagreeing that planning is vital. But surely there is some sort of problem (either unknown or unsolvable) if the AI is unwilling or unable to take an alternate, perhaps only marginally less efficient route, to head the same direction.

Wrong. I just studied the movements through this intersection just now. I think I figured out what is happening:
Orange - Left turn movements through both intersections
Blue - Thru movements
Purple - Right Turns

Here is what's happening. When the road hits the first intersection, there is a dedicated right-turn. Therefore, to the game, the middle through-lane becomes the right-hand through lane through the 2nd intersection. Cars on the far left will happily use both left turn lanes equally on the 2nd intersection. Basically, to the game, and therefore the Cims, the middle through lane does not correspond to the middle lane movements in the 2nd intersection. While wonky, this makes sense as cars traveling on the thru movements each get unrestricted movements through both intersections while left and right turns each gain a dedicated lane. It seems to be the fact that due to close spacing of the intersection, there is simply not enough room for cars to pile up using both lanes at the 2nd intersection.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408133771

EDIT: Again, this shows the limitation of not being able to customize the through movements. Since right turning traffic is light, I would make the far right lane an option thru+right-turn lane, and make the left and middle lane both thru-only, which would fix the problem for the AI.
 
Last edited:

TehJumpingJawa

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Same with highways; most vehicles when joining a highway will immediately shift to the 3rd lane, then when approaching their exit, will shift back to the 1st lane - the 2nd lane remains completely unused by the vast majority of traffic.
I frequently see tailbacks in the 3rd lane stretching for 100s of car lengths , yet the 1st & 2nd lanes are practically empty.

This is probably my biggest gripe with the game at the moment, as it seriously hurts the meaningfulness of road layout design.
 

Person012345

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Now, here's that same intersection after I rebuilt the interchange and eliminated all the U Turn traffic coming off the freeway:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408055581

Jesus, proper planning and design is F---ing magic in this game.
Irrelevant. Again, no-one cares about workarounds, exploiting the game mechanics. Your road layout is specifically designed to work around the issue of the cars all lining up in one lane (or else you got incredibly lucky). Apart from the fact that we don't all want the exact same road layout in every city, we shouldn't have to work around poor AI. The issue in the first screenshot was probably going to happen even if the AI worked correctly, given that you said they were doing a U-turn right? But that's not the case in most cases. In most cases, there's absolutely no good reason from a logical standpoint for the cars to be lining up behind each other and a workaround is just that, a workaround for an issue.
 

C40LFR

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Irrelevant. Again, no-one cares about workarounds, exploiting the game mechanics. Your road layout is specifically designed to work around the issue of the cars all lining up in one lane. Apart from the fact that we don't all want the exact same road layout in every city, we shouldn't have to work around poor AI. The issue in the first screenshot was probably going to happen even if the AI worked correctly, given that you said they were doing a U-turn right? But that's not the case in most cases. In most cases, there's absolutely no good reason from a logical standpoint for the cars to be lining up behind each other and a workaround is just that, a workaround for an issue.

I'm confused by your statements. First you call my fix work around for poor AI, but then you go on to admit that this would have happened with perfectly functioning AI. All I did was build a flyover connector, so that traffic coming the from right from the freeway can switch highways without needing to make a U-Turn. Is it workaround for poor AI or legitimately fix to a real problem, pick one.

If all of you think i'm of full of $hit, here is my save:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408147969

Knock yourself out, and take note. If by "workaround", you mean proper design, then okay. I've already debunked the ONE example of single-lane use in my city in my previous posts.
 
Last edited:

Leermeister

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813536.jpg
 

C40LFR

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I know LOL

I really don't get why this is such a big drama scene. Yes, we all want unique layouts to make our cities unique, but for some reason everyone thinks their layout should work perfectly with traffic. There are ways in real life to get around bad layout designs in a real city, but we simply don't have control over traffic signal timings, syncronization, loop detectors, non-modular road geometry to maximize space, and lane movements. With this limitation in mind, regardless of whether the AI works correctly or not, some designs are going to fail.
 

Leermeister

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I know LOL

I really don't get why this is such a big drama scene. Yes, we all want unique layouts to make our cities unique, but for some reason everyone thinks their layout should work perfectly with traffic. There are ways in real life to get around bad layout designs in a real city, but we simply don't have control over traffic signal timings, syncronization, loop detectors, non-modular road geometry to maximize space, and lane movements. With this limitation in mind, regardless of whether the AI works correctly or not, some designs are going to fail.

Yeah and now i feel that some are just purposely designing roads to do this so they can take a pic. I never really have seen this middle lane problem very much if at all.
Not even a big deal, it is a game and they will never drive like real humans or even close to them. I do see them using all lanes even when there is a middle lane. Sure someone will be in soon to throw a rock at my post for not being outraged at the traffic.
 

AmpsterMan

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I would hope at some point to have a bit more customization in road layouts. I want to be able to connect one way roads to avenues without having to make intersections (just want the connection on one side) be able to decide on left turn and right turn lanes, and slip roads so my highway ramps don't have too enter at like a 30° angle .
 

Inge Jones

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Hey, I wouldn't even mind if it were explicitly stated in advance how traffic was going to work, because I would have been able to save my friend some money by not putting the game on my wishlist.

To be fair, we saw it on the previews, on the lets play videos etc. We were talking about it before release. It would have been time to cancel any preorders.
 

darkelf1000

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Hey everyone,
after reading this thread day after day it seems clear to me that there is somthing wrong.Not a big deal for some but for me it is. I want to play this sim knowing there is no underlying problems with ai, mechanics, pathfinding etc. Add-ons can come months down the road if need be.
Some say that if people want to exploit the game then thats up to them.....yes maybe, but for me there should NOT be anyway to exploit/cheat/break the game. Even knowing that there are exploits makes it sad with this type of game for me.
And destroying parks to get back commercial demand (as stated in other thread)....what?.......thats stupid.
anyway, am hoping we get some feedback, as i have not seen any comments from CO this weekend yet...unless i have missed them.
 

magitsu

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Hey everyone,
after reading this thread day after day it seems clear to me that there is somthing wrong.Not a big deal for some but for me it is. I want to play this sim knowing there is no underlying problems with ai, mechanics, pathfinding etc. Add-ons can come months down the road if need be.
Some say that if people want to exploit the game then thats up to them.....yes maybe, but for me there should NOT be anyway to exploit/cheat/break the game. Even knowing that there are exploits makes it sad with this type of game for me.
And destroying parks to get back commercial demand (as stated in other thread)....what?.......thats stupid.
anyway, am hoping we get some feedback, as i have not seen any comments from CO this weekend yet...unless i have missed them.

There will always be some exploits because there's just so many systems in place. Some people go to great lengths to find them. I agree that this current one should be patched out immediately as it's too unrealistic.
But give it time. The game is not even a week old... they are currently swimming in bug reports and frantically trying to select which should be first to squash.

why, i work at the weekends, and it was all go before launch...
They can't work 24/7 for 7 days a week because there are strict labour laws in place. They get terrible fines if they go overboard with overtime hours. It's not even healthy. Generally they manage to do with very little overtime, which goes to say that they are actually quite good at management. People need to be at their best for the long haul.

But believe me, they are still looking at the forums with the corner of their eyes right now... even though they probably shouldn't.
 

Agent cooper

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What is the point of having 3 way roads when traffic only stick to one of the lanes? There isn't and that's the problem.

Here exactly is the problem hidden. If you only have two roads going off, you should NOT use a 3-lane road. 3 lane roads is only usefull if you have roads going off left AND straight AND right. If you only have roads going off left and right use a 2 lane or 4 lane road! The cars need to be forced to decide for a lane. As long as you dont force them, they will use the lane that is leaving them every option (which is the middle lane if there is only two roads going off). That is exactly the problem the OP had in his screenshots. The middle lane you see there allows the cars to turn left AND right. Of course you could say the cars should go left or right according to which way they want to go, but then the middle lane would stay empty.
So, to summarize: If you have only two ways going off, take a road with an even number of lanes. If you have three was going off, use a road with an uneven number of lanes.

Easy as that.
And stop comparing real life traffic with in-game traffic. There is a huge difference and that is speed! In real life every individual car has an individual speed. In C:S every car has the same speed.
 

Person012345

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I know LOL

I really don't get why this is such a big drama scene. Yes, we all want unique layouts to make our cities unique, but for some reason everyone thinks their layout should work perfectly with traffic.
No no no. We think that the traffic should utilise our layout the best it can, not sub optimally. If it's a legitimately bad layout then it'll still be blocked even if cars behave naturally.
 

Person012345

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I'm confused by your statements. First you call my fix work around for poor AI, but then you go on to admit that this would have happened with perfectly functioning AI. All I did was build a flyover connector, so that traffic coming the from right from the freeway can switch highways without needing to make a U-Turn. Is it workaround for poor AI or legitimately fix to a real problem, pick one.

If all of you think i'm of full of $hit, here is my save:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=408147969

Knock yourself out, and take note. If by "workaround", you mean proper design, then okay. I've already debunked the ONE example of single-lane use in my city in my previous posts.
I called your overall road layout a workaround. The fact that they were u-turning was quite a specific problem that no-one else cares about because it's not relevant to them.

By workaround, I mean "proper design" based on a knowledge of the game mechanics and not a knowledge of real life or obvious solutions.
 

Emre Yigit

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I'm not going to join the discussion about the quality of the traffic AI anymore. I'll just leave this screenshot in here for people who want to fix their traffic problems instead of / before waiting for a change in the AI behavior. Here's how the AI works, and how you can use this to your advantage (works on a smaller scale as well).;

F8eKjp5.jpg

Thanks, this is very helpful.