Boycott Paradox interactive games!

[loup99]

Yes, some people are unhappy: it is a private company, there will always be. But always claiming that the unhappy ones are the silent majority is to me at least, wrong. In fact, most happy people don't post or comment. The forum has a higher concentratrion of unhappy posts because it is oftenly when you have issues/want an improvement/is unhappy that you post/want help. So I wuld rather claim the countrary.

 

[wolffrnd]

Just you wait until 'The Rise and Lack of Fall of the Wizonian Empire' comes out!

Dang, I think I just found the name of the next Custom Nation that I make! Wizonian Empire has a certain ring to it, don't you think?

 

[TiranDiaz]

First, I never meant my point about this topic, it was about something else. It does not involve you so nvm.
Second, it also strengthens my point, since insulting is like admitting failure to win an argument in an other way.

Frankly I am tired of this thread for now. If there is much activity or a post deserving an answer I will return, otherwise thats it from me folks. I have said what I needed to say, let everyone make their own decision. But if you continue to defend such practicies, dont be surprised if they keep doing it.

Cheers.

Given that the person you were replying to had made no other posts in the thread, I'm not sure what point or to whom you think you were addressing.

No, insulting is not like admitting to failure to win an argument. True, some people do it when they have no argument rather than concede, but your logic is also a fallacy, since it assumes that anything that does not counter an argument must support it, whereas a statement can do neither.

The only point is strengthens would be "people can't respond to my arguments without insulting me", which is hardly a useful point to any argument.

 

[kitemasaki]

Rage posts give me trash reading options besides TMZ and The Enquirer. Filled with the same amount of inaccuracies, assumptions, grammar murder and defamation in spite of given facts!

If only this could have been in vid format!

 

[Soranya]

I somehow have the feeling i shoud know who or what TMZ and The Enquirer are...

Judging by the Ratings on Steam moving (manual) Development to the DLC Features while at the same time changing the Buildingsystem in such a drastic way and then interlinking them wasn't the best decision of PD when it comes to Customer Satisfication.

 

[Woifee]

Do I really have to read hours of forumposts before downloading a patch?

At least read the patch notes or set it back to previous patch.

It's not that hard.

 

[Xinkc]

Again, if they had done this as a demo expansion, then I would have been even grateful. BUT they bundled it in the patch without a warning and that is manipulatory advertising. You know it and I know it, and paradox damn sure knew it.


EDIT: alternativeley this should have been a patch for only these who own the expansion. Thats they way they used to do it, thats the right way to do it!

As a child of the 90s I like this type of change to a degree. Also, I hope you realize that technically the patch has the code for all DLC features in it by default. It's why you can play with people with different DLCs and any DLC in multi-player so long as the host has it. The alternative involves maintaining numerous servers dedicated to certain builds which can be painful.

Ohh but you do.. while you dont link to the steampage you do have a nice little lock button that says that the new slot will unlock at developement lvl 10, lvl 20 etc. things you can not raise without a dlc.

In single-player there are events that raise development components. You can also raise development by playing a multi-player game where the host has Common Sense.

That I can agree with, to some degree. And yes maybe the problem is that I am someone who started gaming in the late 90s, when a game was a game and an expansion an expansion. But it sill does not change that paradox too have dipped into it. The fact that all others are doing it does not change enough.

The old method kind of sucked. As a child of the nineties who has been playing video games for over 20 years, I like updates. Also, as someone who somewhat understands programming and is proficient in a few languages this seems like a better method. However, I will admit that I dislike the revamp/replacement of core systems in a game as a matter of principle. I just dislike relearning things. Also, I still disagree with how development and buildings were changed but that's something I've explained back when Common Sense was coming out and afterwards.

The main point is, this is a public (though privatly owned) forum and as such the public has the right (maybe not the 100% legal, but at least the moral) to say their oppinion, so long as basics of human conduct are obseved, which I believe I am doing. Though I believe that some of the comments towards me, were not always so ...polite... I am doing my best not to follow suit and to remain rational.

I have an opinion and I have said it. If you guys dont agreee, then that is your choise, but why judge me for sying mine?

I don't think you understand free speech and expression well. You can say your piece, your opinion, as you want to as free speech is philosophically considered a basic human right. However, having that right does not stop others from using their basic human right of free speech and expression to criticize, judge, and react to what you say. Don't feel bad though. Plenty of people don't.

As for the legal right, others have explained it.

 

[Ravagers Prey]

Hi everyone. I am not sure how long this post will last here and if and when I will be banned for this. Lets face it, free speach is the latest casulty of cour once great civilisation.

But I can not just sit idly by and not expres my thoughts.

As you can all see from my "badges" I have been a faithful costumer of paradox for nearly 10 years now. I have bought many of their games, many of their expansions and as you can see from my posts if you care, I have defended them even during the Hoi3 release.

But this as they say is the needle that broke the camels back. To release a patch that is nothing but a hidden advertisment for a dlc is basiclly EA tactics at its finest. Its like dragon age with that campfire dudes trying to give you a quest. But this is even worse since now you can no longer build everything anymore.

For these of you who are saying that this is basically giving you half a dlc for free... well NO!. This is maipulatory advertisement. If they wanted to be customer friendly they would have released a demo version of their expansion that you could have download and tested for free. The difference between these two methods would have been that you would have known that you get a demo.

THAT IS A BIG DIFFERENCE. I dont know if you guys know this or not, but for example the big channles on youtube etc. are REQUIRED BY LAW to make it clear when they are sponsored by companies. This is because the customer must know if somehting could be an advertisement. Because, BY LAW!, advertisement that is not labled as such is not allowed. Just cause the big (un)hollywood companies do it, does not mean its allowed.

This patch is manipulatory advertisement at its finest and a disgrace for a once great company.

I will never buy any of your games again paradox and I hope many here will follow me.

I believe those adds you are speaking of are your casus belli's running out, you can't play the game without them. Paradox you monsters!

 

[FleetingRain]

Why are we talking about 1st Amendment and such if Paradox is Swedish...

 

[Ultrix Prime]

He's talking about the DLC-hocking NPC that would appear in your game and offer you a quest if you'd just swipe your credit card here, please. The equivalent would be us having expansion-only feature buttons show up in the game but only take you to the steam store if clicked. Something we're obviously never going to do.

Actually it would be a lot nicer and easier if there was a "unit pack X" available tool tip that would allow purchases from steam that would inject the unit skins into the game without having to restart. An example would be skins in Dota2 where one can buy a skin during the hero selection period.

The current approach of having to read through six million DLCs to find particular ones is more than a bit cumbersome.

Further if you moved to a micro transaction model to buy premium and regular features for say 8.99 for one kind that's high value versus some number for a more flavor oriented feature it would give you more money while giving the player better control over customuzation.


In particular when a feature is known to be bugged I'd like to avoid that one and just buy all the ones that arent. Using a micro transaction model the DLC bundles sold in pieces could easily cost twice the full DLC but would allow just picking the features, skin and music (music demos of clips for instance) to select as the player plays.

In particular I would happily pay for a built in music player that would play local music and also plat streams from Pandora in game. When I run Pandora outside the game to listen inside the game i have to twiddle with audio settings so they don't clash for battle sounds for instance.

PI should make money and imo the issue is efficiency rather than number of traders/dlcs.

 

[Noel84]

Well, EUIV is running one right now!

Shouldn't it be a 30/0/30?

 

[Mauer]

Why can't we view who Agrees and Disagrees with posts anymore, I'm really curious about the OP.

 

[Le-Colonel]

On your 'legal action' claims: absolute bullshit.

If I ran a forum (let's say alternatehistory.com, for instance), then I could make and enforce any rules that were stated. If you violate those rules, then it is not harassment to have you banned for blocked from posting or viewing the forum.

Wiz and all the other staff could violate those rules as much as they want, but if they did, then who would be here?

Let's give an example back to my hypothetical forum: I could make a forum dedicated to praising Hitler, and it would be totally legal (at least in the U.S.).

If I did, then no one would be there.

TL;DR The legal action claim is practically equivalent to Donald Trump suing Reddit for saying he f**ked a goat. There's no proof, it's trivial, and no sane person in their right mind would waste their time viewing a suit about some guy complaining that a video game company was violating his free speech, when in fact, they were enforcing their own rules.

 

[Axe99]

Hi everyone. I am not sure how long this post will last here and if and when I will be banned for this. Lets face it, free speach is the latest casulty of cour once great civilisation.

But I can not just sit idly by and not expres my thoughts.

As you can all see from my "badges" I have been a faithful costumer of paradox for nearly 10 years now. I have bought many of their games, many of their expansions and as you can see from my posts if you care, I have defended them even during the Hoi3 release.

But this as they say is the needle that broke the camels back. To release a patch that is nothing but a hidden advertisment for a dlc is basiclly EA tactics at its finest. Its like dragon age with that campfire dudes trying to give you a quest. But this is even worse since now you can no longer build everything anymore.

I haven't read the whole thread (13 pages!), but I'm confused as to why, if you were happy with the model in HoI3, Vicky 2 and the like, why the development issue is an issue. Under the old system, for new patches (at all), you needed the new expansions. No choice at all, if you want something new at all, you have to pay up. Under the new model, even if you don't get the DLC, you get patches, as well as some new features, and if you want, you can choose to get the features in the DLC. You can also choose to only play a version of the game pre-DLC (1.11.2 on Steam I think) which would, in effect, be the same as playing HoI3 or Vicky 2 without their latest expansions.

In effect, the logical position you've taken is "Paradox are giving me more content and more freedom over how to consume it, and it's a bad thing". Were we to go back to the old model that you say you supported, then everything in 1.12 and 1.13 would have been behind a paywall, and there'd be no patch and no new features at all for non-paying customers - and you think this was better?

 

[BarrosRodrigues]

In which way are vassals shady?

You left the misinterpretation door wide open by greatly increasing vassal liberty desire IIRC in 1.10 and making its effects worse in 1.12 at the same time that you putt the most effective antidote (well at least for the average player) behind a pay wall. In short you created a big problem that was non-existent or negligible in previous versions of the game and shortly after/at the same time you delivered an effective fix that can only be used by DLC owners.

 

[Xaster]

Why can't we view who Agrees and Disagrees with posts anymore, I'm really curious about the OP.

I was asking the same thing to myself... now we cannot make friend and enemies...

 

[gdj]

On your 'legal action' claims: absolute bullshit.

If I ran a forum (let's say alternatehistory.com, for instance), then I could make and enforce any rules that were stated. If you violate those rules, then it is not harassment to have you banned for blocked from posting or viewing the forum.

Wiz and all the other staff could violate those rules as much as they want, but if they did, then who would be here?

Let's give an example back to my hypothetical forum: I could make a forum dedicated to praising Hitler, and it would be totally legal (at least in the U.S.).

If I did, then no one would be there.

TL;DR The legal action claim is practically equivalent to Donald Trump suing Reddit for saying he f**ked a goat. There's no proof, it's trivial, and no sane person in their right mind would waste their time viewing a suit about some guy complaining that a video game company was violating his free speech, when in fact, they were enforcing their own rules.

Well its not that simple.

A forum dedicated to the praise of Hitler would be illegal in quite a number of states.

Also, a forum dedicated, for example, for a call of violent action against specific persons or institutions could cause legal action.

But thats a bit offtopic, nevermind.

 

[Le-Colonel]

Well its not that simple.

A forum dedicated to the praise of Hitler would be illegal in quite a number of states.

Also, a forum dedicated, for example, for a call of violent action against specific persons or institutions could cause legal action.

But thats a bit offtopic, nevermind.

Fair point.

My point, however, was to illustrate that calling 'free speech' against a game studio, is a pile of crap if the studio in question is enforcing their own rules.

 

[gdj]

Fair point.

My point, however, was to illustrate that calling 'free speech' against a game studio, is a pile of crap if the studio in question is enforcing their own rules.

Yes, of course. I guess noone here would contest that

 

[Ultrix Prime]

They should move to an in game purchase model like others have done rather than away from it imo. I laid out some of the features that would be nice above. Some others that come to mind are having an in game fall customization feature in regular iron man as well as country colors. Some like me would want to buy this on the spot. I can think of a lot of watts having in game purchasing via steam wallet would improve the game greatly.

The current interface should be much more universal such that you never have to exit tla game run to improve it while you're playing short of a full new patch having arrived.