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LordTempest

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I third this motion.
Given that Tommy is always listening to what his readers are saying, what sorts of policies should this hypothetical Liberal Party espouse?
 

DensleyBlair

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Given that Tommy is always listening to what his readers are saying, what sorts of policies should this hypothetical Liberal Party espouse?
Whiggish principles of reform and classical liberalism, a respect for the free market and the sponsorship of an act making it illegal not to wear extravagant pantaloons on Thursdays.
 

LordTempest

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Whiggish principles of reform and classical liberalism, a respect for the free market and the sponsorship of an act making it illegal not to wear extravagant pantaloons on Thursdays.
How does that differ from the LVD exactly, aside from views on the Kulturkampf and (already well out of fashion) pantaloons?
 

DensleyBlair

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How does that differ from the LVD exactly, aside from views on the Kulturkampf and (already well out of fashion) pantaloons?
No idea. I'm not the one demanding a new party. :p I happy with the LVP (well, as happy as one can be with an admittedly flawed poltical party...)
 

Duke of Awesome

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Well, classical liberals would probably be antimilitary, support repeal of the anti-socialist laws, no kulturkampf, no colonies, I guess would support Greater Germany? I'm not sure. I don't think we need another liberal party. I think we have a good mix so far with a conservative party, a liberal party, a socialist party, and a surrogate socialist party to try to get around the anti-socialist laws.
 

Gen. Marshall

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The problem with the current Liberal party, in my opinion, is that they are

1) Atheist instead of Secularist
2) Supporting Residency instead of Full Citizenship
3) Jingoist instead of Pro-Military
4) Completely unwilling to enact social reform

...which makes them all too radical.
 

Terraferma

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The problem with the current Liberal party, in my opinion, is that they are

1) Atheist instead of Secularist
2) Supporting Residency instead of Full Citizenship
3) Jingoist instead of Pro-Military
4) Completely unwilling to enact social reform

...which makes them all too radical.
Yeah their overly hawkish stance has been the reason why I haven't vote for them but your listing of its flaws hits it right on the head for me. And to the previous comment above, no the DZP is not the surrogate socialist party it is a Centrist party that generally speaking has a balanced approach with a blend of christian democracy if I am not mistaken.
 

deoved

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Friends, we must strive to the complete unification of the German people! Vote for the party that supports Grossdeutschland!
Only that, nothing less!
 

Duke of Awesome

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The problem with the current Liberal party, in my opinion, is that they are

1) Atheist instead of Secularist
2) Supporting Residency instead of Full Citizenship
3) Jingoist instead of Pro-Military
4) Completely unwilling to enact social reform

...which makes them all too radical.
I wouldn't say they're atheist, just secular to an extreme. The DFP was atheist though, no doubt about that. The Kulturkampf is another thing that I've never been stellar about with the liberals. It seems more like a fascist or communist thing to do than liberal. Their war policy never bothered me and thank God they are against social reform.
 

DensleyBlair

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I must say, I do agree that the Kulturkampf does unnerve me, slightly. It certainly seems very odd to have its most enthusiastic backers be the 'liberals'...
 

Khalep

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And to the previous comment above, no the DZP is not the surrogate socialist party it is a Centrist party that generally speaking has a balanced approach with a blend of christian democracy if I am not mistaken.
You are not mistaken at all. In fact, you are quite right about it! :)
 

LordTempest

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You are not mistaken at all. In fact, you are quite right about it! :)
The problem with Zentrum has nothing to do with the party and everything to do with those who are trying to take over the party!

Oh and Gen. M, in Vicky, "atheism" and secularism go hand in hand. Atheist parties support complete separation of church from state whereas secularised parties "tip the hat" towards the majority religion (ie. Lutheranism)
 

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Friends, we must strive to the complete unification of the German people! Vote for the party that supports Grossdeutschland!
Only then can Germany rest.
 

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The Election of 1883

With tentative talk of a unification of Greater Germany entering the political scene in the aftermath of the Austrian War to build upon conflicts over the continuation of the Anti-Socialist Laws and over the future direction of the German economy 1883 was set to be another contentious election.

German Conservative Reich Party (Deutschekonservative Reichspartei)
- DKRP



Political Position: Right

Ideology: Conservatism

Party Leader: Otto von Bismarck

Germany’s most experienced politician was growing beginning to age badly just as political forces within his own DKRP formation began to rise in opposition to him for the first time. Yet, the Iron Chancellor maintains a strong grip on power.

Description:

Having struggled electorally since unification German Conservatism received a major boost from its electoral triumph in 1878 and subsequent minority government (the first time Germany had not been governed by coalition government). Sadly for the party, its greatest triumph – the military defeat of Austria-Hungary – strongly weakened the party’s unity and left it at odds with the surge of popular opinion (especially prevalent in the South) in favour of unification.

The Fate of Austria:

Austria remains a sovereign nation, the annexation of Austria (and it would be a forceful annexation, not the popular unification of the imagination) would be undesirable for the German Empire for internally and externally. Internally any annexation would bring with it a swathe of Slavic and Italian minorities totally opposed to the existence of a German nation and permanently at odds with the government in Berlin. Moreover Germany would become a majority Catholic nation in which the power of the Catholic Church would be greatly enhanced. Externally unification would leave Germany totally alienated and isolated from the rest of the world – even our loyal Italian allies would be set against us, the presence of large Italian communities in the Tyrol and Pola Peninsula ensuring enmity between our nations. Annexation of Austria would be a catastrophe for Germany.

In the event of a German annexation of Austria a section of the Reichstag proportional to population would be permanently set aside for ethnic minority parties

Foreign Policy:

The newly reduced Austrian Empire can be brought under German dominion from without, the decline of Habsburg power has opened up all of Central Europe to potential German influence. The opportunity for universal German monarchy and the end to all European wars has now presented itself. German diplomatic, military and economic power on the European continent has made this a possibility, the abandonment of any of these advantages (especially our diplomatic position) would bring back the threat of war to the continent – this cannot be allowed.

Overseas Germany must remain firm in her dispute with Italy over Somalia but pursue no further colonial acquisitions. Germany demanded an Empire and now she has it.

Economic Policy:

The present economic course has protected Germany from the horrors of international economic downturn. One must only look at the mass unemployment and low growth rates in Britain and even America to realise that the situation could be far worse. As the international situation improves so too will the fiscal situation in Germany itself. We cannot allow the collapse of our existing industrial base, not at any cost – doing so would risk social collapse!

Reform Policy:

With the recent programme of reforms instituted by this government there is no further need for an expansion of the social safety net. The decline in the strength of the SPD in the previous election makes clear that the Anti-Socialist Laws are working – the reforms of the past five years will have only strangled their support further. With the security they have long desired the working class are turning away in their droves from the hateful ideology of the Marxists. Soon Germany shall be free of this Socialist menace once and for all!

German Centre Party (Deutsche Zentrumspartei)
- DZP or Centre/Centre Party



Political Position: Centre

Ideology: Christian Democracy / Political Catholicism

Party Leader: Ludwig Windthorst

Having led the Centre to nation prominence and even into government Windthorst had emerged as one of Germany’s leading statesmen. Respected even by his opponents Windthorst’s security at the head of his party lays in stark contrast to the more troubled situations of his Liberal and Conservative opponents.

Description:

The drift of the Conservatives ever closer to the Liberals whilst in government had been troubling for the Centre Party. The outbreak of war with Austria-Hungary had then brought the DZP to the brink of mutiny the outcome of the war left the Party with an unexpected galvanising opportunity. In the wake of the defeat a significant movement had emerged in Austria itself demanded unification with the German Empire and looking towards the Centre Party for support and leadership. With masses on either side of the border caught in a wave of enthusiasm for unification the Centre is hopeful of being swept once more into power.

The Fate of Austria:

The war with our brother Germans in Austria was most unfortunate, many thousands of Germans died on both sides in needless conflict. However, the fall from grace of the Habsburg Empire has presented the German people with an unexpected opportunity – the chance for the final march to unification!

In coordination with the movement in Austria, Germany must wholeheartedly support unification. At the earliest possible opportunity all areas of the Austrian with a substantial German population must be brought into the German Empire – areas without a substantial population (Galicia, Dalmatia etc) should be granted independence under German tutelage. The Czechs, Slovenes and Italians who have for centuries lived alongside their brother Germans must be granted the full rights and privileges that go to German citizens and shall not be discriminated against in any way shape or form.

In the event of a German annexation of Austria a section of the Reichstag proportional to population would be permanently set aside for ethnic minority parties

Foreign Policy:

Germany must pursue a policy of friendship with the peoples of Central Europe. The fall of the Habsburg Empire has opened up all of Central Europe to German friendship, combined with the maintenance of existing friendships with the Italians, Russians, Dutch, Belgians, Danes and Swedes shall ensure peace in Europe for perpetuity.

In the question of the Ottoman Empire, Germany should side with the Christian peoples of the Balkans against the continued oppression meted out against them by the Muslim Turk. Freedom for the Balkan peoples shall greatly enhance the stability of Europe.

Overseas Germany should pursue a peaceful conclusion to the dispute over Somalia – with the territory being under German suzerainty. However we cannot risk war over the territory.

Economic Policy:

A central course between the laissez faire suicide of the Liberals and the reactionary protectionism of the Conservatives must be sought. Protectionism has harmed German industry, not benefited it – the Centre Party supports the removal of all tariffs on imported goods. The worst performing industries may have their subsidies removed – but only in regions in which those employed in these industries might have access to work in new or strongly performing industries. State support for entrepreneurial investment in new industries may be of great benefit in this regard.

Overly high military spending (which rapidly increased during Bismarck’s most recent administration) must be reduced – this will play a major role in easing the fiscal problems of the German state, and reducing the tax burden on the population. Moreover the Centre party advising the pursuit of a regressive tax regime that shall allow for the most able to pay the largest contribution to the state.

Reform Policy:

The overtly oppressive Anti-Socialist Laws must be removed. Violence begets violence; the continued implantation of these laws shall inevitably lead the Socialist movement towards a violent reaction that shall cause great anguish across German society. Let the Socialists be forced into their open where their ideas shall be revealed for their inherent weakness.

The Centre Party continues to support further social reforms so that the tensions between the classes might be eased and German society might grow more peaceful and happy. The DZP therefore calls for a 14 hour working day and further improvements to safety regulations in places of work.

The Centre Party calls for ‘Excellent Safety Regulations’ and ’14 Hour Work Day’.

Liberal Union of Germany (Liberale Vereinigung Deutschlands)
- LVD



Political Position: Centre-Right

Ideology: Liberalism

Party Leader: Max von Forchenbeck

The LVD’s poor electoral performance in 1878, further built upon by the inability of the party to wholly separate the Conservatives from cooperation with the Centre during the subsequent years had brought the Party’s experienced leader under fire. Worse still both the National and Classical Liberal wings of the party were almost coming to blows. Only Forchenbeck’s promises of keeping the Liberal alliance alive and bringing them back to power kept his leadership in place.

Description:

Unity had produced anything but the bolstering effect the Liberals had hoped. Instead of push them into an absolute majority their vote had fallen drastically and they had been forced to back a Conservative government in which they had little to no say in order to keep the Centre out of government. Although united on their economic policy and to an extent on the issues of reform and general foreign policy the LVD was being ripped apart over the supporters and opponents of unification with Austria.

The Fate of Austria:

The LVD neither advocates nor opposed German unification. Should the government of Austria petition Germany for unification a plebiscite shall be held on both sides of the border – only if the plebiscite receives a majority of votes in both the German Empire and Austria shall unification be allowed to take place.

In the event of a German annexation of Austria a section of the Reichstag proportional to population would be permanently set aside for ethnic minority parties

Foreign Policy:

Germany has proven herself the most powerful nation on earth. Her economy and her army are second to none, the respect she assumes across the continents exceeds even the British. Having assured her domination of Central Europe for the foreseeable future Germany must exert her hegemonic power. The navy must receive unlimited funding for expansion so that Germany might compete with and overtake Britain and France for naval power – and Germany’s links to her colonial Empire be strengthened.
In the colonies Germany cannot accept to defeat of her influence in Ethiopia - the Ethiopians must be brought to heel by force of arms if necessary. A second rate Great Power such of Italy, especially one so beholden to Germany, cannot be allowed to oppose German power in Somalia. If the Italians refuse to leave they shall be made to. The German Empire is not done expanding.

Economic Policy:

A decade of economic mismanagement, first by the Centre and later by the Conservatives has seen the German economy grow bloated and sick. Unprofitable industries rely upon huge industrial subsidies to remain operational whilst the economy, and people’s livelihoods, are choked by crushing levels of taxation. All subsidies must be lifted and taxes radically reduced – especially upon the entrepreneurial class whose investments in new, and profitable industries shall revive the German economy from stagnation and destruction – maintaining her as a modern industrial superpower. The sorry head of protectionism has haunted the German economy for the past five years – tariffs seeing prices rise harming industry and individuals with equal force. Let all tariffs on imported goods be abolished.

Reform Policy:

Germany cannot, and must not swerve from her devotion to the war against the Socialist menace. The Anti-Socialist Laws must therefore remain in place indefinitely. Should we grant an inch to the Socialists they shall take a mile. Every concession, every soft policy allows their movement to poison the minds of our people and our society with their presence. The Liberals shall not relent!

Social reforms are harmful for both economic and ideological reasons. Economically they stifle the freedom of industry to develop at a time when German industrialists need support more than ever. Ideologically they are a concession to the Socialists, and therefore abhorrent.

Social Democratic Party of Germany (Sozialdemokratische Partei Deutschlands)
- SPD



NOTE – all votes placed in this election for the SPD will count as ½ of a vote due to the Anti-Socialist Laws

Political Position: Far Left

Ideology: Socialism

Party Leader: August Bebel

Bebel has benefited from the shield of his prominent position in the Reichstag to avoid arrest, however many of his fellow Socialists have already fallen foul of the Anti-Socialist Laws. Despite the difficulties of operating Bebel has maintained a constant stance of opposition to the state policies of repression, as well as the growing voices in his own party for a militant turn.

Description:

The 1870s had been a hard time to be a follower of the SPD, and the 1880s offered no hope for relenting. Thousands of members had spent at least some time imprisoned whilst the support for the Party had dropped like a stone between 1873 and 1878. With the membership suffering a decline violent and anarchistic elements have been trying, thus far in vein, to seize control of the party. Should the party’s influence decline yet further there is a strong possibility the Party might fall to those who do not desire a mass party but a violent, clandestine organisation.

The Fate of Austria:

The SPD supports the self determination of nations and shall therefore embrace the unification of any German majority parts of Austria in which the population calls for unification. Areas in which non-Germans are the majority shall be given independence and mixed areas (notably Bohemia and Moravia) should be granted referenda on whether they desire independence or unification with Germany.

In the event of a German annexation of Austria a section of the Reichstag proportional to population would be permanently set aside for ethnic minority parties

Foreign Policy:

In foreign affairs Germany must remain committed to peace. The countless wars of the past two decades have young men in their tens, even hundreds, of thousands perish. No longer! Germany shall maintain a foreign policy committed to the protection of her sovereignty – but above all the avoidance of future conflict.

In the colonies Germany must avoid conflict over these foreign possessions at all costs. To go to war over Somalia or Ethiopia would be foolish and costly.

Economic Policy:

The SPD remains true to the pledges of its manifesto:

"The capitalist economic system that grows to dominate Germany and the world ever more each day is on of extreme exploitation and poverty – but also opportunity. Never before have the productive forces of Germany been so advanced, never before has this nation had the ability to provide good living conditions for its entire people, but never before has she been so unequal.

Germany must institute a heavily progressive tax regime in which the wealthiest sections of society provide significantly more than the poorest. The state may take control of mismanaged industries to ensure that people do not go out of work.

Our ultimate goal is the destruction of the iron law of wages by doing away with the system of wage labour, to abolish exploitation of every kind, and to extinguish all social and political inequality."

Reform Policy:

The SPD continues to remain true to the pledges made in its updates manifesto on reform:


"Let us create a free and socialist society.

We call for universal suffrage at all levels of government – from the local Landtags of the individual states (where weighted suffrage is presently the norm) upwards. We call for total freedom of association and of speech and the right to freely organise in unions. The oppressive Kulturkampf must be brought to an immediate end, relieving Catholic and minority communities from Prussian tyranny. Likewise, the Anti-Socialist Laws should be totally overturned.

We also call for a 12 hour day, improved safety regulations in the work place, improvements to healthcare provisions, improved pension allowances and a higher minimum wage.


A ’12 Hour Working Day’, ‘Excellent Safety Regulations’, ‘Acceptable Health Care’, ‘Acceptable Pensions’ and an ‘Acceptable Minimum Wage’.
"

All reader must either vote for:

DZP

LVD

DKRP

SPD

NOTE – All votes for the SPD count as ½ a vote due to the Anti-Socialist Laws

! You may write the full name, shortened name or the German name of any party, so long as it is clear to me who you are voting for !

Please place your vote in a separate post or bold it within your post so it is easier for me to keep a tally.

Once again, spamming is not tolerated, you may not campaign outside this thread and I ask that you remain civil with each other.

Voting will close on Monday at 10 AM, I will post in this thread to officially close the polls and return with the results shortly later.
 

Konnigratz

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I'll place my vote for the LVD this time. The DKRP's position over Austria makes them unappealing, and the DZP's desire to butcher the Ottoman Empire and let chaos run rampant in the Balkans also makes them unelectable.
 

LordTempest

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I dislike - and always have disliked - the thought of Germans fighting other Germans on the battlefield unnecessarily. Therefore, I find the democratic approach issued by the LVD savoury and the forceful and undemocratic position offered by Bismarck unsavoury, and vote LVD accordingly.
 

LordTempest

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I'll place my vote for the LVD this time. The DKRP's position over Austria makes them unappealing, and the DZP's desire to butcher the Ottoman Empire and let chaos run rampant in the Balkans also makes them unelectable.
EDIT: Ah, no wonder I was shocked by it - I mistook the DKRP policy on Austria for that of another party! Nevermind... :blush:
 
Last edited:

unmerged(211960)

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If it were not for their unification policy, I would vote for the DZP, alas, it is not so.


I reluctantly vote for the DKRP.