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Jerev

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Once again: this thread will discuss the end and will contain major spoilers.

So we became an Archon and defied Kyros just like that.
What I hope someone could explain to me is:
- why could we issue an edict against Kyros but she didn't issue one against us? It was stated before that ours were weaker.
- if we got the ability to cast edicts from the spires could it be that Kyros got it the same way?
- if Kyros can cast edicts because of spires and according to Lantry or the helpful letter writing fatebinder there are 40-50 more spires in Terratus : again how could we defy Kyros or why didn't she stop us earlier?
- it is implied that Kyros let us do what we did. So it was her plan to let an upstart become powerful enough to rebel?

Maybe I miss something. Perhaps you can shine a light on the game's story for me.
 

Battican

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Again major spoilers....



You defy Kyros no matter what, not just on Anarchy. The game forces you to.

- Kyros doesn't (immediately) retaliate because, as you surmised, your actions are somehow predicted/accepted, even if you join the Rebellion.
- We don't know for sure, but it's a good theory as to how Kyros commands Edicts.
- Again, Kyros doesn't stop you because, for whatever reason, he/she/it doesn't want to. At least not yet.
- Kyros planned on disposing of meddlesome Archons from the beginning. The Tiers are the last contested region on the continent. Without something to unify against, the Archons were likely to rebel and cause havoc anyway. Your presence was a convenient means to end, or at least diminish this possibility.

It remains to be seen if the PC will become powerful enough to truly outlive their usefulness. What I don't get is why Kyros would bother sending the Archon of Plagues (forget his name) and his army to stop you if he/she/it wanted all this to go down the way it does. Maybe as an empty gesture to let you know that you're officially on the sh*t list now?
 
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Jerev

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Right there was the hint that Kyros was maybe just disposing of troublesome Archons.
So in a sequel or Addon we maybe have to conquer enough spires before Kyros overwhelms us. But still the epilogue says that we really launched an edict against Kyros' capital. That can't have been part of a masterplan.....or the plan was to create an eternal rival against whom Kyros can unite her followers.
Anyway thanks for the fast reply.
 

wimplestiltskin

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That can't have been part of a masterplan.....or the plan was to create an eternal rival against whom Kyros can unite her followers.
If we assume that everything happens according to Kyros will, then we must assume that Kyros wants to create a rival on purpose, perhaps as a target for war and thus fame and power when Kyros defeats us. Or as a powerful and useful agent for a purpose we don;t yet know or understand.

If we assume that Kyros had a plan, but things got out of hand then we might see events play out as they have. Kyros sens a potential Archon to make a show of arbitrating between Nerat and Ashe, the potential Archon is given an edict to proclaim (to destroy Ashe and Nerat who will never co-operate, if the potential archons dies too, bonus! if they live, Bonus, new pawn) The potential Archon, pronounces edict... then resolves it.. okay, fine, Marks on the case, good chance one of the other Archons kills the potential Archon, carnage is certain and Kyros problems will go away. But, the potential Archon, gasp, taps into ancient power, smites all opposition and suddenly, Kyros cunning plan to do away with useless agents is starting to unravel! But hey it's fine, Marks on the case and just to make sure, promote potential archon to actual archon, declare Kyros peace suspended, everybody seeks to kill eachother, Kyros problems will go away.....
Only the now Actual Archon, with ancient power, comes out on top and Kyros isn't stupid, has the Plagueborn reformed and on standby... so send them in to deal with this Archon of Spires.... Kyros problems will be dealt with..... only new archon casts an EDICT! On the Capital! Kyros now thinks... might be best to recall the army and give this some thought, things have gone awry and I need to plan what to do next....

I'd prefer it if it was the former though!
 

Shinros

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Right there was the hint that Kyros was maybe just disposing of troublesome Archons.
So in a sequel or Addon we maybe have to conquer enough spires before Kyros overwhelms us. But still the epilogue says that we really launched an edict against Kyros' capital. That can't have been part of a masterplan.....or the plan was to create an eternal rival against whom Kyros can unite her followers.
Anyway thanks for the fast reply.

Yes that was the plan for ashe and nerat in the tiers kyros can't just kill them because outwardly both Archons "appear" loyal especially in nerats case according to mark.

PC: Why do you think the overlord is allowing the Archons to fight?

Belden Mark: Huh... I was expecting a dumber question. Kyros can sure appear fickle. Cairn was treacherous and vocal about it and gets an edict dropped on his head. The voices and Ashe openly bicker and kyros just watches.... If you don't know the overlord, it can all seem random and erratic.

Belden Mark: But I assure you, kyros is nothing if not deliberate. I would guess kyros has tired of the Archon of war and secrets - there is no need for both and so, why not let their natural lack of rapport solve itself by allowing the stronger to slay the weaker?

Everyone in the ending thread is pondering why kyros is doing this and for what reason.
 

Promethian

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In one of the letters the old fatebinder tells you she had a case of a peasant who made a shrine to Kyros at a spire. When the peasant said "Kyros was here in the year -50" (note: the year 0 was the start of Kyros conquest of the world) a fatebinder she was with that was even older than her immediately killed the peasant. This story is obviously meaningful and I think it tells us the spires are the key to Kyros power.

Another letter about edicts tells us that people who declare edicts tend to die young from the strain of channeling so much power. I think Kyros uses this to scout for people like our Fatebinder. When we declare the edict in the conquest Kyros sees that we don't suffer the negative effects so Kyros knew we had the potential to bond with a spire. The Edict of Execution was definitely designed to get us to bond with the spire.

Now the question is why go through all this trouble. Well notice how the spires in the tiers are unclaimed and have been left dormant for a long time. We know this because when I claimed Lethian's Crossing I remember some of the dialogue. Most notably how the spire was damaged by age and when we bonded it fired up a self repair magic. The thing that stands out to me is why wouldn't Kyros have claimed this spire? We know Kyros is much older than the empire. Assuming Kyros is at the least as smart and patient as I am, if I were someone like Kyros with Kyros' plans I would travel the world and bond with every spire before starting my takeover. So why are the tiers spires unclaimed? This is I think is where the connection is. Kyros is losing control the spires and not to our Fatebinder, the connections are just fading for some reason. I think the plan with the edict of execution and our Fatebinder is either a way to set up a worthy successor or Kyros intends to use us to reawaken the spires then take the power from us.
 
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wimplestiltskin

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In one of the letters the old fatebinder tells you she had a case of a peasant who made a shrine to Kyros at a spire. When the peasant said "Kyros was here in the year -50" (note: the year 0 was the start of Kyros conquest of the world) a fatebinder she was with that was even older than her immediately killed the peasant. This story is obviously meaningful and I think it tells us the spires are the key to Kyros power.

Another letter about edicts tells us that people who declare edicts tend to die young from the strain of channeling so much power. I think Kyros uses this to scout for people like our Fatebinder. When we declare the edict in the conquest Kyros sees that we don't suffer the negative effects so Kyros knew we had the potential to bond with a spire. The Edict of Execution was definitely designed to get us to bond with the spire.

Now the question is why go through all this trouble. Well notice how the spires in the tiers are unclaimed and have been left dormant for a long time. We know this because when I claimed Lethian's Crossing I remember some of the dialogue. Most notably how the spire was damaged by age and when we bonded it fired up a self repair magic. The thing that stands out to me is why wouldn't Kyros have claimed this spire? We know Kyros is much older than the empire. Assuming Kyros is at the least as smart and patient as I am, if I were someone like Kyros with Kyros' plans I would travel the world and bond with every spire before starting my takeover. So why are the tiers spires unclaimed? This is I think is where the connection is. Kyros is losing control the spires and not to our Fatebinder, the connections are just fading for some reason. I think the plan with the edict of execution and our Fatebinder is either a way to set up a worthy successor or Kyros intends to use us to reawaken the spires then take the power from us.
Could it be that Kyros is neither man nor woman because Kyros is both men and women? Maybe Kyros is a cabal of Overlords. Each in possesion a collection of spires like the collection in the tiers? So not a cabal of Archons, but an eschalon above. Hence why no-one really knows with certainty if Kyros is man or woman. Sirin does sound surprised when we ask if Kyros is male or female, that we don't know, like its sooo obvious, but doesn't say what it is we should be aware of. I picked up on the peasant being killed for suggesting that Kyros had been to there 50 years prior to the conquest. Not sure how I'd feel about the cabal idea.
 

Shinros

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Could it be that Kyros is neither man nor woman because Kyros is both men and women? Maybe Kyros is a cabal of Overlords. Each in possesion a collection of spires like the collection in the tiers? So not a cabal of Archons, but an eschalon above. Hence why no-one really knows with certainty if Kyros is man or woman. Sirin does sound surprised when we ask if Kyros is male or female, that we don't know, like its sooo obvious, but doesn't say what it is we should be aware of. I picked up on the peasant being killed for suggesting that Kyros had been to there 50 years prior to the conquest. Not sure how I'd feel about the cabal idea.

Eh I think kyros is a person for sure going by marks short story kyros seems like a singular person.
 

Aramintai

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Could it be that Kyros is neither man nor woman because Kyros is both men and women? Maybe Kyros is a cabal of Overlords. Each in possesion a collection of spires like the collection in the tiers? So not a cabal of Archons, but an eschalon above. Hence why no-one really knows with certainty if Kyros is man or woman. Sirin does sound surprised when we ask if Kyros is male or female, that we don't know, like its sooo obvious, but doesn't say what it is we should be aware of. I picked up on the peasant being killed for suggesting that Kyros had been to there 50 years prior to the conquest. Not sure how I'd feel about the cabal idea.
I got an idea. What if Kyros is a collective hiding behind a mask like Tunon or Voices of Nerat? Nerat even told a story to Fatebinder how he fooled another Archon by allowing one of his minions to wear his getup and mask in a contest. Kyros's collective could be both males and females each overseeing their part of the continent. Perhaps among them there's still an original Kyros as well. And what if by allowing Fatebinder to have similar powers they were simply grooming another member for their collective who will oversee the Tiers?
 
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wimplestiltskin

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A compelling idea. I do prefer that there is just a single or atleast an original Kyros somewhere, but using lesser overlords as both stalking horse and stand in for situations the original Kyros hasn't the time or interest in would be awesome. After Shinros sharing of some of the extended lore, I'm thinking I might have to check that stuff out as it could include more clues that I haven't seen in the game!
 

pdx mm

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Again major spoilers....

It remains to be seen if the PC will become powerful enough to truly outlive their usefulness. What I don't get is why Kyros would bother sending the Archon of Plagues (forget his name) and his army to stop you if he/she/it wanted all this to go down the way it does. Maybe as an empty gesture to let you know that you're officially on the sh*t list now?

The way I see it the beginning of the game the PC is just another tool to be used and discarded as I don't think Kyros really thought the differences between the Archons would be put aside even with the death sentence over their heads. Again this is just my thinking but what if it was ending the edict the way we did which caught Kyros attention, like maybe that is how he/she/it came to have that kind of power. The rest of the game to me is just one big test almost like we are being groomed so to speak. Even if that isn't the case it is stated several times that it isn't so much the actual power of a person but the perceived power of said person as seen by the people of the land. It could be fear or favor but that is where power can be gained if it could just be that Kyros doesn't really see the PC as a threat but as a way to further increase its power by letting you build up only to be torn down. Well that is until we throw our own edict toward the north. Why there was no retaliation? Could be we just didn't get enough game to see it or maybe there is some fear that casting an edict on the PC would only make him/her even stronger instead of weakening or killing the PC. At least that is my take of the game so far, I have zero proof to back up my opinion.
 

orochi2k

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Maybe Kyros learned that she is trapped in a game. So she needs something to end it. :p
 

Louella

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one of the things Verse says, made me think.

Verse says she doesn't like the Disfavoured, because they stay in one place too much. She goes on to explain that as long as an army is in motion, people get on with things, but when its idle for too long, people start bickering over the smallest of things.

Kyros's whole empire, has been set up for conquest against an external enemy, for several centuries. The Tiers being the last bit that is not under Kyros's rule. What happens then ? the army goes idle, and the various archons begin bickering and infighting with each other.

By noticing the Fatebinder's potential, and setting them up as a permanent potential threat, then the status quo of "must fight the enemy" remains, and the numerous Archons and their armies attention is focused on the external enemy (i.e. you and your allies), rather than plots to depose Kyros.

So, set the Fatebinder up to be the external threat, that allows the empire to continue, otherwise, it may fall into perpetual infighting and civil war.
 

the streaker

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The only reasonable explanation is that Kyros' main objective is to grow you into an adversary or a successor. Otherwise one of your fellow fatebinders would have read you an edict and you'd be turned into dust just like Cairn.

The other cop-out explanation is that because you've absorbed 2+ of Kyros' edicts, you are immune to his edicts, but I suppose that wouldn't explain why Bleden Mark didn't assassinate you from the start. Perhaps Kyros made a mistake, and by the time he realized how powerful you were, Bleden Mark would no longer have been a guaranteed kill. I mean when you fight Mark in the end, he's definitely not a big challenge to kill...

Regarding Kyros' sex, my explanation for why Sirin keeps referring to him or her is that Kyros is a title secretly passed down from one person to another. There was a transition while Sirin was around him/her, and she found out since she can read minds. Some stories she tells you happened during the reign of a male Kyros, while others happened during the reign of a female Kyros, so she uses the appropriate pronoun for the situation.