Biffa: "I have some things I need to say about Cities Skylines 2"

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If you read my posts you would see that I said that the first expansion is not as dependant on the general game quality as expansions later on. You don't need to know the ultimate edition sales numbers to come to that conclusion.
They need to sell this first expansion to everyone having only the base game, just like any future DLC . If the game is still a mess, this expansion will flop. Has this expansion been already pre-paid in the ultimate edition by 1%, 20%, 80% of CS II owners? That's the difference.

Would it be better for future sales if the game was perfect at release, while having put in the same resources? Of course, but my point is that as long as people who bought CS2 doesn't suddenly lose their interest in city builders, the financial loss of taking their time to get things right is very limited.
You're not making any sense. Of course plummeting sales for 3 or 4 quarters are a huge loss. If your boss cut 75% of your salary and say: "hey, be patient, next year you'll recover your whole pay and maybe I'll double it for some time to compensate you. But no promises", would you agree your financial loss is very limited? If you think so, I want to hire you. :p As for people losing their interest in city builders, of course lots of them will. Lots of them are not even specially interested in city builders, they just bought it CS because it seemed a good game or because of marketing etc. Lots of people bought some crime novels in their life without being interested in crime novels. My wife watched Game of Thrones and loved it like millions of people and she doesn't care a bit about the fantasy genre, be it novels, TV series, movies or comics. She'll probably never watch or read anything else fantasy-related in her life.



Someone being complicit does not absolve everyone else of fault. If noone preordered any products, the game would very likely have been in a much better state at release since the risk of a bad release would be much higher.
If the publishers never offered pre-order, nobody could preorder. Back to square one. Anyway, you're just speculating because you don't have the slightest idea how much money they made with preordering. And you forget any preordering can be cancelled at any moment. Including after the release, same conditions than a regular buy (2 hours gameplay max and no more than 14 days since you first launched the game).

So following your "blame the customer" reasoning (which is really tiring), any person having bought CS II without asking for a refund is "complicit" of the rogue game companies. I wonder: is that including you?
 
Haven't played CS2 since November cause of strange simulation - it is sad, but i will wait till end of the year and try it again.
... or maybe earlier when modders are fixing the sim before ;)
 
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On another point, people are bringing up a "console release". Does this game perform well enough to pass console validation?

Not even close. That's why it was delayed and I wouldn't be shocked a bit if it was delayed again.

I wish PC games had some of the same stability and performance requirements consoles do.
 
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And the last one.
I think all the big CS creators have made a video this week.


I am curious if this week of bad press gets adressed on Monday or that maybe patch frequency goes up again.

But knowing CO their track record since the release of CS2 of ignoring overwhelming community feedback, it will probably 2 no’s on those questions. But I would love to be proven wrong
 
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The streak of negative media coverage surrounding CS2 unfortunately continues.

This video gives a general overview of the situation, and contextualizes it with recent Paradox releases like lamplighters League and Stellaris: Star Trek. Star Trek Infinite.
It also dabbles with the shareholder meeting report coverage and share prices.
 
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The streak of negative media coverage surrounding CS2 unfortunately continues.

Yeah, came here to post this vídeo.
I'm not worried that PDX will kill games and stuff like that, but this is the type of Corpo move that makes you lose your consumer trust.
I'm not willing to buy PDX game at launch for some time now.
I think that the last one i did buy at lauch was CK3.
 
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I just came here to say that I agree with every Biffa has said. He with his much larger reach said everything I wanted to say and more.
 
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You're not making any sense. Of course plummeting sales for 3 or 4 quarters are a huge loss. If your boss cut 75% of your salary and say: "hey, be patient, next year you'll recover your whole pay and maybe I'll double it for some time to compensate you. But no promises", would you agree your financial loss is very limited? If you think so, I want to hire you.
You forgot to add the huge bonus prior to the income reduction... CS2 sold over a million copies. Pardox have a healthy cash reserve, their cash reserves have grown with over 40% over the past year (all of the growth comes from the last quarter). I would expect CO to have a large cash reserve as well at this point. They will both be fine for the coming year. Also, you do realise that Paradox released a game which saw a similar reception about a year before CS2? Do you really think the management doesn't know the effects releasing a broken product early instead of fixing it prior to release will have on overall income and DLC sales?

You also seem to be missing the entire point of this discussion, which is about content creators taking a break from/making less CS2 content. As long as they return there is no reason for CO and Paradox to worry. It's not like them making content about CS2 showing off how broken the game is are going to sell a whole lot of DLCs. As long as they return once the game is improved, it simply has very little impact on CO/Paradox. While CO and Paradox would prefer to see everyone who bought CS2 to buy every DLC at release (or earlier), they likely came to the conclusion prior to release that it would be better for them to release when they did despite the somewhat reduced DLC sales for the first year.

The streak of negative media coverage surrounding CS2 unfortunately continues.
I believe Bellular have been covering pretty much anything negative about Paradox (and any other game big game publisher/developer) for quite some time. Him using the situation to make yet another video where he can put a big studio in a negative light, and at the same time promote his indie game is kind of expected. On the day CS2 released he released a video with the title "Cities Skylines 2 has shocked the internet" about CS2 performance. Four days later he released a video with the title "Cities Skylines 2 is Pradox's fault"...
 
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You forgot to add the huge bonus prior to the income reduction... CS2 sold over a million copies. Pardox have a healthy cash reserve, their cash reserves have grown with over 40% over the past year (all of the growth comes from the last quarter). I would expect CO to have a large cash reserve as well at this point. They will both be fine for the coming year.
* CS sold 1 million copies in the first month.
* CS II did too (which BTW are very poor sales, considering it's the sequel to a hugely popular game).
* CS sold millions more in the first year.
* CS won't because of the really bad ratings on Steam and its terrible reputation on every media and social network.

Now, let's imagine PDX explaining to their shareholders: "Guys, we could have earned 2 millions $ more this quarter but we didn't because the product is in bad shape and everybody knows it. But maybe we'll earn them later if the game gets better, so nothing to worry about. Hey, we earned a lot of money last year, right? Who needs more than that?". :rolleyes:

Your whole point is everything's alright because:

* The game will be fixed in 6-12 months
* Everybody will return, gamers and content creators
* Millions of others will come to realize the game is now better and will buy it

I'm pretty sure your crystal ball is pink-tinted.

BTW, about this "complicist" accusation you made, are you one of the people having paid the game and not refunded, hence encouraging the gaming industry to release half-baked bug-ridden software? Just curious.
 
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I believe Bellular have been covering pretty much anything negative about Paradox (and any other game big game publisher/developer) for quite some time. Him using the situation to make yet another video where he can put a big studio in a negative light, and at the same time promote his indie game is kind of expected. On the day CS2 released he released a video with the title "Cities Skylines 2 has shocked the internet" about CS2 performance. Four days later he released a video with the title "Cities Skylines 2 is Pradox's fault"...
And? Are you suggesting that anything in the video is wrong, deceptive, misleading or factually incorrect?
 
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Your whole point is everything's alright because
No. My point is entirely related to the topic of this thread: Youtubers making videos saying they are taking a break from the game/making less content for now doesn't really matter as long as they return later on. Since their jobs pretty much relies on the CS franchise they will likely give any improvements to CS2 free advertisement.
BTW, about this "complicist" accusation you made, are you one of the people having paid the game and not refunded, hence encouraging the gaming industry to release half-baked bug-ridden software? Just curious.
No. I learned my lesson about Paradox with the Imperator release back in 2019, and my impression is that overall the gaming industry has become worse when it comes to preorders and botched high profile releases since then. Paradox certainly haven't shown any signs of improving their business strategy since then. As a result I no longer buy their games on day one, nor from other developers/publishers. I'm also not as big a CS1 fan as most people here. Two of my three reasons for that matches some of Biffa's complaints about CS2 (as mentioned earlier in this thread), complaints this community have dismissed every time I have seen them brought up over the lifespan of CS1. In some regards I would therefore consider CS2 to be a result of what the CS1 community have encouraged CO to do.

I haven't bought CS2 at all. The game was available through Microsoft's PC game pass at release, where two week trials costs about $1 (depending on currency), and free trials exists as well. There was absolutely no reason to buy the game at release for any other reason than to support CO and Paradox (and Steam/microsoft). If that was your reason for buying the game, you have accomplished what you wanted. If it was not, you should probably reconsider how you spend your money on games in the future. Especially if you feel you wasted money on CS2. Whether CS2 turns out to be the game you wanted remains to be seen, just as when you bought the game. Not much has changed since then. CS2 could potentially become a great game when people bought it, and it still has potential to become a great game.
 
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No. My point is entirely related to the topic of this thread: Youtubers making videos saying they are taking a break from the game/making less content for now doesn't really matter as long as they return later on. Since their jobs pretty much relies on the CS franchise they will likely give any improvements to CS2 free advertisement.
No, you also predicted when the game will be in good shape (6-12 months), you think we'll have a second DLC this year, that every gamer will return to CS II and you're sure the shareholders don't care if the game doesn't sell for months because they already have money so why would they want more? As I said, nice crystal ball.

If that was your reason for buying the game, you have accomplished what you wanted. If it was not, you should probably reconsider how you spend your money on games in the future. Especially if you feel you wasted money on CS2. Whether CS2 turns out to be the game you wanted remains to be seen, just as when you bought the game.
I bought 3 games these past 10 years, including CS I and CS II, and I'll probably buy even less games in the next 10 years, so I don't have much to reconsider, but thanks for caring. :D
 
No, you also predicted when the game will be in good shape (6-12 months), you think we'll have a second DLC this year, that every gamer will return to CS II and you're sure the shareholders don't care if the game doesn't sell for months because they already have money so why would they want more? As I said, nice crystal ball.
Do you have any opinion on the topic of this thread? If you are going to argue about made up statements I have made you could at least come up with some arguments relevant for topic of this thread: Content creators (or more specifically Biffa) announcing that they will be making less CS2 content.

From what I can see it changes absolutely nothing. The game is in the same state as before their announcements, and their complaints are the same as the complaints in the overall reception of the game.
 
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if you're ignorant about content creators not affecting you. you are mistaken as they are in direct relation to you if you are interested in the future of this title. Not sure if i can say that, let's see..
 
These content creators are the people that publishers trust to provide early copies of their game so they have ample time to review the game to help create a successful release. The same people that look to these content creators to bring them joy and entertainment, they also bring them the news and feedback of information about a game. These creators are looked up to as trusted sources of information. They're professional and have to be in order to remain successful. I can see their business is being hurt by the state of the game based on their views falling off. Now it is very possible that the content creator isn't enjoying the game and that comes out in their content and as such THAT is the reason people aren't watching. Both scenarios are due to the same cause.

Also C:SL2 is a single player game, the content creators communities which are very active in live chats during streams. These bring people together to create a new form of playing a single-player game with others as many do play the game and watch the stream simultaneously. The streams also help build the channel's community as well as for the game. Entertaining content creators will attract new players that never touched the games and will create new customers.
 
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Me. I don't own C:SL2. I'm on the sidelines. My original reason to not buy was hearing about performance issues and decided to wait. Then these content creators mentioned the game and reviewed the game for me as again, I intentionally avoided news about the game until I was ready. I played 15 hours of C:SL1. I'm not a huge fan of the game, still got all the DLC. What I like with the games, I love seeing the beauty that others can make with the game if presented in an entertaining way. So you see. These content creators. They are the final word.

These content creators couldn't just stop playing their C:SL2 series quietly and go back to C:SL1 or try a new game. They had to tell their viewers why they're stopping their C:SL2 playthroughs. City Planner Plays explained he almost lost all of his saves and got a CTD, then mentioned the decision to not prioritize bug fixes. That sentence I just said, I don't recall hearing about CTD's and lost saves for a game this far after release, but City Planner could be an edge case, again I'm not in the know. In which case it's bad luck that experience happened to such a big content creator, presenting it to his loyal fans. End result, negative reviews are coming in an I'm noticing people that never reviewed a game are giving a thumbs down to C:SL2 as their first review. Also, it's always informative to reading the reviews and the forums over on steam.
 
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These content creators are the people that publishers trust to provide early copies of their game so they have ample time to review the game to help create a successful release.

They also have a responsibility to their viewers not to overhype a game to the point of completely misleading them.
 
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These content creators are the people that publishers trust to provide early copies of their game so they have ample time to review the game to help create a successful release. The same people that look to these content creators to bring them joy and entertainment, they also bring them the news and feedback of information about a game. These creators are looked up to as trusted sources of information. They're professional and have to be in order to remain successful. I can see their business is being hurt by the state of the game based on their views falling off. Now it is very possible that the content creator isn't enjoying the game and that comes out in their content and as such THAT is the reason people aren't watching. Both scenarios are due to the same cause.
They give content creators preview copies to promote their product, they get to sign NDA's so are not allowed to say whatever the company wants until the NDA is over. Do not trust content creators to give you honest reviews before a product release

Content creators want the game to be good, it is their content, they also want to start getting their player base involved in this, they will talk up the game, assure their viewers things will improve (yep, all had faith in the company at release) stay clicked to their channel.

Content creators want clicks, trashing games is popular and generates click, honest or not, with (EG. cp2077 many content creators were using mods to go out of bounds and make the game act funny or graphics not to be drawn correctly, these were successful channels. Saw one guy saying how his 10 subscriber channel went to 500+ subscribers after doing one video trashing starfield, there's money in shitting on games and jumping on bandwagons)




Also C:SL2 is a single player game, the content creators communities which are very active in live chats during streams. These bring people together to create a new form of playing a single-player game with others as many do play the game and watch the stream simultaneously. The streams also help build the channel's community as well as for the game. Entertaining content creators will attract new players that never touched the games and will create new customers.
 
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if you're ignorant about content creators not affecting you. you are mistaken as they are in direct relation to you if you are interested in the future of this title. Not sure if i can say that, let's see..
I'm well aware of their impact, which you would be aware of if you actually read more than my last post. If you watched the video from Biffa and other content creators you would also know that the content creators are NOT abandoning the CS franchise. That is a good thing for the future of CS2, CO and Paradox. The day they do abandon the franchise there is far more reason to worry.

They also have a responsibility to their viewers not to overhype a game to the point of completely misleading them.
Content creators relies on people being interested in their content, and therefore also the games they play. While content creators may have underestimated the mechanical shortcomings of the game, there were plenty of warnings about the state of the game from content creators before release. Especially the performance issues were well known before release. People are perfectly capable of building hype without relying on content creators though, and duely ignored the warnings and bought the game anyway.
 
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Do you have any opinion on the topic of this thread? If you are going to argue about made up statements I have made
Oh now you'll pretend they're made up? You realize anybody can read your previous posts, don't you? I have no other opinion about these content creators than "another nail in the coffin". What prompted me to post in this thread was your off-topic opinions listed above. Contrary to you, I don't have a crystal ball and I don't know if this game will be fixed in 6-12 months or even 2-4 years. I don't know which percentage of people will come back to CS II if it's fixed. I don't know how many people will buy the first expansion for a unfinished and bug-ridden game. The content creators giving up will inspire even more people to stop playing CS II and won't inspire newcomers to buy it. This I know.
 
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