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"We" want Richtenberg as well. Constantinople shall be Christian for all time.
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Joseph von Richtenberg please. (this 'll take us on the road rcduggan took with his Teutonic AAR back in the first years of the original EU3, also a magnificent history-book AAR)
von Holstein. Though I expect von Rictenberg to sneakaway with as many ships and troops as he can to go and take Byzantium.orce conversion has not worked to convert populations. Byzantium is no where near Lithuania, "Greece" is.
A 13 strong Electoral college permanently based in the Marienberg is looking rather appealing.
Spending money in the north is a waste. Money is better spent on ships, soldiers and spies.
I think diploannexing Ingria and Pskov is a splendid idea. Converting and settling can then ensue.
Retaking the northern core provinces requires fighting Bohemia and Lithaunia and choosing the moment will be all important.
A 13 strong Electoral college permanently based in the Marienberg is looking rather appealing.
Spending money in the north is a waste. Money is better spent on ships, soldiers and spies.
I think diploannexing Ingria and Pskov is a splendid idea. Converting and settling can then ensue.
Retaking the northern core provinces requires fighting Bohemia and Lithaunia and choosing the moment will be all important.
8/11/2008
Indeed a very good AAR. If anyone wants to take a look, it's over at page 16 or 17 at the moment.
This one has the potential to do even better.
Echoing Ar7's sentiments, Von Holstein, please. Yes, the notion of 'liberating' Constantinople, 'reuniting' the Greeks with the True Faith and restoring a catholic Eastern Roman Empire is a nice romantic gesture, but it is based on such flawed reasoning that, frankly, I think the Order would have more success if they put a mute, amputee macaque monkey in charge.
Let's see... The Fourth Crusade utterly failed in establishing a viable Latin state base on Constantinople, and it faced far weaker opposition (I mean, strife-ridden Byzantium versus warmongering Ottomans? Not exactly a favorable comparison).
More importantly, even if the Order could somehow organize a crusade that would be strong enough to take Constantinople AND kick around the Turks, could find the fleet to get that Crusade from the Baltic to the Bosporus, could get enough money to maintain those forces for the decade or longer it would take to put the plan into motion... Even if all that were not just possible, but even feasible, it would still overlook a tiny detail: all of the Order's neighbors hate them with a passion, have attacked them at all opportunities and have absolutely no reason to stop doing so now (or, more accurately, there is only one reason: it's called the Teuton army).
If von Richtenberg can denude his frontiers of all troops, ship them off to Byzantium and start traipsing all over the Balkans for 10-15 years without his neighbors (catholic, orthodox and/or simply opportunistic) declaring war en masse... well, to wax anachronistically, then it is time for Satan to go to work on a Zamboni.
Von Holstein, because sanity is just too valuable!
Let's see... The Fourth Crusade utterly failed in establishing a viable Latin state base on Constantinople, and it faced far weaker opposition (I mean, strife-ridden Byzantium versus warmongering Ottomans? Not exactly a favorable comparison).
More importantly, even if the Order could somehow organize a crusade that would be strong enough to take Constantinople AND kick around the Turks, could find the fleet to get that Crusade from the Baltic to the Bosporus, could get enough money to maintain those forces for the decade or longer it would take to put the plan into motion... Even if all that were not just possible, but even feasible, it would still overlook a tiny detail: all of the Order's neighbors hate them with a passion, have attacked them at all opportunities and have absolutely no reason to stop doing so now (or, more accurately, there is only one reason: it's called the Teuton army).
If von Richtenberg can denude his frontiers of all troops, ship them off to Byzantium and start traipsing all over the Balkans for 10-15 years without his neighbors (catholic, orthodox and/or simply opportunistic) declaring war en masse... well, to wax anachronistically, then it is time for Satan to go to work on a Zamboni.
Von Holstein, because sanity is just too valuable!
While I don't normally recommend this, perhaps in this case, for RP purposes, infamy could be edited down upon successful conversion of Byzantium to catholicism? (I mean it WOULD have been an incredibly prestigious feat).
Still, now that I think of it, I actually voted for Richtenberg only as far as Byzantium is concerned, not for an all-out crusade against the Turk. After the conquest of the "empire" is achieved things can pretty much go back to business as usual. There's no need to go beyond the limits of reason. Although "reason" as we see it and state-handling was not really a huge part of this period's political culture. There were other factors as well, such as the ol' prestige-n-glory not to mention (something which modern audiences tend to forget), genuine belief in the righteousness of a religious cause etc.
And obviously, Richtenberg is but one mortal man. What would happen in Marienburg for instance, when he would lead a part of the Order's veteran army to Constantinople? Should he succeed, nothing more than plotting from various disgruntled figures, no doubt. But should it take longer than usual...A sort of civil war in which the "Northerners" under von Holstein emerge victorious? I know the Order needs disunity like an angry swarm of bees undereneath one's armour, yet it's just one of those what if's
.
(And if it all goes awry, there's always the undead von Plauen to turn to).
Still, now that I think of it, I actually voted for Richtenberg only as far as Byzantium is concerned, not for an all-out crusade against the Turk. After the conquest of the "empire" is achieved things can pretty much go back to business as usual. There's no need to go beyond the limits of reason. Although "reason" as we see it and state-handling was not really a huge part of this period's political culture. There were other factors as well, such as the ol' prestige-n-glory not to mention (something which modern audiences tend to forget), genuine belief in the righteousness of a religious cause etc.
And obviously, Richtenberg is but one mortal man. What would happen in Marienburg for instance, when he would lead a part of the Order's veteran army to Constantinople? Should he succeed, nothing more than plotting from various disgruntled figures, no doubt. But should it take longer than usual...A sort of civil war in which the "Northerners" under von Holstein emerge victorious? I know the Order needs disunity like an angry swarm of bees undereneath one's armour, yet it's just one of those what if's
.(And if it all goes awry, there's always the undead von Plauen to turn to).
The Order seems as divided and inconclusive as ever. Von Holstein is surely the only reasonable choice. Von Richtenburg would, I suppose, probably garner more support from His Holiness and the Southern Catholics, but I suspect it would be the undoing of the Order if Poland and Lithuania were to attack.
as my candidate has already lost, i'll restrain from voting
still, i think freeing the Holy Land would be a lofty long-term goal
still, i think freeing the Holy Land would be a lofty long-term goal
I think von Holstein's goals are more feasible, and I rather like the idea of diploannexing your vassals. The schismatics must be converted and their leaders will not see to this, and may only be paying Rome lip service.
I'd say von Holstein. Richtenberg's goals are a very long shot (to put it mildly) and too risky without Lithuania and Bohemia safely befriended.
