BETATESTING: Beta 2

[Caliga]

Thanks in advance to everyone who volunteers to test the beta 2 release of the AGC. Some ground rules:

1. Korath has already started a bug list thread (it's been stickied). Please post technical bugs in that thread. This thread should be used for betatesting reports only, and the hope is that posts will discuss issues like game balance, AI performance, and so forth.

2. Screenshots are encouraged. I will post screenshots as I'm able to produce them. To take a screenshot in-game, hit F11 and it will be dumped to the base AGC directory (I suppose you could also take a screenshot by hitting the Prnt-Scrn key on your keyboard).

3. If you wish to run structured betatests, I recommend you play as Kongo, set AI aggressiveness to 'coward', turn on all the cheats (map visible, no pause for events, no fog of war), and sit back and watch the show. To turn on cheats: Hit F12 to bring up cheat console. The cheats which are most useful, as mentioned above, are 'columbus' (make the whole world visible), 'ney' (no pause for events), and 'pappenheim' (no fog of war). It might also help to turn on 'montezuma' (50,000 ducats so you don't have to worry about poor little Kongo going broke).

4. If you wish to run structured betatests, it would be helpful to pause and report the game's progress at or around the following years: 1453, 1492, 1550, 1600, 1648, 1700, 1753, 1789, and 1820.

5. Rather than an unfocused report, it'd be helpful for people to pick one general area and pay careful attention to developments there (i.e. Western Europe, Russia & Central Asia, East Asia, North America, etc.) I'd recommend that people who participated in the various regional threads focus on the areas in which they contributed.

6. If I get a large number of betatesters, I will compile statistics which will be helpful to the various area managers (I'm a statistician by profession and actually enjoy doing statistics).

-Caliga

ADDENDUM: I will be (for all early testing, at least) running the 'vanilla' version of the AGC, as in I will leave all settings in the agc_config at default. It would probably be helpful for people to experiment a little, especially as it might uncover more bugs if you try more options.

ADDENDUM TO ADDENDUM: All future tests will be run with 'all nations are majors' option turned ON in agc_config. This should become a default option in later betas.

 

[unmerged(5822)]

If anyone is going to monitor the Russian region, please pay attention to the Novgorodian trade posts east of the Urals (the leftmost Russian "permanent terra incognita")...

 

[AVN]

@Caliga,

Which configuration settings need to be tested ? IMO 2^50 (estimate) combinations are a little bit too much to test within a reasonable period.

I will start with the default settings and focus on Western Europe.
Furthermore I will (try to) save the game in the years you mentioned so that I can retrace info which I forget to mention in my report.

 

[unmerged(10128)]

i played the far east a little bit, not a structured test though. it seems china could annex tibet, korea and machuria quite easily, given now that they start off as its vassal. maybe we need further tests to confirm. but i dunno if that happening in the game is actually desirable or not though.

 

[unmerged(5822)]

IMO, that's not desirable...

 

[unmerged(11496)]

Originally posted by Caliga
(I'm a statistician by profession and actually enjoy doing statistics).

-Caliga

You know I hear they can cure that now with intensive therapy and savage beatings

 

[unmerged(10128)]

Originally posted by Onslaught
IMO, that's not desirable...

i played with weakling aggression level though, dont know if that makes any difference.

 

[unmerged(5822)]

Is weakling or coward lower?

 

[AVN]

Originally posted by Onslaught
Is weakling or coward lower?

Coward is lower.
But weakling is the proposed setting by our test leader.

 

[unmerged(5822)]

Hmm... Caliga, are you sure the tests should be made at weakling, rather than coward (which is the recommended AGC setting)?

 

[unmerged(7398)]

Originally posted by AVN
Which configuration settings need to be tested ? IMO 2^50 (estimate) combinations are a little bit too much to test within a reasonable period.

I recommend default settings until a baseline is established, at which point picking one or two settings to change and run hands-off games with for a while would be in order. All Countries are Majors and HRE Independence Events seem like good places to start with when you're at that point.

(I also recommend setting aggression on coward.)

 

[Caliga]

We'd talked about the recommended aggression level for a bit, and I think Onslaught is right in that we'd decided on 'coward' and not 'weakling'. My apologies. I will correct the lead post.

-Caliga

 

[Caliga]

Ok, since I participated more in the AGC: Russia thread than in any other, I decided to start with my focus on the Russia region. Following is my 1453 screenshot:

 

[Mad King James]

Looks good so far! well... other than the Mameluke's rampage in Anatolia anyhow

 

[Caliga]

SUMMARY: This is actually the third game I've run out close to 1453 (two prior crashes fixed by the latest bugfix... see Bug thread for details on how to fix).

I'm happy to report that in all three Novgorod retained its trans-Ural trading posts even when it did badly losing its 'home' territories to Sweden or Muscovy. I did not see any expansion in any of the three games by Novgorod south from its starting TP positions (which may be blocked by TI anyway).

As you can see Suzdal is gone. It disappeared in all three games, but in the first two it beat up on Novgorod before in one game when Muscovy annexed it, and in another where Novgorod made a comeback and annexed Suzdal!

Interesting that Crimea hasn't yet formed, but Kazan and Astrakhan have.

Also, as you can see, the Russian minors performed quite badly and so far it looks like they're easy prey for Muscovy and/or the TO.

MKJ's events that hand over the Genovese colonies to the Turks after Byzantium's fall are working quite nicely. In the game posted below Turks conquered Byzantium in 1434, so no Council of Florence. In the other two games I ran Byzantium survived till bugs caused crashes.

Two oddities which are partly visible: Trebizond is owned by Savoy in that screenshot, and the Mameluks somehow acquired Aydin (didn't catch how, but probably old-fashioned conquest) and acquired Karaman through conquest, and Tarsus through defection (had been conquered by Ak Koynlu).

-Caliga

 

[unmerged(5822)]

I know it's early for statistical conclusions, but...
* Is it common that Muscovy "nibbles" on Novgorod, rather than swallowing "all" of it in one war? How well does Novgorod seem to resist attacks?
* How often does someone else take provinces from Novgorod?
* Does Muscovy perform better, worse or no different than usual?

 

[Caliga]

You're right, it's too early, but from what I've seen:

* Muscovy does seem to grab Novgorod one province at a time, yes. In the game for which I posted a screenshot the growth rate of Muscovy vs. Novgorod seems on par with historical growth, actually.

*Of the three games I've run, I've only seen Denmark and Moscovy conquer parts of Novgorod. In two of the three Sweden beat up on the TO and took Estonia (and Livland in one game as well). I'll probably shift my next screenshot westward so you can see the whole Baltic.

*They haven't at all, so far.

*I think Muscovy is (still) performing too well, esp. against the minors. In fact, my recollection was that in beta 1 Ryazan and Tver did rather better (in the case of Ryazan, it was doing too well as compared to history). We'll really have to watch Muscovy once Suzdal is eliminated.

-Caliga

 

[unmerged(7398)]

Originally posted by Caliga
I did not see any expansion in any of the three games by Novgorod south from its starting TP positions (which may be blocked by TI anyway).

They only know about the provinces they own, and Obskaja Guja (the corner of water just to the north).

Also, as you can see, the Russian minors performed quite badly and so far it looks like they're easy prey for Muscovy and/or the TO.

Too early to say, but I suspect that this is because Suzdal, Tver, and Ryazan, instead of their peaceloving 1.05/Beta 1 Default AI, now have the same aggressive Russian AI as Muscowy, but not enough power to back up their bloodthirsty diplomats.

 

[Caliga]

Korath, is there a reason they share Muscovy's AI other than convenience? I'd earlier offered to help out with AI programming and I would be happy to make like a "Russian minor" AI or even individual AIs for each minor if it helps fix that.

-Caliga

 

[unmerged(5822)]

The reason is that if any of those become Russia, they must be able to back it up as well.