Easily solved for the ottomans - just give them an ai only event adding 300 ducats or so to treasury. Or if the add TC command works (can't remember if it does or not) use that as well. AI events are ok to add as there is no text.
-
We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.
In 1419 with 0 infrastructure? Would you care to say how you do this? IIRC, TCs require infra 1, which takes at least one year to get - usually closer to two.
Well having just gotten whipped as France by rebels from the War of Religion events I am not sure the new rebel changes are so great. They brought my country to its knees. I love the challenge but rebels beating my superior forces 5 out 6 times gets a lot old real fast. If I wanted to get slaughtered by rebels repeatedly I would play the Tims or China, there is no way that the rebels should be this tough. They are carrying pitch forks for God's sake 
Remember rebels at this time were in no way as well equiped as the regular army.
It is nice to have them not pop up so much but the problem now is anytime you get a scripted revolt or random event it is nearly impossible to deal with them.
Minor AI's get random revolts or scripted revolts and it is a fact that their government will fall since they can't beat the rebels and now it is nearly impossible for a human to beat them to.
I love the increased difficulty but having 4 rebel armies of 25k roaming around the country side killing everything it sight is not good. Considering I am right next to the Netherlands and Spain's not controlling its rebels, leaving rebel armies of 50K plus march across the boarder for me to deal with just isn't right.
I think we really need to look at the new rebel system and find some kind of happy middle. Before there were way to many rebels running around now they are to powerful.
Juice
Remember rebels at this time were in no way as well equiped as the regular army. It is nice to have them not pop up so much but the problem now is anytime you get a scripted revolt or random event it is nearly impossible to deal with them.
Minor AI's get random revolts or scripted revolts and it is a fact that their government will fall since they can't beat the rebels and now it is nearly impossible for a human to beat them to.
I love the increased difficulty but having 4 rebel armies of 25k roaming around the country side killing everything it sight is not good. Considering I am right next to the Netherlands and Spain's not controlling its rebels, leaving rebel armies of 50K plus march across the boarder for me to deal with just isn't right.
I think we really need to look at the new rebel system and find some kind of happy middle. Before there were way to many rebels running around now they are to powerful.
Juice
I have wondered if there is much reasoning for having rebels walking across borders. I can see that it would raise my RR, but I just don't see that they should march into another country.
Yes, but that means that the AI's starting money is much less likely to go to the all-important Tax Collectors.
Well... I suppose that either we can give countries like the Ottomans extra starting cash, or give all countries TC's in every held province in the beginning of the game. But it will still be trouble for countries like Russia, who conquers a lot of provinces who'll then lose the TC's.
The easiest fix would simply be to except all AI countries from this whole TC change, but I guess then we'll have a lot of people complaining about AI cheating...
The easiest fix would simply be to except all AI countries from this whole TC change, but I guess then we'll have a lot of people complaining about AI cheating...
Back to the core question....of game balance....I think it is clear that given all the recent changes, the starting positions of countries has gotten knocked quite out of alignment, and some rethinking should be done along those lines. Again, this is not a human player issue, but an AI issue. The AI simply doesn't know what to do, and how.
If you use the OE as a case in point, the AI has, IIRC, 7 provs, 60k troops, and 500d. The country can support 20k troops. If the AI makes its first move to place TC's everywhere, then it's left with 150d, or enough funds to support its current army size for about 5 months....after which time, it'll take out loans that it cannot afford to pay back, and thus....the problems begin.
Same thing with Brandenburg - 150d, 25k army, 3 provs....can support 13k. Happens a bit slower, and sometimes the AI can work with it, but the combination of the latest changes serves to largely paralyze the AI. I have not had a challenging SP since going to 1.07. The AI can't hang.....if we have to let the AI cheat to put it back to par, then I'd be for it. I'd rather have a challenging AI than a non-cheating one.
-=Vel=-
If you use the OE as a case in point, the AI has, IIRC, 7 provs, 60k troops, and 500d. The country can support 20k troops. If the AI makes its first move to place TC's everywhere, then it's left with 150d, or enough funds to support its current army size for about 5 months....after which time, it'll take out loans that it cannot afford to pay back, and thus....the problems begin.
Same thing with Brandenburg - 150d, 25k army, 3 provs....can support 13k. Happens a bit slower, and sometimes the AI can work with it, but the combination of the latest changes serves to largely paralyze the AI. I have not had a challenging SP since going to 1.07. The AI can't hang.....if we have to let the AI cheat to put it back to par, then I'd be for it. I'd rather have a challenging AI than a non-cheating one.
-=Vel=-
Originally posted by JohnMK
2 years out of 400. Cry me a river.
I'm with you that it's not a long time to wait - two years is nothing in the grand scheme of things - but those first few years are crucial for the Turks. 60k men, no census tax, lousy trade goods and dozens of loans. I wouldn't mind a 7 or eight per cent inflation rate by 1424 - even ten. It's the cycles of bankruptcies that come and push inflation to 40 or 50. Making maintenance more expensive, TCs costing 70 bucks apiece. The AI gets brakes on its inflation rate, and a good thing too, or they'd never break out of Anatolia.
With no census taxes for the AI sans TC either, you're not exactly raking in cash from sacking capitals, either, unless you can get to Venice unaccosted.
Census taxes are the major source of income for states until trade gets going - a major problem for the Turks until Constantinople fails. Issues of too much money to spend may exist in the late game - it is not an issue at the start.
And anything that forces player controlled Turks to follow a "winning path" instead of one the player decides on is a bad thing gamewise.
I have just answered a similar thing in another post, but...
I would say that it is an AI issue and a Newb issue as well. I think the starting army sizes should be compatible with support limit and income to start so newbs dont get too distraught. They should not be expected to disband immediately.
Less army = happier newbs = larger community = better EU3
The game is hard enough to learn without making a puzzle to solve the second someone starts a game. A newb should be able to pick the OE, start a game and coast, so he can look around for a bit. As it is, he will go broke.
Start a game, each 'province' has its supportable army limit in it.
I would say that it is an AI issue and a Newb issue as well. I think the starting army sizes should be compatible with support limit and income to start so newbs dont get too distraught. They should not be expected to disband immediately.
Less army = happier newbs = larger community = better EU3
The game is hard enough to learn without making a puzzle to solve the second someone starts a game. A newb should be able to pick the OE, start a game and coast, so he can look around for a bit. As it is, he will go broke.
Start a game, each 'province' has its supportable army limit in it.
The beauty of the EU system is its inherent ability to change either through the ever seeing eye of Paradox or through user made mods. If you think a country is underperforming or don't like the TC change, simply open up the Tur.inc file and add a TC to all the Ottoman home provinces. Or even simpler, open up the scenario editor and add a TC to the Ottoman's initial provinces. Or give them some more money, or start them out at level 1 infrastructure, or use Moctezuma'a tech editor to change the TC to being available at level 0 infra.
We don't have to rely on Paradox to make changes we want, just go in and do it yourself. By the way, I love the TC change, it adds a new dimension to an already complex game.
We don't have to rely on Paradox to make changes we want, just go in and do it yourself. By the way, I love the TC change, it adds a new dimension to an already complex game.
I like your signature, Stonewall. but how do you feel about all those poor peasants in Colombia, Peru, Jamaica, Mexico...
I concur that the new requirement of having a TC to get Census income is overkill. Nor have I yet seen a convincing argument on why such a radical change is required.
Before, nearly all of the countries in EU2 had a functioning economy at game start. The entire economic setup was phased toward a country using monthly income for research, stability, and troop support. Yearly income was for building improvements, new troops, traders, etc. That's how the game was designed, that's how the AI thinks, and a darned good design it was, too.
Yes, one can go down into "hunker down" mode and do nothing except research Infra 1, then save all monthy income for a few years (or decades) until you have enough for your first Taxman. (Better hope nobody bothers you and you don't have too many bad Events until you're all done with that.)
But In Real Life, THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO DO THAT, taxation had been around for a few millenia before 1419. I've found no record anywhere that the entire world stopped dead in 1419 to figure out how to raise cash. Also, the nations have other things to worry about. In 1419, much of the West is still embroiled in the 100 years war, and the rest of the world is none too peaceful either. Nearly all nations need cash flow right at the start, to keep afloat in all the mayhem. The AI is also geared to put some of its monthly income into researching the military techs right off the start, which is a very historical thing to do.
If I want the fun of building a nation from scratch, I'll play the Fantasia scenario or Civ 2 (but not Civ 3) If I want to jump into the wild and wacky world of 1419, I prefer the Tax System the way it was.
If a greater challenge is desired for SP play, then just give the AI a 10% - 20% bonus to all forms of income at the Hard and Very Hard levels. That's a lot simpler than changing a lot of fundamental rules, then having to do a lot of tweaks and re-tweaks so the AI can figure it out.
I'd rather see Johan working the remaining bugs. (Like he's doing with the Sleeping AI! Three Cheers!)
Best wishes,
Stilicho.
Before, nearly all of the countries in EU2 had a functioning economy at game start. The entire economic setup was phased toward a country using monthly income for research, stability, and troop support. Yearly income was for building improvements, new troops, traders, etc. That's how the game was designed, that's how the AI thinks, and a darned good design it was, too.
Yes, one can go down into "hunker down" mode and do nothing except research Infra 1, then save all monthy income for a few years (or decades) until you have enough for your first Taxman. (Better hope nobody bothers you and you don't have too many bad Events until you're all done with that.)
But In Real Life, THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO DO THAT, taxation had been around for a few millenia before 1419. I've found no record anywhere that the entire world stopped dead in 1419 to figure out how to raise cash. Also, the nations have other things to worry about. In 1419, much of the West is still embroiled in the 100 years war, and the rest of the world is none too peaceful either. Nearly all nations need cash flow right at the start, to keep afloat in all the mayhem. The AI is also geared to put some of its monthly income into researching the military techs right off the start, which is a very historical thing to do.
If I want the fun of building a nation from scratch, I'll play the Fantasia scenario or Civ 2 (but not Civ 3)
If I want to jump into the wild and wacky world of 1419, I prefer the Tax System the way it was.If a greater challenge is desired for SP play, then just give the AI a 10% - 20% bonus to all forms of income at the Hard and Very Hard levels. That's a lot simpler than changing a lot of fundamental rules, then having to do a lot of tweaks and re-tweaks so the AI can figure it out.
I'd rather see Johan working the remaining bugs. (Like he's doing with the Sleeping AI! Three Cheers!)
Best wishes,
Stilicho.
I agree, it makes the beginning of the game very one-dimensional. I also think it's an overkill, maybe tax collectors should boost census taxes by some percentage (not too dramatic), but at the present it doesn't make for a good game experience if you're not a big country with a wad of cash at the start.