Beginning the Game...How soon to Colonize or build starbases?(2.2.3)

[Hootieleece]

I am not a total noob, but the Administrative Cap often and the research penalties effect (especially) ALWAYS effect my empires.

Do you build starbases in every system to get resources and every system in a hyperlane chain to a Colonizable world?

The reason I ask is I am often 3 or more systems away by hyperlane connection from stars that are right next to me.

I started a game as UNE(United Nation's of Earth) and I was 4 Jumps from Alpha Centauri and like 10 from Sirius, both of which had continental planets.

I am wondering how fast to colonize...and build up the fleet both of which require resources.

If someone could give a short outline of a "good" start of things to do would be great.

 

[Dorian Ertymexx]

I am not a total noob, but the Administrative Cap often and the research penalties effect (especially) ALWAYS effect my empires.

Do you build starbases in every system to get resources and every system in a hyperlane chain to a Colonizable world?

The reason I ask is I am often 3 or more systems away by hyperlane connection from stars that are right next to me.

I started a game as UNE(United Nation's of Earth) and I was 4 Jumps from Alpha Centauri and like 10 from Sirius, both of which had continental planets.

I am wondering how fast to colonize...and build up the fleet both of which require resources.

If someone could give a short outline of a "good" start of things to do would be great.

I rarely colonize early, but let my first planet grow full before I start colonizing other planets.

As for outposts, I build them strategically. That is to say, I follow the paths to chokepoints, so that I can explore and claim other systems later on, when I have a higher AC. I also take the Expansion-tradition early on, because it gives you lower cost to build outposts, and a flat +20 to AC. And once finished, allows you to get an Ascension Perk that gives you another +30. That helps a lot to get that early empire growth without slowing down research and Everything else too much.

 

[Spacemadnesss]

Sounds like you got unlucky, depending on you game settings. I tend to have two green worlds within 2 jumps each and colonize each asap, spreading my outposts as far as i need to secure chokepoints against the AI and no further, saving my alloys (first building is +foundry) to max out my corvette allowance. Though I build corvettes in between colonizing/outposting as influence caps how fast you can do this. Then, depending on the threat board I upgrade one outpost for anchorages. I fill in the rest of the space with outposts as the lowest priority to get their resources, i tend to need +energy early so thats what most of the early "infill" is for.

Be careful snaking out too much as you'll run into a cohesion penalty on your sprawl, it can pay to do a little infil just to get rid of that penalty.

 

[Hootieleece]

I took Discovery first and am halfway through Expansion.

I tend to outpost every system until I find another empire or other Blocker down that chain. (Due to bad experiences with Pirates in earlier versions)

I have 12/20 Corvettes, 2 Science Ships, and one Constructor.

I have 3 planets each in its own sector....

800 systems 9AI Empires, 3 Advanced starts, 2 Fallen Empires, 2 Marauders.

 

[daringly]

I usually want 5 science ships as soon as possible. This gives you the edge in determining which way to expand to block off neighbors and get habitable planets.

If I don't make contact with any empires, or they are friendly, I won't build another star base until I have several planets.

I usually run out of influence after expanding to 15 or 20 systems. If I haven't colonized the good planets in that area, I'll do that before building star bases. When expanding, you might initially skip systems that don't produce much. You can fill those in later (or fill them in if you eventually get a penalty for sprawl).

Exceeding your AC is not a disaster -- as long as your unity and research grow faster than the AC penalty.

 

[Typee]

but the Administrative Cap often and the research penalties effect (especially) ALWAYS effect my empires.

They are supposed to. You're supposed to be above your cap all the time. If you're below your cap, think of any unused admin cap point as unused resources. The admin malus is only there to give a chance to the little guys and slow down your snowball, you're still getting more of your extra systems than they are costing you.

 

[Dorian Ertymexx]

I took Discovery first and am halfway through Expansion.

I tend to outpost every system until I find another empire or other Blocker down that chain. (Due to bad experiences with Pirates in earlier versions)

I have 12/20 Corvettes, 2 Science Ships, and one Constructor.

I have 3 planets each in its own sector....

800 systems 9AI Empires, 3 Advanced starts, 2 Fallen Empires, 2 Marauders.

I used to do the same, now I start with Expansion, take the first one that makes outpost-building cheaper (because Influence is such a slow growing resource), and then take Discovery. And then, when it is finished, back for the rest of the Expansion-traditions.

I use two science ships, and when they start to get too far apart, I build a second Constructor as well.

 

[Hootieleece]

I used to do the same, now I start with Expansion, take the first one that makes outpost-building cheaper (because Influence is such a slow growing resource), and then take Discovery. And then, when it is finished, back for the rest of the Expansion-traditions.

I use two science ships, and when they start to get too far apart, I build a second Constructor as well.

How do you take Discovery without finishing Expansion?

 

[Dorian Ertymexx]

How do you take Discovery without finishing Expansion?

Easily?

You don't have to finish one Tradition-line before opening another. Never tried it myself, but I think you can open them all without finishing any of them. Only backdraw is you will take longer to get Ascension Perks that way.

 

[GEoE]

I take Discovery first and then the first tradition in that tree that gives you a bonus for survey speed. Then instead of finishing Discovery I switch over to Expansion to decrease influence cost of the ongoing claiming of systems. I try to keep below the admin cap as long as possible (eventually going over over it though), claiming only systems I feel I need.

That mostly means securing vital choke points to cut of any foreign expansion but also very valuable goodies such as gaia worlds. I just try to secure what I consider a vital core territory. Everything else can be claimed later with extra resources I happen to have or simply by conquest.

I'd say how soon to colonize depends of what planets are available. If they are rather small standard stuff I don't bother with them for quite a while. If there are big ones suitable for specialization, i.e. lots of mining districts or rare special features, I colonize them quickly and even prioritize them over the home world.

I haven't done the math but it feels efficient.

 

[Ryika]

When we're talking about peaceful starts, taking a second planet as early as possible is the way to go in my opinion. So much so that I send my science ship around until I find a colonizable planet, and then use both science ships only to survey what needs to be surveyed so I can take that system immediately. Then I build my colony ship, and while it's being constructed, I construct the outposts. That fits perfectly within the alloy- and influence-budget you have by default. Which is great, because I skip the additional alloy foundries I'd construct in an aggressive build - I'll simply not have the pop on my homeworld for a while, because when the colony is done, I resettle pops until I can upgrade the colony shelter.

That is quite a commitment, but I find that it easily pays off. It literally doubles early-game growth - which is the major bottleneck at that point - and gives me the extra pops I need to be able to continue expanding without having to ever wait for a colony to grow to 10 pops naturally. The second expansion comes at a bit of a delay because some alloy production and infrastructure needs to be added in case there's an aggressive neighbor (or, I guess, one could play it as an all-in, but I find that to be rather cheesy). Science ships focus on reaching and surveying bottlenecks so I can construct islands there - that way, the admin cap stays under control until the economy has caught up and I can start filling in the (resource-rich) gaps.

 

[Longprao]

Holy shit with 500 hours in the game I have never thought of taking another tradition tree before finishing one. This is really mind opening.

 

[KingAlamar]

I am not a total noob, but the Administrative Cap often and the research penalties effect (especially) ALWAYS effect my empires.

Do you build starbases in every system to get resources and every system in a hyperlane chain to a Colonizable world?

The reason I ask is I am often 3 or more systems away by hyperlane connection from stars that are right next to me.

I started a game as UNE(United Nation's of Earth) and I was 4 Jumps from Alpha Centauri and like 10 from Sirius, both of which had continental planets.

I am wondering how fast to colonize...and build up the fleet both of which require resources.

If someone could give a short outline of a "good" start of things to do would be great.

FYI: I've seen the same. While my Alpha was 1 jump away it was a fairly terrible planet. Sirius was a full 14 jumps away and was closer to TWO other empires than me even though it was one of my guaranteed starting planets!!!!

EDIT: I believe what causes this is that the map generator doesn't know about "hyperlanes" and actually builds the galaxy based on old FTL [Warp / Wormhole] being able to jump to the system directly .... Fixing map gen for guaranteed habitable planets would be a nice update.

My start in single player [SP] usually defaults to "rapid expansion".

• Change food policy to nutritional abundance on day 1 for extra buffs
• Set my science ship to explore as fast as possible ... remember systems with planets even if I have to write them down
• Use "Encourage Growth" on every planet I can
• Claim mineral mines first [usually 3+], 3+ energy next in home system
• When I have enough energy to buy a leader I make a science ship and have them explore an opposite direction
• Repeat the same for 3 science ships all exploring. If I find planet(s) I'll use at least one science ship to SURVEY towards that planet to claim it.
• I'll build outposts along the way
• IF I meet aliens I will try to "cut them off" at a choke point to blunt their expansion [and also likely plopping down a starbase / bastion]
• Colonize the best planet you can as early as you can
• Build fleets up to cap as alloy expenses from starbases [choke points only with aliens on the other side], colony ships, science ships [up to 3?] allow
• I tend to go for the Expansion techs first although anything that speeds up expansion should work.

This type of REX should be fine vs. the AI most of the time up to at least Admiral difficulty [no mods]. Haven't tried Grand Admiral but early game the AI can be a threat so you could possibly loose if a hostile civ is right next to you -- think "purifiers", "devourers", Fanatic militarists, etc.

 

[Ryika]

EDIT: I believe what causes this is that the map generator doesn't know about "hyperlanes" and actually builds the galaxy based on old FTL [Warp / Wormhole] being able to jump to the system directly .... Fixing map gen for guaranteed habitable planets would be a nice update.

It just considers raw distance. Any system that's in a certain radius of your main planet (10-50 measurement units) can become one of your "guaranteed" starting systems.

 

[Onedreamer]

I am not a total noob, but the Administrative Cap often and the research penalties effect (especially) ALWAYS effect my empires.

Do you build starbases in every system to get resources and every system in a hyperlane chain to a Colonizable world?

The reason I ask is I am often 3 or more systems away by hyperlane connection from stars that are right next to me.

I started a game as UNE(United Nation's of Earth) and I was 4 Jumps from Alpha Centauri and like 10 from Sirius, both of which had continental planets.

I am wondering how fast to colonize...and build up the fleet both of which require resources.

If someone could give a short outline of a "good" start of things to do would be great.

I think you play too big a map. In my (long) experience with this genre of game that's never the best idea as typically these game are best balanced with average or near average settings. I've had cases with Sirius being a bit far off but nothing like 10 (!!) jumps away. In one occasion I was missing entirely both Alpha Centauri and Procyon and restarted immediatly.
Me, I play on large maps max, always 4 arms spiral galaxy when playing UNE (my most played one) for a "realism/rp" touch. The preset stars are very easily recognized since Sirius and Procyon are binary star system, Alpha Centaury is a triple system. Also a little trick: if you select the scout ship and mouse over system with the "survey" option selected, you will be shown the name of the system before actually exploring it. So you can check the position of Sirius and Alpha Centauri right away before unpausing. Of course this is significant only when you play with the settings for 2 guaranteed habitable worlds nearby... I tied lowering it to 1 or 0 but I wasn't too happy with results all in all. As I said, when you stray too much from defaults you have to expect fuzzy results.
As for your question, in the early stages I try to take some systems but don't colonize too much too fast (districts increase cap quite fast), in any case I try to not surpass more than twice the administrative cap.

 

[SadNova]

I don't build much starbases, only those block AI or with very rich resources (like > 10 ). Colonization is not that bad actually, it only takes 2 points for each new planet, and every new section takes only 1 point - which means a planet is much more efficient than a system. Since building slots do not take penalty points, there are ways to unlock slots without penalty, like migrating Livestocks immediately after colonization. You can have a 16 slots planet without any built section.

 

[AlanC9]

Holy shit with 500 hours in the game I have never thought of taking another tradition tree before finishing one. This is really mind opening.

There is a penalty for doing this. However, the early traditions are really cheap.

 

[RoverStorm]

Holy shit with 500 hours in the game I have never thought of taking another tradition tree before finishing one. This is really mind opening.

The reason this isn't "always" recommended is because each tradition tree you "adopt" increases tradition cost by a significant amount; 5-10% on top of the normal increase for selecting another tradition.

 

[ChiefBigFeather]

In my experience, pop growth is mostly the limiting factor for economic growth. I try to colonize as soon as possible, trying to time it with colonization fever.

I'm not sure how valuable the influence you can save on star bases really is. In my experience, alloys are far more important early on, as you also need science ships and a navy. Most system's resources from mining and science stations is not worth the admin cap. I try to snake by those 2 energy systems if possible. Stations do allow you to invest minerals without pop growth though, so some expansion is important.

For perks I think colonization fever->to boldly go->science division (depending on your strat, materialists want robots asap)->a new life is my best try at being optimal.

 

[Hootieleece]

Thanks for all the comments. I have learned a lot.

This will help going forward in my next game. I am continuing the current one just to see if I can salvage it.

Please continue adding to the comments and discussion. I am sure others have benefited as well.