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Bullfilter

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Ps: I also meant to remark on the King’s awful set of character traits and now maladies - yuck! :eek: No wonder he’s such a terrible King. And they called Foulques “Ill Ruler”! :mad:
 
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Geoffrey reminds me of Xenophon's Cyrus in a dark mirror - and not just his uncanny verbal ju-jitsu and cynicism to the point of outward honour. More precisely, Cyrus plays the exact same trick as Geoffrey does with Alias, using his gay BFF as a mouthpiece to say what he shouldn't say himself.

It's worth noting that Xenophon writes Cyrus as a backhanded compliment to ambition. While Cyrus creates a vast, finely-tuned empire, in doing so he corrupts the political, social, and moral life of his subjects to the point where the empire collapses and the Persians are, in some sense, worse off than before. Geoffrey's lust for power might put his 'Angevin Empire' into a similar position, and leave Anjou subjugated where it once was free. There are many reasons Foulques disdained the crown, but I suspect one was a practical soldier's wariness of hubris.
 
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Geoffrey reminds me of Xenophon's Cyrus in a dark mirror - and not just his uncanny verbal ju-jitsu and cynicism to the point of outward honour. More precisely, Cyrus plays the exact same trick as Geoffrey does with Alias, using his gay BFF as a mouthpiece to say what he shouldn't say himself.

It's worth noting that Xenophon writes Cyrus as a backhanded compliment to ambition. While Cyrus creates a vast, finely-tuned empire, in doing so he corrupts the political, social, and moral life of his subjects to the point where the empire collapses and the Persians are, in some sense, worse off than before. Geoffrey's lust for power might put his 'Angevin Empire' into a similar position, and leave Anjou subjugated where it once was free. There are many reasons Foulques disdained the crown, but I suspect one was a practical soldier's wariness of hubris.
This is a really interesting analogy. Of course in the Cyropaedia is a largely positive account of Cyrus' own life (I always got the feeling Xenophon rather wished for a Greek Cyrus - alas he didn't live long enough for Alexander).
 
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Far away for some indeed, I spent the holidays 200km away from Rosellò and just 4km from the french border :D.

Well that was something, you have a knack for writting thought-patterns it seems. We saw it before, of course, but now that you control Geoffrey it is more evident.

I'm glad someone brought up Lily, when she first appeared I thought she would turn out pretty interesting to watch, but I must admit I forgot about her.

Our new duke has a tough road ahead and if he can go along the twisting and winding path without bloodletting I bet in this timeline he will achieve eternal fame. Specially if he ends up carving an independent realm that lasts for several centuries...

On a sidenote, I've been playing a game with León in which Hugues inherits France early on an goes absolutely berserk, getting all the laws to max, assembling an OP council, recovering Normandy, conquering a duchy from the HRE, some counties in Spain (to my great frustration), and a chunk of north África, ending his days on a succesful crusade. Quite the contrast huh...
 
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Looks like the new Duke d'Anjou has hit the ground running! I like others have noted his apparent lack of grief over his father's passing, but I'm willing to give him a pass on this one. It strikes me as typical medieval behavior, and the mutual opinion malus the two shared doesn't help. There's a time to mourn later regardless, as the young man has three ducal titles to sort out and synchronize (if in no other way than the succession laws). As for the king, I'll be amazed if the old man lives for another year...

Looking forward to the next chapter of this already excellent second book!
 
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This is a really interesting analogy. Of course in the Cyropaedia is a largely positive account of Cyrus' own life (I always got the feeling Xenophon rather wished for a Greek Cyrus - alas he didn't live long enough for Alexander).

Not to get too off topic, but I have always enjoyed the interpretation (I don't remember if it was Strauss himself or Christopher Nadon channeling him) that Cyrus's own perfection is itself a condemnation of empire - that not even the most virtuous monarch can make empire work, and thus we ought to re-evaluate the irrational and unmeritocratic society the Persians began with. Cyrus, the just judge par excellence, destroys law and virtue in the process of building a politics based on reason and merit. Perhaps, on Xenophon's account, this republican/oligarchic virtue of the polis is the best we can do in political life, as politics is always founded upon contingency and competition. The Cyropaedia, then, along with some of the dialogues in the Memorabilia on the political and philosophic life, suggests that the political life is not nearly as superior to private life as a superficial comparison between Cyrus and Socrates would have you believe.

Of course, Xenophon is thinking about the choice of life for the most virtuous man - Geoffrey, like Foulques, may have powerful political virtues, but he lacks entkratia, self-rule. As such, just like his father, he can only rule well when he is not overcome by lust or greed. While Geoffrey should have looked to Cyrus's example (incidentally, the Cyropaedia is the only book Machiavelli explicitly recommends), now he is formed as a man he would learn more from the Hiero. What must the tyrant do if he desires to be truly loved? Benefit his subjects, naturally. How can the tyrant benefit his subjects? To some extent, this must be at the expense of other cities. Watch out, Berry, Brittany, and beyond...
 
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Geoffrey has gotten what he wants and spends little time in making sure it stays his. It was pure Geoffrey with the king. Get what he wanted while making it look like it was what the king needed. I cannot wait to see waht happens when he reaches Anjou.

You won't have to wait long. We'll actually be there a little while as well - as you might expect, there was a bit of re-arranging and re-organizing going on. I didn't put it all into the story, but there's a lot to cover.

Ps: I also meant to remark on the King’s awful set of character traits and now maladies - yuck! :eek: No wonder he’s such a terrible King. And they called Foulques “Ill Ruler”! :mad:

He's bad. It's kind of a miracle he's lasted this long. Pre-Conclave he'd have been deposed within three years. Post-conclave he gets to hang around for a while.

Geoffrey reminds me of Xenophon's Cyrus in a dark mirror - and not just his uncanny verbal ju-jitsu and cynicism to the point of outward honour. More precisely, Cyrus plays the exact same trick as Geoffrey does with Alias, using his gay BFF as a mouthpiece to say what he shouldn't say himself.

It's worth noting that Xenophon writes Cyrus as a backhanded compliment to ambition. While Cyrus creates a vast, finely-tuned empire, in doing so he corrupts the political, social, and moral life of his subjects to the point where the empire collapses and the Persians are, in some sense, worse off than before. Geoffrey's lust for power might put his 'Angevin Empire' into a similar position, and leave Anjou subjugated where it once was free. There are many reasons Foulques disdained the crown, but I suspect one was a practical soldier's wariness of hubris.

I haven't read that take on Cyrus the Great. Interesting things there - I'll have to think on them as we move forward.

Younger Foulques who had inherited what he has may have dreamed of being king. By the time Foulques had secured Anjou, I think he'd seen all it takes to juggle a kingdom between dealing with vassals and having to deal with external threats. In some ways, I imagine he felt he would be less free as king than he was as a powerful vassal. And in his position - where there are no powerful enemies anywhere near him and he even rivals or surpasses the kingdoms near him - he was right.

This is a really interesting analogy. Of course in the Cyropaedia is a largely positive account of Cyrus' own life (I always got the feeling Xenophon rather wished for a Greek Cyrus - alas he didn't live long enough for Alexander).

I may have to check this out! My knowledge of Greek/Persian history is more basic (the only Persian rulers I remember off the top of my head are Cyrus, Darius, Xerxes and Darius III) so I could stand to learn a bit more, though admittedly, it is a work of fiction.

Far away for some indeed, I spent the holidays 200km away from Rosellò and just 4km from the french border :D.

Well that was something, you have a knack for writting thought-patterns it seems. We saw it before, of course, but now that you control Geoffrey it is more evident.

I'm glad someone brought up Lily, when she first appeared I thought she would turn out pretty interesting to watch, but I must admit I forgot about her.

Our new duke has a tough road ahead and if he can go along the twisting and winding path without bloodletting I bet in this timeline he will achieve eternal fame. Specially if he ends up carving an independent realm that lasts for several centuries...

On a sidenote, I've been playing a game with León in which Hugues inherits France early on an goes absolutely berserk, getting all the laws to max, assembling an OP council, recovering Normandy, conquering a duchy from the HRE, some counties in Spain (to my great frustration), and a chunk of north África, ending his days on a succesful crusade. Quite the contrast huh...

That's why I had to say for some! I know I have some readers in France or that area!

Thanks for that compliment. I worked through it in my head and tried to figure out how he'd handle it. With our first real action with Geoffrey, I wanted to get it right!

Geoffrey's goal is to use politics to achieve his ends. But he's also plenty willing to use force to achieve his ends - he just wants the odds squarely in his favor!

Hugues is so young in the 1066 start... I think he's only nine years old, so he's got a bit more growing he can do. With a good mentor and a little luck, he could turn out to be a good character! I actually hadn't seen many games where he inherits though - he seemed to be a popular target for assassination as a child by Robert of Burgundy (since it would make Robert next in line). But this was a rare game for me - Capetian rulers frequently get deposed in my games.

Looks like the new Duke d'Anjou has hit the ground running! I like others have noted his apparent lack of grief over his father's passing, but I'm willing to give him a pass on this one. It strikes me as typical medieval behavior, and the mutual opinion malus the two shared doesn't help. There's a time to mourn later regardless, as the young man has three ducal titles to sort out and synchronize (if in no other way than the succession laws). As for the king, I'll be amazed if the old man lives for another year...

Looking forward to the next chapter of this already excellent second book!

Geoffrey had a base and a plan - this just accelerates things into motion. The next chapter is going to show some of his... feelings toward his father. Let's say certain memories stand out above others.

No comment on the king.

Not to get too off topic, but I have always enjoyed the interpretation (I don't remember if it was Strauss himself or Christopher Nadon channeling him) that Cyrus's own perfection is itself a condemnation of empire - that not even the most virtuous monarch can make empire work, and thus we ought to re-evaluate the irrational and unmeritocratic society the Persians began with. Cyrus, the just judge par excellence, destroys law and virtue in the process of building a politics based on reason and merit. Perhaps, on Xenophon's account, this republican/oligarchic virtue of the polis is the best we can do in political life, as politics is always founded upon contingency and competition. The Cyropaedia, then, along with some of the dialogues in the Memorabilia on the political and philosophic life, suggests that the political life is not nearly as superior to private life as a superficial comparison between Cyrus and Socrates would have you believe.

Of course, Xenophon is thinking about the choice of life for the most virtuous man - Geoffrey, like Foulques, may have powerful political virtues, but he lacks entkratia, self-rule. As such, just like his father, he can only rule well when he is not overcome by lust or greed. While Geoffrey should have looked to Cyrus's example (incidentally, the Cyropaedia is the only book Machiavelli explicitly recommends), now he is formed as a man he would learn more from the Hiero. What must the tyrant do if he desires to be truly loved? Benefit his subjects, naturally. How can the tyrant benefit his subjects? To some extent, this must be at the expense of other cities. Watch out, Berry, Brittany, and beyond...

All interesting points. (As noted above, I'll need to take a look at Cyrus). Not overcome by lust though? Well... that might be a problem... ;)

I would say Geoffrey's idol in this story has been Octavian/Augustus, just based on his own vanity of ascending to power fairly young, due to his own political scheming (and possibly milking his family name) rather than military prowess making him feel similar. He's got a long way to go to reach such levels but it gives him something to aim for.

To all - the next chapter follows. I spent far too much time over the past week searching for proper medieval burial practices for it and it's probably still not right. But hopefully the overall impact of the scene overshadows any inaccuracies present.

As noted above - we're spending a good deal of time in a relatively short time frame. There was a lot to cover here with the end of Foulques and the beginning of Geoffrey. Plus the AI decided to do something that required my action. Don't worry, we won't be stuck at the end of 1109/beginning of 1110 forever.

Thanks for all the comments and feedback, as usual!
 
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Chapter 140 - December 1109

JabberJock14

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Before Plantagenet - Chapter 140
December 1109 - Fontevraud, France

1109_Agnes.jpg


Agnes stood, silent, looking over the linen-wrapped body before her.

The crypt was not quiet - Etiennette’s muffled sobs provided a little bit of noise. The Karling woman had come with her to the bishopric of Fontevraud, where Foulques was interred, waiting for burial. And now she knelt at the stone slab that held Foulques’ body, weeping as Agnes stood watch.

He could have been laid to rest days ago, but they waited for Geoffrey to arrive from the south. Though she would have been within her rights to not wait - the time between the messages being received and Geoffrey’s arrival would be nearly three weeks - she decided to do so.

She had been ensured the process used to preserve her father’s body would leave it in a proper condition for burial - methods that dated back to ancient societies, from thousands of years before.

Agnes knew little of the process itself, though his organs had been removed as she had been asked if they were to be buried with him or someplace else. As her father had left no orders for them to be buried separately, she kept her father together.

He had been wrapped in cloth and laid on the stone slab before her, which lay in the crypt under the church in Fontevraud, a town near the keep in Angers, Anjou. When Geoffrey arrived, the Iron Duke would come to rest in a stone sarcophagus - becoming the first prominent individual buried in the newly constructed abbey.

1109_Fontevraud.jpg


But now she waited. And she mourned, in more hushed tones than her friend. The presence of her father had long provided her with an odd comfort - something that she imagined few shared. But as long as Foulques was alive, her power was secure in Anjou. And more than that, her freedom was not curtailed.

With Geoffrey… she did not know. Her brother had long professed his desire to bed her, though he had refrained from such talk the last few times they had seen each other. She could only pray he had moved on from such things.

And whether he would allow her to maintain her authority was another matter. Geoffrey’s poor relationship with his wife Marguerite was well known, so Agnes doubted he would invest her with a great deal of power… but she did not know exactly what he might do.

Which ultimately, is what troubled her. She did not know anything of what was to come next. And unlike before, she had no Alearde to act as her eyes and ears. She did not have Godfrey as chancellor to come to her aid - not when his position was as lost as his mind. Nor did she have Guilhem, who she could always count on to stand behind her. And her husband… well given her brother’s opinion of him, he would be no help.

Her allies gone, and now her father - Agnes was alone. And it was terrifying.

The sound of the heavy door opening, following by a flickering of candles and a slight breeze that jostled the skirt of her dress caught Agnes’ attention. She knew Herve and Foulques the Younger were waiting above but when she glanced back, she noticed a trio of cloaked individual approaching. Walking almost in lockstep, amidst the flickering lights of the crypt, swords rustling at the sides of two of the men, they sent a chill down her spine.

She almost breathed a sigh of relief when the hood on the cloak of the leader was dropped to reveal her brother Geoffrey, while the other two turned out to be Alias of Perigord and Prince-Bishop Leonard.

His usual entourage, she noted. It was hardly a surprise to see them all here.

Perhaps he expected her to run to him for he paused for a moment before her. He did flash a smile however, and then closed the distance, embracing her tightly and kissing her on the forehead.

“I am glad to see you well sister,” he said.

“As am I,” Agnes said. “I was concerned at how long news would take to reach you… if it would reach you… and if the king would let you depart.”

“The king is ill,” Geoffrey said. “He may already no longer be with us. When I left, our brother by law, Prince Henri, was en route.”

“Do you not wish to be there if the king passes?” Agnes wondered.

“There is no question of legitimacy with Henri, and his child brother is hardly a threat,” Geoffrey said. “But if anything were to happen, the safest place to be would be in my lands, with my levy. And… the people of Anjou need to see their new duke.”

Agnes glanced beside her as she felt Etiennette clumsily brush up against her shoulder. Tears still on her cheeks, Etiennette looked to Geoffrey, then dropped to a knee before him.

1109_Etiennette.jpg


“My lord,” she said. “Congratulations on your investment as Duke of Anjou. And… my condolences for your loss.”

“Thank you, my dear,” Geoffrey replied as he motioned for her to rise. Then he looked beyond them to Foulques. Geoffrey approached and took a long look at the long, linen-wrapped body.

“So here he is,” Geoffrey said. “The Iron Duke. My father.”

Alias lowered his head while Prince-Bishop Leonard did the same while uttering a prayer. All the while, Geoffrey stood silent, looking over the body, his breathing shallow.

“May I have a some time alone?” Geoffrey asked. “Just me, my father and my sister.”

Alias and Leonard obliged, each passing on their condolences to Agnes before their departure. Etiennette dawdled for a minute, taking another long gaze at her dead lover, before slowly shuffling her way out of the crypt with the others.

“This is clearly affecting her,” Geoffrey noted after the door closed.

“She loved him,” Agnes said.

“Our finest work then,” Geoffrey said. “Helping her become elevated to his mistress.”

“And ruining the life of Haldora in process,” Agnes noted.

“We did not ruin anything,” Geoffrey said. “Father never liked Haldora, for whatever reason. He would have taken a new lover eventually, as he did with Ness. We just steered him toward Etiennette for a time… and you cemented your place in the duchy as a result.”

She did not like the way Geoffrey talked so nonchalantly about their former stepmother’s dismissal. Agnes understood his point - their father never did care for Haldora - but part of her did wonder, had they done nothing, would perhaps somehow Foulques have eventually come around to her?

“How do you fare?” he asked her.

“I tried to prepare myself for this,” Agnes said. “Especially as father grew weak over the past few months. But… I thought perhaps he would fare as our aunt, Aureade, has. Weak, but still living, with a sharp mind. Instead…”

She held back tears of her own. Geoffrey may have been her brother… but she did not wish to show weakness in front of him. He must have sensed her struggles however, as he gently rubbed her back.

“I heard you suspect the nun of foul play?” he asked.

Agnes shook her head. “I do my due diligence. But no, I don’t truly suspect her. She has been too good to us to turn. I think it more likely she was an angel, sent to protect and guide father, than to serve him for four decades and then murder a weak, declining old man.”

She knew her brother tended to be skeptical of such things, so she added: “You think me mad for believing she was an angel.”

“You would not be the first to believe such things,” Geoffrey said. “Not of her… but that angels do sometimes walk among us.”

“But I did not say others think me mad,” Agnes replied. “I said you.”

Geoffrey smirked and gently stroked her cheek. “I have missed you sister.”

She pulled away once more and turned back to her father’s body.

“Regardless, it has not been easy,” Agnes admitted. “Father and I did not always agree, but he entrusted me with a great deal. Most men in his position would never have given me such power.”

Geoffrey rolled his eyes. “Many lords have women rule in their stead when they are away.”

“Their wives, Geoffrey,” Agnes noted. “If they are young, then perhaps their mother. But almost never their daughters. Because an unmarried daughter old enough to rule… there must be a slight against her. Father overlooked mine.”

“He overlooked nothing,” Geoffrey said. “Father was not charitable. Your skill was clear, which is why he made you regent. If you were an imbecile, he never would have let you sniff power.”

“I do not doubt my abilities,” Agnes said as she looked back at him. “But I doubt my opportunities. You may say I was deserving, but that is often not nearly enough.”

“Sister,” Geoffrey began as he tilted her chin up so that her eyes met his, “You are one of the most beautiful, intelligent women in the realm. Anyone who would overlook you would be a fool, undeserving of their title.”

That uneasy feeling she had around Geoffrey returned, so she quickly turned from him. A change of subject was quickly needed. And there was one readily available.

“What of you, brother?” Agnes asked. “How do you fare, now that father has died?”

“I did not think he would ever die,” Geoffrey admitted. “Even with his infirmity, I thought somehow… he would continue to hold on. As you believed. But now he is gone. And…”

His voice trailed off. Agnes turned back to him. “And?”

“And… that is it. He is gone,” Geoffrey said.

“That cannot be it,” Agnes insisted. “He was our father, like it or not. And he had a large influence on our lives.”

“Perhaps it affects you more than me,” Geoffrey said. “He always thought better of you.”

Her brow rose, and she could hear the bitterness in his voice. While she wanted him to speak the truth about his feelings toward her father, she did not want him thinking ill of her for it. That could prove disastrous for her.

“He did care for you Geoffrey,” Agnes told him, taking hold of his gloved hand as she did so.

“No, he cared that I did not do as he,” Geoffrey said. “Even as I went from a man with not one knight to my name to a lord of two of the realm’s most prosperous duchies. All he could do was belittle my efforts because they were not what he thought they should be.”

“He did support you,” Agnes said. “Even if you two did not see eye to eye.”

“Support?” Geoffrey scoffed. “He offered more support to my son than he ever did to me. Not once did he look me in the eye and tell me that he thought my accomplishments impressive. Not once did he admit that I had done well. I conquered two duchies and told the king’s council that I still needed to learn to walk!”

Geoffrey slammed his fist down, resulting in a large crack that echoed through the crypt. When the pair looked down, they saw that Geoffrey had made contact with their father’s leg, down by the ankle. Based on it’s now awkward angled position, it was clear the blow had broken or dislocated the bone.

Agnes stood, mouth open before slowly covering it. Geoffrey’s cheeks reddened and he lowered his head - she wanted to believe in shame over his actions and not guilt over reveling in it.

“I…. I will have Alias find someone here who can… reposition father correctly,” he said. “And I do so out of obligation to him, and to save face, which are the only reasons he ever helped me.”

With that he turned quickly, his cloak billowing in the small gust of wind his spin had created, and walked quickly from the crypt, his footsteps heavy enough to make a sound. When he reached the stairs, he turned back to Agnes.

“This never happened,” he told her. “Father’s leg was not broken by my hand and my feelings toward him are nothing but complementary, especially here, in Anjou. Do you understand?”

His tone surprised her. Geoffrey was always sweet to her, overly complimentary and inviting. It made sense, since he desired to bed her despite their blood. Or because of it.

But here, he was not sweet. There was no honey in his question. It was venom, spit with a voice that reminded her of the man who lay, now broken, beside her.

“Of… of course brother,” Agnes replied.

He did not thank her, instead marching up the stairs from the crypt before the opening door and slamming it behind him.

Agnes felt her stomach clench. She had feared for her safety before - that Geoffrey, when safe in power, would eventually feel confident enough that he would force himself on him.

She did not know if he would, even now. The tales she heard from Bordeaux told the story of a kind, charitable man, who made his vassals feel valued, and could charm practically anyone, even those with reason to hate him.

But the look on his face, and the sound of his voice she knew one thing - if someone crossed him they would suffer.

It would be no different than if they had crossed the Iron Duke himself.

......

Note: Finding good stuff on medieval burial practices is hard! I read spent far too much of my last week searching for info and read much too much of the, shall we say, "stinky" way William the Conquerer went out.

Also the game presents Fontevraud as a town at the 1066 start, but it looks like it was actually created about 1100 with the Abbey constructed around 1110. I decided to speed things up a little there for this to make sense, since as I said, it exists in the game at this time.
 
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Once again going through the motions in public and laying bare his hate when he's alone. What a piece of work.

Careful Jabber. Someone with that high a Diplo score shouldn't be so easy to dislike lol.
 
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Agnes is not the only one disturbed by Duke Geoffrey's behaviour. When he requested privacy for himself and Agnes, I admit I had a moment of sheer horror and muttered "Don't you DARE seduce your sister here." He fortunately obliged, mostly, but it's a testament to your ability to turn main characters we root for into very, very complicated people we occasionally distrust or dislike.

Going off of that, after pondering his... erm... accident with his father's corpse, I admit another horrible thought popped into my head. I recall a certain event one occasionally gets when a rival passes away... I'm sure Count Alias will only be sent to repair the damage, but I can't be certain he won't do anything else with Foulques' body, or his head... your cryptic statement, "Plus the AI decided to do something that required my action." makes me more suspicious than usual of Geoffrey.

A suspenseful chapter overall, I'm looking forward to further developments!

EDIT: Also, bravo and well-done in regards to your research! Yes, I've heard of the disaster that was William the Conqueror's burial, my apologies you had to sift through that horror, but I'm sure you learned a lot. Perhaps more than you wanted from the sound of things.
 
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I find it very interesting we have this episode from Agnes' point of view, and I find it a very convincing write-up. Especially the various fears preying on her. That just felt very real to me.

I also find it interesting in that all we have is Agnes' view of Geoffrey and his reported words. He comes across very harsh here, but I would wager Geoffrey is putting on an act, even with her. There is clearly turmoil going on under that facade. He leaks out in his anger, but it is there.

What strikes me the most though is how Geoffrey's sudden outlet of violence - smashing something - is so very Foulques.
 
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Specialist290

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With that he turned quickly, his cloak billowing in the small gust of wind his spin had created, and walked quickly from the crypt, his footsteps heavy enough to make a sound. When he reached the stairs, he turned back to Agnes.

“This never happened,” he told her. “Father’s leg was not broken by my hand and my feelings toward him are nothing but complementary, especially here, in Anjou. Do you understand?”

His tone surprised her. Geoffrey was always sweet to her, overly complimentary and inviting. It made sense, since he desired to bed her despite their blood. Or because of it.

But here, he was not sweet. There was no honey in his question. It was venom, spit with a voice that reminded her of the man who lay, now broken, beside her.

“Of… of course brother,” Agnes replied.

He did not thank her, instead marching up the stairs from the crypt before the opening door and slamming it behind him.

It's a rare thing indeed when a single line of dialogue makes me completely reevaluate a character I thought I had a handle on, but Geoffrey's line here has accomplished just that. We get a glimpse behind the facade, and it is terrifying.

Worse still -- Geoffrey is much too smart to have simply let this slip by accident. My read is that he's basically telling her (without overtly saying so) that he knows she's afraid of him, and that if he can't get what he wants with flattery and honeyed words then he'll play on those fears until she's terrorized into giving him what he wants or she simply breaks. That is an incredibly dark and manipulative thing to threaten someone with, even given the world they live in.
 
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We see the true Geoffrey and he is his father's son. Outwardly he is all sugary but his real self is just as hard and ruthless as his father was. Is this the demon his mother spoke of? Looks like we are in for a fun ride with Duke Geoffrey.
 
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Bullfilter

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Yes, the reaction at the end by Geoffrey is threatening and surprisingly harsh to Agnes. And, as others have mentioned, signal his personal version of Foulques’ hardness.

But, because we do get it from Agnes’ perspective, there is also the chance that it is one of those exceptions that makes the rule: maybe Geoffrey is far more emotional and affected by this moment of undeniable truth and reality than he thought he would be or cares to admit. That it causes him to lash out, literally blindly. On his father’s body and then at Agnes, who has seen his venom, emotion and lapse of control: pushed away by her again (some frustration) and shame over what he has just done. Which makes him seem immature and (as only Foulques, even in death, can do) childish and unworthy.

I think others having such impressions of him are his greatest fears. And it is the legacy Foulques has bequeathed him. It will drive him to great ambition and (almost certainly) terrible deeds justified by these pervasive sensitivities. Foulques’ ghost isn’t required: he will live within Geoffrey’s mind, his sarcastic and deriding voice decrying his every achievement far more harshly than he really did in life. That is Geoffrey’s curse, and he will carry it with him always.

Very interesting episode. These will be turbulent times: and I look forward to seeing what Geoffrey makes of his reaction and state of mind, when he next gets the opportunity!
 
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I did not expect that behaviour from Geoffrey... especially towards his sister... Hubris is coming
 
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Badesumofu

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I liked that we got that chapter from Agnes' perspective. It keeps us guessing a little about Geoffrey, although it's also made me realise that Geoffrey to a point actually maintains his mask internally most of the time. Seeing it appear to drop from Agnes' perspective is quite troubling, and we can't be sure how deliberate the whole performance was. Much to think about.
 
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No seduction attempt, but I'm not sure Agnes prefers this version of Geoffrey. I think he starts feeling some pressure he puts on himself, and breaking his father's bones is a short vent of that pressure.

Something is going to happen, soon.
 
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cm_spitfire

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Hmm. I like the idea of an outwardly confident, personable, charismatic leader who is tormented inside by his own, potentially dark, maybe more like cynical, perspective on life. And with Geoffrey, the spectre of his father (or at least G’s PERSPECTIVE of his father’s spectre) looming overhead on every decision made - this shapes up to be a cracking book 2!
 
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Asantahene

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That incident with the ankle and the aftermath...a shocking turn as was Geoffrey’s reaction. A mask slipping or, as @Bullfilter expertly argues, just the expression of a young man under a lot of emotional duress. I’m inclined to believe the latter for the same as Agnes: Geoffrey i# genuinely loved. That wouldn’t be the case if he was some sort of dastard :D

But we shall see. Either way this new coolness between brother and sister does not auger well for Agnes. Not at all.
 
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JabberJock14

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Once again going through the motions in public and laying bare his hate when he's alone. What a piece of work.

Careful Jabber. Someone with that high a Diplo score shouldn't be so easy to dislike lol.

That dislike is a concern - and it will be harder to mitigate because his sweet words usually are going to be accompanied by his own thoughts. And when they're not, they're from the eyes of his sister, who knows him well and has reasons for concerns. So it's a fine line I'm going to have to work. I will note that this was a very specific set of circumstances for the two principles in this chapter, which have them both on edge.

Agnes is not the only one disturbed by Duke Geoffrey's behaviour. When he requested privacy for himself and Agnes, I admit I had a moment of sheer horror and muttered "Don't you DARE seduce your sister here." He fortunately obliged, mostly, but it's a testament to your ability to turn main characters we root for into very, very complicated people we occasionally distrust or dislike.

Going off of that, after pondering his... erm... accident with his father's corpse, I admit another horrible thought popped into my head. I recall a certain event one occasionally gets when a rival passes away... I'm sure Count Alias will only be sent to repair the damage, but I can't be certain he won't do anything else with Foulques' body, or his head... your cryptic statement, "Plus the AI decided to do something that required my action." makes me more suspicious than usual of Geoffrey.

A suspenseful chapter overall, I'm looking forward to further developments!

EDIT: Also, bravo and well-done in regards to your research! Yes, I've heard of the disaster that was William the Conqueror's burial, my apologies you had to sift through that horror, but I'm sure you learned a lot. Perhaps more than you wanted from the sound of things.

I thought about that scene and how it would go. But no, no seduction here. Agnes certainly feared it though - which is why it had to be front and center.

In this case, the event is not related to Foulques. We'll be getting into that in the near future though.

For all that reading, I don't think I got enough! Embalming seemed to be more popular than I'd have expected based on what I read, and my original scene had Foulques in a coffin before being transferred to the stone sarcophagus, but I read that would have been very wrong. So at least I got that out of it. But yeah, William's case... man, you'd expect more for one of history's most influential figures.

I find it very interesting we have this episode from Agnes' point of view, and I find it a very convincing write-up. Especially the various fears preying on her. That just felt very real to me.

I also find it interesting in that all we have is Agnes' view of Geoffrey and his reported words. He comes across very harsh here, but I would wager Geoffrey is putting on an act, even with her. There is clearly turmoil going on under that facade. He leaks out in his anger, but it is there.

What strikes me the most though is how Geoffrey's sudden outlet of violence - smashing something - is so very Foulques.

Yeah I originally had this chapter from Geoffrey's perspective, but changed it early on. I feel like Geoffrey's feelings toward his father would be too difficult to put to words, so I figured showing, though Agnes' eyes would be better. Plus there's the underlying part Agnes/Geoffrey that adds that bit of suspension if we don't know what Geoffrey's going to do here.

I have aimed to keep some similarities between father and son. Geoffrey restrains himself... most times. And you can see how much he is invested in maintaining the idea that he's different than his father... whether that's for his own reputation or his own mental well-being is up for debate.

It's a rare thing indeed when a single line of dialogue makes me completely reevaluate a character I thought I had a handle on, but Geoffrey's line here has accomplished just that. We get a glimpse behind the facade, and it is terrifying.

Worse still -- Geoffrey is much too smart to have simply let this slip by accident. My read is that he's basically telling her (without overtly saying so) that he knows she's afraid of him, and that if he can't get what he wants with flattery and honeyed words then he'll play on those fears until she's terrorized into giving him what he wants or she simply breaks. That is an incredibly dark and manipulative thing to threaten someone with, even given the world they live in.

I almost wonder if it went too far! But Geoffrey has to have a bit of... ruthlessness toward him to do what he's done. The thing is Geoffrey wants to create advantages for himself. And many of those come from beating opposition when they are down. He took Aquitaine from Alberic. He declared for Poitou when Patricia was weakened by internal revolts. He went for Angouleme when Peronelle was weakened as well. It just ends up being a difficult balance between someone who is "charitable" yet is a ruthless opportunist.

I think you have a good read there. He knows what he can do, and he knows she knows it. So in a less than good moment for him, that slips out. But we'll be coming back to this moment in the future, since we haven't seen the last of Agnes and Geoffrey together.

We see the true Geoffrey and he is his father's son. Outwardly he is all sugary but his real self is just as hard and ruthless as his father was. Is this the demon his mother spoke of? Looks like we are in for a fun ride with Duke Geoffrey.

His demon blood for sure. :) He is Foulques' son. Methods may differ but ultimately... they have many similar qualities.

Yes, the reaction at the end by Geoffrey is threatening and surprisingly harsh to Agnes. And, as others have mentioned, signal his personal version of Foulques’ hardness.

But, because we do get it from Agnes’ perspective, there is also the chance that it is one of those exceptions that makes the rule: maybe Geoffrey is far more emotional and affected by this moment of undeniable truth and reality than he thought he would be or cares to admit. That it causes him to lash out, literally blindly. On his father’s body and then at Agnes, who has seen his venom, emotion and lapse of control: pushed away by her again (some frustration) and shame over what he has just done. Which makes him seem immature and (as only Foulques, even in death, can do) childish and unworthy.

I think others having such impressions of him are his greatest fears. And it is the legacy Foulques has bequeathed him. It will drive him to great ambition and (almost certainly) terrible deeds justified by these pervasive sensitivities. Foulques’ ghost isn’t required: he will live within Geoffrey’s mind, his sarcastic and deriding voice decrying his every achievement far more harshly than he really did in life. That is Geoffrey’s curse, and he will carry it with him always.

Very interesting episode. These will be turbulent times: and I look forward to seeing what Geoffrey makes of his reaction and state of mind, when he next gets the opportunity!

Excellent reading. Very excellent. You tie everyone points together well and then add your own on the mitigating factors. I just nodded the whole time I read this! :D

We'll see as we go forward Geoffrey is not opposed to having some "Foulques" in him. But it's to be saved for special moments. This wasn't one of those moments.

And we will see Geoffrey return to this moment in the future.

I did not expect that behaviour from Geoffrey... especially towards his sister... Hubris is coming

It wasn't a good moment for him. His father's death left a lot of unresolved feelings. They come out here and one thing spirals into another.

I liked that we got that chapter from Agnes' perspective. It keeps us guessing a little about Geoffrey, although it's also made me realise that Geoffrey to a point actually maintains his mask internally most of the time. Seeing it appear to drop from Agnes' perspective is quite troubling, and we can't be sure how deliberate the whole performance was. Much to think about.

That is what I was going for. Adds a bit of mystery to the scene and the characters. At least for now.

No seduction attempt, but I'm not sure Agnes prefers this version of Geoffrey. I think he starts feeling some pressure he puts on himself, and breaking his father's bones is a short vent of that pressure.

Something is going to happen, soon.

Hmm... Agnes is probably wondering "why do I have to choose between those two options??"

Things will happen. Though my original plan for Geoffrey's early actions got delayed by someone's stupidity. But we'll get to that in a bit.

Hmm. I like the idea of an outwardly confident, personable, charismatic leader who is tormented inside by his own, potentially dark, maybe more like cynical, perspective on life. And with Geoffrey, the spectre of his father (or at least G’s PERSPECTIVE of his father’s spectre) looming overhead on every decision made - this shapes up to be a cracking book 2!

Well, you will get that here, I think. Geoffrey's got plenty of unresolved issues, and some of them cannot be resolved (he'll never get an apology from Foulques, for example, for his dressing down of Geoffrey to the king's council). And there will be other things that pop up in the future.

That incident with the ankle and the aftermath...a shocking turn as was Geoffrey’s reaction. A mask slipping or, as @Bullfilter expertly argues, just the expression of a young man under a lot of emotional duress. I’m inclined to believe the latter for the same as Agnes: Geoffrey i# genuinely loved. That wouldn’t be the case if he was some sort of dastard :D

But we shall see. Either way this new coolness between brother and sister does not auger well for Agnes. Not at all.

I think it's both? Pressure causes his mask to slip off a bit. We've seen that type of ruthlessness before from him - when he bitterly demanded Marguerite abandon her daughter to come with him and escape the pseudo prison Foulques put her in. I think it's telling that Marguerite and Foulques both have had that effect on him - the cynical view would be to say those are the two people he has been unable to get control over. A generous reading would be they've wronged him in ways few others could have and he's had a hard time getting over it, leading him to not great decisions.

Oh, we haven't seen the last of Agnes/Geoffrey. Trust me.

To all- the next two chapters could easily have been one. But they would have been too long, so they'll get split, the first of which will go out either tonight or tomorrow. There are quite a few things to address in the next sections after all.

Thanks as always for your comments and feedback! In these early days of Geoffrey, they are especially helpful as they help me gauge how well I'm balancing the aspects of his personality.
 
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