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Specialist290

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It looked like for a moment there that Foulques and Geoffrey would have a moment to reconcile their differences over a mutual loss... Such a shame :(

Guilhem may not have had the limelight as much as some of the other characters in Foulques's life, but he's certainly been a constant presence. His death is just one more reminder that Foulques's own time is drawing to a close.
 
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Age is not something Foulques can beat though ... unless one changes the nature of the game, which perhaps he already did so...

It is clearly hard for Foulques though, to deal with his physical situation. His body weakens, and his mind ... his mind struggles to adapt.

I do not doubt that elsewhere folks are wagering how much longer the Iron Duke can live, how long before he rusts and falls apart.
 
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With infirm, soon comes incapable. Well, at least he outlive his IRL counterpart.
 
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Content, Infirm, and Stressed all in a short period. Something of a shame you didn't have high enough stats anymore to give Foulqueson Diligent, but oh well, Brave is pretty good too. Although it increases his chances to die in battle if he leads troops, so there's that.

Picking up Content via that event is working out nicely. Foulques is ready for death, happy with his life, and in a good position to confer some of his wisdom to others before he goes. Preparing the realm for life after the Iron Duke. It will be interesting to see the new ruler/heir dynamic and what becomes of Marguerite when Geoffrey rules. Geoffrey's realm will be large enough that he will have to have 'powerful vassals' where Foulques hasn't even had a vassal capable of rebelling until very recently. So it's going to be a whole new world, really. How many notable people from 1066 are even still alive now (other than Adalmode)?
 
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An interesting transitional passage there - especially with Foulques the grandson. Geoffrey going to war in Iberia? Fears for his survival and tutoring the grandson for an earlier than expected rulership? Hints, or red herrings? :confused:;) Could be either, of course, which I imagine is the point. Life without Foulques Snr: your dear readers will be no better placed to cope with it than the characters in this grand story! :eek: But, like them, we will carry on and see what the next phase brings. :D
 
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Foulques' pride once again gets in the way of reconciling with his son. Good to see that Godfrey did not abandon his father.

Nice to see that Foulques finally had someone he could tell his stories to before he dies. And also good to see him open up about what has driven through his life.

I presume that the vultures may be gathering waiting for Foulques to pass. Not sure what they will get with Godfrey ready to replace Foulques. Hopefuly Godfrey does not meet with a similar or worse fate that the king and Toulouse had previously in Iberia.
 
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PVT Ascoobis

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It's overdue but good to see Foulques finally imparting some lessons about life to someone important to him.

Infirm is a sign the end is coming. But, he has yet things to accomplish and doubtless sees a role yet to play.

Poor Guilhem. He had a rough go of it.

Edit: I'm mildly surprised to see that of the 83 pages in this thread, the last quarter have been the 7 years of Hughes reign. He seems a newcomer yet in ways that I struggle to put into words.
 
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That happened with my normal character after he reached ninety years or so. My youngest family members were no longer close relatives etc. I believe there were at least five generations alive at once by the time he reached 100. CKII isn't designed for that sort of thing.

Foulques is dying then. Infirm usually means less than a ear, usually less than six months and on occasion, pretty much as soon as you click the accept button and time starts moving forwards again. Well, he had a pretty good run and Jaspert's offer and his refusal was his symbolic acceptance of death and thus, with his soul ready, his body obliges. I wonder what will happen though. Who will be there? I hope Agnes and Geoffrey. Not sure what there is to say between the three of them now though.

No, the game isn't built for such long-live characters. Though, it did happen on occasion pre-Reaper's Due. In my Noob Island game I had some really, really long lived rulers. It's kind of get boring. That's much more a rarity now with Reaper's Due.

Infirm often can mean your time is running down, but it doesn't guarantee it. In this AAR I've noticed quite a few infirm characters hanging on. One lasted for about 10 years, incredibly! Foulques doesn't have another decade though.

It's funny though cause I turned down the immortality offer and infirm popped up nearly right after that. It was immortality offer, steward offer, infirmity.

I am tempted to drop a hint as to who will be there at the end... but I can't. I don't want to spoil it.

It looked like for a moment there that Foulques and Geoffrey would have a moment to reconcile their differences over a mutual loss... Such a shame :(

Guilhem may not have had the limelight as much as some of the other characters in Foulques's life, but he's certainly been a constant presence. His death is just one more reminder that Foulques's own time is drawing to a close.

I've been careful, perhaps too careful, not to neatly tie up Foulques relationships. There's change, growth, perhaps acceptance, but often not quite the catharsis we want. Because I like things to remain complicated. That isn't always the case - Beatritz I thought had a nice mutual acceptance on her death - but with Alearde and Geoffrey there's quite a bit left unsaid.

Agreed on Guilhem. He's just been a steady, guiding hand. And I was surprised at how loyal he was by the end. I couldn't remember him ever getting that way... it just sort of happened. He just became a rock that Foulques kind of took for granted. A small note in the next chapter is a reminder of how we probably shouldn't have!

Age is not something Foulques can beat though ... unless one changes the nature of the game, which perhaps he already did so...

It is clearly hard for Foulques though, to deal with his physical situation. His body weakens, and his mind ... his mind struggles to adapt.

I do not doubt that elsewhere folks are wagering how much longer the Iron Duke can live, how long before he rusts and falls apart.

No, no, he can't beat age. But I think he'd argue he's given it as good a run as any, especially given how long he's lasted compared to others!

But yes, it's a different kind of growth. One that will continue in the next chapter, as you'd expect, since his infirmity isn't going away. And I'd imagine plenty are looking to see when Foulques does finally pass on - if for no other reason they'll have to contend with arguably an even more powerful and ambitious lord in his stead.

With infirm, soon comes incapable. Well, at least he outlive his IRL counterpart.

Yes, Foulques does make it past April 1109. How much further... well the next chapter is set in October 1109. Beyond that? We'll see.

Content, Infirm, and Stressed all in a short period. Something of a shame you didn't have high enough stats anymore to give Foulqueson Diligent, but oh well, Brave is pretty good too. Although it increases his chances to die in battle if he leads troops, so there's that.

Picking up Content via that event is working out nicely. Foulques is ready for death, happy with his life, and in a good position to confer some of his wisdom to others before he goes. Preparing the realm for life after the Iron Duke. It will be interesting to see the new ruler/heir dynamic and what becomes of Marguerite when Geoffrey rules. Geoffrey's realm will be large enough that he will have to have 'powerful vassals' where Foulques hasn't even had a vassal capable of rebelling until very recently. So it's going to be a whole new world, really. How many notable people from 1066 are even still alive now (other than Adalmode)?

Yeah, I'd have preferred the ambitious/diligent one because I'd have taken the stressed trait. (I might have even been tempted for ambitious since rivalry at Foulques age is whatever). But he got something based on his martial trait I think, so I rolled what what came.

That content trait did play into my mind when writing Foulques in these chapters. I don't want to say he's done - because he'll always see something worth focusing on. But his energies have definitely waned.

It will be a work in progress with Geoffrey/Marguerite and the vassals. I have ideas, especially based on what happened in game play, but we'll see how those ideas translate to the digital paper. There are some... uh... complex things in the future of some of our characters. Some of it my doing. Others... the result of others.

A very good question on the 1066 question! I went and did a look at some prominent names. In France, Foulques, King Hugues, Eudes Karling (Lord of Vermandois) and Champagne were all around in 1066. So is one of my frequent Foulques marriage choices, Aenor de Thouars. Foulques is the oldest prominent figure, but there are some older barons. Hugues of Burgundy is also kicking around, still out of power.

In England no one of note is alive. All the lords during the Saxon invasion are dead. House Godwin has one major lord left, a child in Kent. Robert kicks off in March 1109 (he will pass without any real fanfare as the next chapter may have a brief mention of him, at best)

And since I'm such a big fan of the The Rightful King, I am sad to report House of Wessex and House Hwicce are both no more. (The latter was hinted at during my Norman interlude but that's official now)

In the HRE, not only is the original Salian Emperor dead, the line is off the throne entirely.

Also of random note, the current king of Scotland is this guy:

1109_Scottish_King.jpg


I enjoy that because he's the son of King Lulach... who was the stepson to Macbeth. Yep, that Macbeth. I fully admit my fascination with that comes from growing up watching the TV show Gargoyles, which despite its presence of magic and mythical creatures was more accurate to the timeline of the real Macbeth than the Shakespearean play.

And besides, good riddance to that cannibal royal house. :)

So yeah, not many prominent figures still around.

An interesting transitional passage there - especially with Foulques the grandson. Geoffrey going to war in Iberia? Fears for his survival and tutoring the grandson for an earlier than expected rulership? Hints, or red herrings? :confused:;) Could be either, of course, which I imagine is the point. Life without Foulques Snr: your dear readers will be no better placed to cope with it than the characters in this grand story! :eek: But, like them, we will carry on and see what the next phase brings. :D

You'll just have to wait and find out on those questions! ;)

In all seriousness, I feel like those questions are Foulques the Younger voicing some legitimate fear and insecurity. His father is not known as a warrior, Iberian campaigns have gone poorly lately and his grandfather is clearly falling apart before his eyes. It's only natural to have a "Wait, what if they all die at once and I've got to administer 1/3-half the realm!"

Yep, I now know what happens early on. But I'm still figuring out how to portray those events. It will be a process for us all.

Foulques' pride once again gets in the way of reconciling with his son. Good to see that Godfrey did not abandon his father.

Nice to see that Foulques finally had someone he could tell his stories to before he dies. And also good to see him open up about what has driven through his life.

I presume that the vultures may be gathering waiting for Foulques to pass. Not sure what they will get with Godfrey ready to replace Foulques. Hopefuly Godfrey does not meet with a similar or worse fate that the king and Toulouse had previously in Iberia.

He can't help himself. Characters can adapt, but it can be hard to change that flaw. But Foulques the Younger is, in many ways, the son Foulques wished for. Of course who is to say he'd have turned out the same way if he was Foulques' son. Foulquesson is quite skilled himself, but his father barely addresses him. :(

And that is a concern with Geoffrey. The AI was determined to make me sweat.

It's overdue but good to see Foulques finally imparting some lessons about life to someone important to him.

Infirm is a sign the end is coming. But, he has yet things to accomplish and doubtless sees a role yet to play.

Poor Guilhem. He had a rough go of it.

Yeah, I thought this would be a good chance for Foulques to have a bit of a heart-to-heart with someone! But in proper Foulques fashion, it's very one side. He does the talking, Foulques the Younger does the listening.

Your second point is spot on. The end is coming but there are still a few things left to do.

Guilhem was a good character, and vastly outperformed his stats. He got a whole bunch of tithes for Anjou. Guy was just good, which is why I left him in place even as better steward characters popped up. I was saddened to see him go.

To all - the next chapter likely goes up tomorrow. Most of it is written but there are few sections I need to connect better. We'll see how long it takes me to put it together. The chapter after that is written though, so we should have the next two up by Friday evening, maybe earlier.

Also, it was kind of touched on earlier, but is there interest in any particular family that you'd like an update on? I may not be able to toss it into an actual chapter, but I can toss a screenshot in here. Just let me know.

Thanks as always for your comments and feedback. It always gets me thinking. which often leads to better chapters.
 
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Specialist290

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Also, it was kind of touched on earlier, but is there interest in any particular family that you'd like an update on? I may not be able to toss it into an actual chapter, but I can toss a screenshot in here. Just let me know.

Not a single "house" as such, but it might be nice to get a broad overview of the world (or at least Western and Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa -- the world that those in the region would reasonably expect to be in fairly regular contact with) and touch on some "points of interest" that particularly stand out. I don't imagine that too much has changed since 1066, but it might be worth a look around.

...OK, actually there is one house that I'm mildly curious about: How are the de Hautevilles of Apulia / Sicily doing? I'm always eager to hear what they're up to, since I have fond memories of playing them stretching all the way back to my CK1 days.
 
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I think a general overview would be very interesting. For reasons previously discussed Foulques' point of view is generally so narrowly focused on France one hardly considers what happens over the Rhine and the Alps.
 
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A wonderful chapter 1st the foretelling of Foulques coming demise and how well you capture the strange mix of fear and inevitability that Foulques must be going through-not for going quietly into the night that one!

Then the excellent chapter with the grandson and Foulques not being able to help himself disparaging his son who has done rather better than Foulques gives him credit for methinks. I particularly liked Geoffrey's assisting him-he still wants his father's love even if Foulques finds it impossible to give it. Very good indeed
 
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Not a single "house" as such, but it might be nice to get a broad overview of the world (or at least Western and Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and North Africa -- the world that those in the region would reasonably expect to be in fairly regular contact with) and touch on some "points of interest" that particularly stand out. I don't imagine that too much has changed since 1066, but it might be worth a look around.

...OK, actually there is one house that I'm mildly curious about: How are the de Hautevilles of Apulia / Sicily doing? I'm always eager to hear what they're up to, since I have fond memories of playing them stretching all the way back to my CK1 days.

It's something that I may look to do in a future update, but I don't notice a ton of border changes now. (There are a few coming in the next decade)

As for your de Hautevilles...

1109_King_of_Sicily.jpg


1109_House_de_Hauteville.jpg


They look solid in Southern Italy, though one of the King's cousins, I believe is independent, with holdings on Sicily and in southern Italy. They won't be directly mentioned in the next update, but one of the screens addresses crusade contributions and King Serlo is on that list, so you can see what one of the few non-British Isle people have chipped in.

Eleanor there is also Queen of Hungary, I believe.

I think a general overview would be very interesting. For reasons previously discussed Foulques' point of view is generally so narrowly focused on France one hardly considers what happens over the Rhine and the Alps.

There's been periodic revolts in the HRE, including the one that dumped the Salian dynasty from the throne. But right now it's stable.

1109_HRE_Emperor.jpg


1109_HRE.jpg


So the HRE remains an annoying stable entity. But we'll see them having an influence on things in the future.

A wonderful chapter 1st the foretelling of Foulques coming demise and how well you capture the strange mix of fear and inevitability that Foulques must be going through-not for going quietly into the night that one!

Then the excellent chapter with the grandson and Foulques not being able to help himself disparaging his son who has done rather better than Foulques gives him credit for methinks. I particularly liked Geoffrey's assisting him-he still wants his father's love even if Foulques finds it impossible to give it. Very good indeed

Thanks! These last few chapters have been important, but unless there's a major event (ala Alearde's death) they can be hard to focus and strike the balance between foreshadowing the duke's end and still showing he's capable of doing things.

And Geoffrey is charitable. I figure he couldn't leave his father there, even if they still don't really get along. :)

To all, the next chapter follows. I thought this would be short (and it kind of is, at least compared to some other chapters) but it's still got some good length as I packed a bit of background info within. And a lot of screenshots. Hopefully it works for you all.

Thanks as always for your comment and feedback!
 
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Chapter 137 - October 1109

JabberJock14

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Before Plantagenet - Chapter 137
October 1109 - Melun, France

It had been months since the keep at Melun had this much activity.

Foulques slowly walked down the hall, his grandson, Foulques the Younger, providing support. Servants and workers hurried past them as the pair moved at their slow pace. Preparations had to be made for the feast that would be held in the evening - preparations that Foulques, as steward, technically oversaw.

Technically because in actuality, Foulques left the business to others, specifically his son Geoffrey’s chancellor Alias, who had remained behind in Melun even as his lord ventured south with the king. It was a “gift” from Geoffrey that Foulques did not want, but he grudgingly accepted, as there was no way the duke could handle the job of steward these days on his own.

And Foulques did not wish for any problems with this feast - not when the guest of honor was someone he has to deal with.

The King of the Saxons to some, King of England to others, the former Prince Thoræd had been crowned days before. His father Ælfmær had succumb in the Holy Lands on Crusade and now the new king, having taken his father’s place on the throne, looked to take his place leading men against the heathens.

1109_Aelfmaer.jpg


His journey to the Holy Lands would see him travel south through the realm of the Franks with his entourage of knights and warriors. Then he would travel along the coast by boat until reaching his destination.

However, there was no King of the Franks to greet him. Hugues was fighting heathens himself, in Catalonia. By his side was Geoffrey, leading troops as they laid siege to Rosello, just over the border with Toulouse.

1109_Hugues_war.jpg


1109_Geoffrey_leading_troops.jpg


That meant Thoræd’s hosts in Melun would be the council. At the head was the Count of Mallorca, acting as regent. But Foulques and Toulouse needed to make their appearances as well, while Alphonse had greeted Thoræd when he landed in Normandy, but did not accompany him to Melun.

It took much of Foulques’ strength to remain upright when Thoræd arrived in the main hall, as he stood with the other members of the council. His body continued to fail him, so much so that he found it difficult to stand, much less walk. But through sheer determination he managed.

But while Thoræd was present in the hall, he did not have to move. And once the initial greetings were finished, Mallorca and Toulouse led Thoræd away, while Foulques the Younger was able to once again move to his grandfather’s side.

In truth, Foulques needed his grandson with him. While he could walk, he struggled to maintain his balance now. Stumbles were frequent. And he moved at a snail’s pace.

It had become almost impossible to hide. So Foulques had kept himself largely out of sight. When that was impractical, he kept Foulques the Younger close by to maintain the illusion the best he could.

It was just one of many changes Foulques found himself dealing with. Beyond the decline of his physical health, he had to handle a role he was uncomfortable with while ordering change in Anjou.

His own council had gained two new members over the past year. First was the steward - with Guilhem’s death, Rogier de Bourges had been elevated to the role. Foulques’ grandnephew by way of Gilles and the mother of the Karling brood, Ermengarda, the young man had also been rewarded with a new wife in the form of Ness.

1109_Rogier_de_Bourges.jpg


Foulques knew his former lover was less than thrilled with the prospect of marrying a simple courtier, especially given her own sister was a duchess in name, but he had little interest in sending her elsewhere in the realm where she could plot against him or his family. Under the watchful eye of his loyal courtiers in Anjou, she could do the least amount of harm.

But not everyone in the de Limoges clan was downtrodden. Adhemar was all smiles these days, or at least Foulques imagined he was in Bourges, as the young man had been named as the new chancellor of Anjou.

It pained Foulques to do it as, unlike with Guilhem, Godfrey still lived. But former chancellor had contracted the Great Pox in his travels, and it had wreaked havoc on his mind. Unable to keep his sanity long enough to be properly effective in the role, even Agnes, who had remained his strongest ally, was forced to concede that a change was in the duchy’s best interest.

1109_Godfrey_poxed.jpg


1109_Foulques_council.jpg


It had been months since Foulques had seen his council in Anjou, but he was glad for it - they were a reminder of how the world was changing around him. And he did not like it.

Of course, the new council members seemed to have their growing pains. Adhemar had yet to secure the claim in Bourges any faster than Godfrey had. And Rogier had angered the mayors in Anjou by unsettling the peasantry in his attempt to collect taxes - something Foulques could not remember Guilhem doing in all his years of service.

1109_Rogier_de_Bourges_messes_up_taxes.jpg


Fortunately for Rogier, Foulques found himself more forgiving than in the past. Such was the case now that the elder duke had a better understanding of the role of a steward and the difficulty in it. Reading the ledger was enough to put him to sleep and the less said about collecting taxes the better.

He had been tasked by the king to learn what technological advances might be of use for the kingdom and even that was difficult. Alias assisted him the best he could, as did the men Geoffrey had promised him. But it was slow and painful with little progress being made.

So while it was rare for diplomacy to provide a respite from anything for Foulques, today he was looking forward to focusing on something else. And the potential to flex some muscle was also appealing.

After Foulques and his grandson arrived in his chambers, they knew they did not have much time. Servants were finishing up their preparations when they arrived and Foulques gave them the order to let Alias know they were ready to receive the king.

“Chin up, boy,” Foulques instructed to his grandson as they waited. “You need to cut an impressive figure.”

“Do you think it will have an impact on whether he accepts me as a son-by-law?” the teen asked.

“It will not hurt,” Foulques said.

He suspected Thoræd would accept Foulques the Younger regardless. After all, these unions had more to do with the benefits for each side than whether the prospective bride and groom looked impressive. However, having a healthy and knightly looking Foulques the Younger was better than the alternative.

The knock soon came, with Alias escorting Thoræd into the duke’s chambers.

“Duke Foulques,” Alias said, “May I present to you Thoræd, first of his name, king of England.”

1109_Thoraed.jpg


“Thank you Alias,” Thoræd said as he shook the hand of the chancellor. “Please pass along my regards to Duke Geoffrey the next time you see him. And that I pray for his safe return.”

“He will be glad to hear it, and no doubt offer you the same prayers,” Alias said as he bowed before Thoræd. And with that the chancellor of Aquitaine slipped out of the room, while the king approached Foulques and his grandson.

Foulques had forgotten how short and stout Thoræd was. He came up to just the chin of Foulques and the comparison was even more stark when he came up to the teen, who was slightly taller than his grandfather and still rather thin and lanky.

“I am glad to see you once more, Duke Foulques,” Thoræd said. “And this fine lad is?”

“My grandson,” Foulques said as he introduced him. The boy bowed before the king.

“It is my pleasure, your highness,” Foulques the Younger said. “Congratulations on your recent coronation and may you find success in the Holy Lands.”

“Ah, the younger Foulques,” Thoræd said as he reached up to grip the boy by the shoulders. “I have heard much about you. Both your father and your grandfather speak of your promising future.”

The teen blushed but made certain to meet the king’s gaze. “I am grateful for their praise. But I have much to live up to. My grandfather and father are two of the greatest men the realm has seen.”

“And with their guiding hands, I have little doubt you prove worthy of their legacy,” Thoræd said.

“Thank you for your faith, your highness,” the teen said.

Foulques the Younger then pulled a chair from the table for his grandfather. As to not make it seem as though he was doing it because Foulques was unable to, he also did so for Thoræd. Then he stood close by to Foulques as the elder duke carefully lowered himself into the chair, ready to spring to his aid should it be required.

It wasn’t as Foulques successfully sat. He looked back to the teen.

“You may go boy,” Foulques instructed. “I will call if I have further need of you.”

The teen bowed before the two men and then swiftly made his exit.

“Handsome boy,” Thoræd said. “It appears he will grow into a strapping lad. Fine build for a knight.”

“As I’ve mentioned, he shows talent for that as well,” Foulques said. “I think I shall quickly find a place among my men when he comes of age.”

“I hope for similar things of my son when it is his time,” Thoræd said.

“So, I hear this crusade fares well,” Foulques noted.

“Yes!” Thoræd exclaimed. “My father made significant gains before he finally succumb to his illness. I trust God will reward such efforts - I heard his final few months were difficult. He is now at peace.”

“And now you take up his sword,” Foulques said.

“How could I not?” Thoræd asked. “It is God’s calling. Every able Christian man should.”

1109_Crusade_status.jpg


1109_Crusade_contributions.jpg


“And I suppose you are disappointed that the Franks of this realm have not?” Foulques asked.

“It is not for me to judge whether anyone is able,” Thoræd said. “Now… I know you did not wish to meet with me to discuss this crusade… rather my Æthelræda.”

“You’ve seen the boy,” Foulques said after taking a sip from his goblet. “Would he not make for a fine husband for your daughter?”

Thoræd grinned. “Let us be honest, Duke Foulques. He is a fine lad, but there are many fine lads who seek the hand of my daughter. What can you and Lord Geoffrey offer me that others cannot?”

“At my disposal is a levy that is near equal to the entirety of your nation,” Foulques said. “And it is a levy that may well grow in size in time, when my son’s possessions in Aquitaine and Poitou are added.”

“You promise me help… should I require it?” Thoræd asked.

“I can promise you nothing directly,” Foulques admitted. “I will not lie to you and claim that if you need it, Anjou will be by your side. Because i know not what the future holds. But I will say that we shall look upon you with favor… and as long as we are friends with you, we shall not be friends with your Norman troublemakers.”

“Normans?” Thoræd asked. “Duke Foulques, I have little to fear from Normans. Robert, son of the Bastard and the man who dreamed himself king died in the spring. You think I fear this boy he leaves in his stead?”

1109_Earl_Robert_dead.jpg


1109_Duke_Robert_of_Mercia.jpg


“The boy who claims both the blood of the Bastard, and the blood of the two houses of Hwicce?” Foulques asked. “The boy who rules Mercia and York? If you do not fear him, then you are a fool.”

Thoræd narrowed his gaze. “I think you forget who you speak with.”

“If I were the grandson of a king of the Franks… and possessed the levies I do, would the king of the Franks be right to fear me?” Foulques asked.

Thoræd frowned. “It is not the exact same…”

“You are right,” Foulques admitted. “The king fears me, and I do not even have a claim. I cannot imagine his state if I did.”

“Have you invited me here to taunt me, Duke Foulques?” Thoræd asked.

“I lay out the situation,” Foulques said. “My son is the one who speaks honeyed words. I am the old knight, the one who hasn’t time to coddle you with falsities.”

A grunt escaped the king’s lips followed by: “The Normans have approached you?”

“I look for powerful allies outside my realm,” Foulques said. “When I look to your island, I see you, and I see that Norman boy. If I cannot have one, then I may well have the other.”

“So you deal with both of us?” Thoræd asked.

“No, I prefer you, King Thoræd - I never have liked dealing with Normans, given my ancestors’ many battles with them,” Foulques said. “Though times do change. I assure you that if we do not agree to this now, it will change with my son - who never has held the Normans in as low esteem as I have.”

“Some might take that as a threat,” Thoræd replied.

“Take it how you would like,” Foulques said. “I have spent my life as a blunt man, King Thoræd. I see no reason to change now. It is what you shall get with me.”

“So it is,” Thoræd said. “So it is.”

The king sat, rapping is fingers on the table.

“It shall be,” Thoræd said. “As I am departing for the East, I cannot wait on this any longer. My daughter is hereby promised to your grandson. I do pray that your friendship is worth as much as you claim it is, Duke Foulques.”

“That we do not deal with the Normans is worth plenty, I would think,” Foulques said as he took Thoræd’s hand.

Thoræd did not seem thrilled at Foulques’ response, but the men shook hands anyway.

1109_Foulques_betrothed.jpg


Foulques did not know what might become of this union. Did Geoffrey truly harbor ambition to influence the events of the realm of the Saxons? The elder duke thought it foolish - there was plenty to do in their own realm.

But ultimately, he could not think of a better match for his grandson. Marrying a princess brought prestige. And with prestige came respect… and possibly further power.

He suspected King Hugues would not like it. But the king would accept it. He would not dare challenge Foulques. And Geoffrey likely could spew some nonsense that would placate him.

In the end it did not matter. It was another issue he had resolved… before the end.

Now, he just needed Bourges.
 
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PVT Ascoobis

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A good match, provided the King can maintain his throne. Hopefully Geoffrey won't get entangled up there before it's time.

Just a couple of things to yet wrap up.
 
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TheButterflyComposer

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Anjou in England? Surely not. Though them taking over France and helping the Normans establish their control over England in exchange for their duchy would be very ironic.
 
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Even as he fades Foulques looks to strengthen his holdings. He continues to move his family up now marrying a princess of England. Before long his family will be one the most powerful in western Europe.

I will say in some ways it sad to see him fade, but he still tries. I wonder if there will be enough time for Bourges.
 
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Well, Foulques is probably one of the relatively few not of royal station who can speak so bluntly to royalty and get away with it. He has the excuse of age if nothing else - a great cloak to cover some social misdemeanours. But Thoræd might consider that Foulques brusque manner is a form of compliment. Not that Foulques would necessarily lie, but he can surely get rather more harsh if he feels he is talking to an idiot.

I do find myself wondering what nightmares Geoffrey might be having regarding this meeting when he hears of it. Is he worrying if his father's manner is going to wreck his careful planning, or if he is going to have to repair a relationship he has struggled to build?
 
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Specialist290

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Reflecting on this chapter, one gets the impression that there are almost two characters present in one person: Foulques the man, who can barely move on his own, and the legendary Iron Duke of Anjou, whose wrath is swift and whose ire even kings court at their peril. The mask he wears -- and the ruin it conceals -- are an apt symbol of the state he now finds himself in.

Also:

“And I suppose you are disappointed that the Franks of this realm have not?” Foulques asked.

“It is not for me to judge whether anyone is able,” Thoræd said.

Hah! :D Thoræd, you cheeky little devil.
 
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guillec87

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Foulques thinking about his own son death? that's low, even for such an ambitious man
 
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JabberJock14

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A good match, provided the King can maintain his throne. Hopefully Geoffrey won't get entangled up there before it's time.

Just a couple of things to yet wrap up.

The match is all about having an eye to the future. But guessing at how best to play to achieve that future will not be easy. Especially given that pesky crusade. But there will be things to focus on close to home, as Foulques noted, that may keep Geoffrey or Foulques the Younger from focusing across the channel.

Yep, Bourges is the one big target left. It'd be a nice feather in Foulques' cap to get it, even if he will annoy the ghost of his sister. ;)

Anjou in England? Surely not. Though them taking over France and helping the Normans establish their control over England in exchange for their duchy would be very ironic.

Well Anjou couldn't get into England, directly anyway, until the children of Foulques the Younger, so that'd be a bit off. It's possible through a consort situation, but I've had some rough experience with attempting to conquer for other claimants in the past. It works when you conquer it for yourself - your installed claimants often are deposed of quickly.

The Normans are in an interesting position. The younger Robert is a serious threat - becoming the force that we suspected Mercia/York could become in the Rightful King/Bold Prince. Whether he can make something of that threat is something for the future.

Even as he fades Foulques looks to strengthen his holdings. He continues to move his family up now marrying a princess of England. Before long his family will be one the most powerful in western Europe.

I will say in some ways it sad to see him fade, but he still tries. I wonder if there will be enough time for Bourges.

Foulques is content, but never going to just sit around. He values his grandson, and still trusts himself more than Geoffrey to see to the future. And here he gets some prestige, even if he is correct in noting the English king is more of a peer to him than a superior.

More on all of that in the upcoming chapter.

Well, Foulques is probably one of the relatively few not of royal station who can speak so bluntly to royalty and get away with it. He has the excuse of age if nothing else - a great cloak to cover some social misdemeanours. But Thoræd might consider that Foulques brusque manner is a form of compliment. Not that Foulques would necessarily lie, but he can surely get rather more harsh if he feels he is talking to an idiot.

I do find myself wondering what nightmares Geoffrey might be having regarding this meeting when he hears of it. Is he worrying if his father's manner is going to wreck his careful planning, or if he is going to have to repair a relationship he has struggled to build?

He does have the excuse of age, but also he deals with the Saxons who respect him but also, probably, fear him. The small advantage in levy forces is about the difference Foulques had a Rouen. And the teenage Robert would more than make up the difference if it came to blows and Foulques allied with the Normans. Thoræd is proud, but he is not foolish - a trait he shares with his father. And ultimately, Foulques did wish to deal with him, which is far better than the alternative.

Geoffrey would probably have been furious when he heard of the meeting (And he doesn't even have Alias there to rant with - though he might tell his friend to NEVER help his father in a matter like that again), but calmed down when he heard the result. This is one case where distance will help him - unable to intervene and he'll likely find out the result not long after. :)

Reflecting on this chapter, one gets the impression that there are almost two characters present in one person: Foulques the man, who can barely move on his own, and the legendary Iron Duke of Anjou, whose wrath is swift and whose ire even kings court at their peril. The mask he wears -- and the ruin it conceals -- are an apt symbol of the state he now finds himself in.

Also:



Hah! :D Thoræd, you cheeky little devil.

I treated the infirm card at it's word - his body fails him but his mind is still as swift as ever. Those who spend time with him can see his failings. And Thoræd probably can see his physical weakness now. But... Foulques has defeated difficult odds before.

I took a little time before going with that Thoræd line in that conversation. Glad you liked it!

Foulques thinking about his own son death? that's low, even for such an ambitious man

I wouldn't say he... is planning for it (though in real life, he may have actually tried murdered Geoffrey after failing to disinherit him), but he also plans just in case it happens.

To all - normally I'd wait another day or two before posting this chapter, but I think I shall put it up now. Plenty happening in this chapter, featuring a some old friends.

The warning is it is long. But I do hope you all find it worth it. Please enjoy!
 
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