As Uralsk had conversion by the sword, it only leaves Sarai (458) to be converted, so please when you are doing the edits for next session change its religion from sunni to orthodox.
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As Uralsk had conversion by the sword, it only leaves Sarai (458) to be converted, so please when you are doing the edits for next session change its religion from sunni to orthodox.
I would like to rise the issue of turboannexing or government collapse issue.
In Russian games for many many many years we have a rule, that as monarch it is your duty not to let your gov be collapsed, as you are responsible for your country and game process in general - such things are normally hitting the country too much.
Looking back at our situation, it is way too clear that HAL was unreasonable to decline stabhits, and of course the other side shouldn't be punished because of that, like getting 3 BB per each non-core province. That was HAL mistake, and no way Ampo's one. There is no reason why winning party should get penalty for the unreasonable losing side, who declines any peace treaty in principal.
So i suggest to edit French badboy to normal rate, like he would get those provs by peace (0.67 badboy per non-core province in PvP war). Leaving it as now, i find unadequate a lots.
In Russian games for many many many years we have a rule, that as monarch it is your duty not to let your gov be collapsed, as you are responsible for your country and game process in general - such things are normally hitting the country too much.
Looking back at our situation, it is way too clear that HAL was unreasonable to decline stabhits, and of course the other side shouldn't be punished because of that, like getting 3 BB per each non-core province. That was HAL mistake, and no way Ampo's one. There is no reason why winning party should get penalty for the unreasonable losing side, who declines any peace treaty in principal.
So i suggest to edit French badboy to normal rate, like he would get those provs by peace (0.67 badboy per non-core province in PvP war). Leaving it as now, i find unadequate a lots.
well tbh we never did that before. imo that is something you have to keep in mind when stabhitting another country.
And HAL didnt decline for no reason, when i entered the pressure seemed to relief from Iberia and he was pushing the french back.
He was probably waited to get the WS low enough to rebuild and then strike again
And HAL didnt decline for no reason, when i entered the pressure seemed to relief from Iberia and he was pushing the french back.
He was probably waited to get the WS low enough to rebuild and then strike again
Not really. I simply changed my strategy to conserve my forces. Seeing as I didn't actually have to occupy most of Spain in order to be able to stabhit I withdrew my troops across the Ebro river and then simply dealt with any counteroffensives HAL sent there. 4 Spanish provs occupied plus all the colonies in America were more than enough to stabhit . The warscore (on Spain) was about +70 throughout the war.
Suffice to say, it was a good thing I withdrew. Otherwise I would have ended owning half of Spain when HAL's government collapsed...
OE is wrecked probably beyond playability. I don't know if there is any sense in me continuing to play. Just waste of time.
What was the last stabhit asking for? We could possibly have some kind of compromise whereby the former Spanish provinces in excess of the ones stabhitted for would be returned to Spain, and French BB reduced to what it would have been to demand the half dozen or so it would have ended up with in a normal victory.
Despite the 11 provinses you lost to Venice, your manpower was reduced by 0 and the same with your income. Your income is larger than Austria, Sweden, Poland and England who fight numerous wars. You have near optimal sliders and vast muslim nations to the east that you can vasselize and diplo annex, which will increase your income and manpower by far more than what you lost in Balkan.
All you need it to release a few vassels, so your BB goes down and stability becomes less expensive.
What i'm basicly saying, is no your nation is not wrecked, thou not in as good a shape as it could have been. We still have 5-8 sessions left, take the take to improve your nation and gain the wisdom for next game.
Well i had some thoughts as you when france took 5provinces and lost netherlands,but Austria recovered. I think OE can do the same.
1. For normal victory Spain should accept the offer, stabhit was for colonies only, non-EU provinces. Now it is in past.
2. France can't be responsible that Spain wrecked own country, France shouldn't be penaltied for Spanish declines beyond reasonability.
3. If we talk about game balance, i`m quite sure HAL gets back his EU provinces by even simple diplomacy, as noone (including France) is interested that France is owning it.
But i don't think we should change the result of war, it was finished. Changing it - makes dangerious game precedent. We should correct what is wrong in game mechanism - losing country was unreasonable to think to survive under stabhits, while winning party shouldn't get big penalty (extra 2,3 BB per province) for that, as winning party was not able to do anything against that.
Agreed. I am likewise against changing the outcome of this war. And just to be clear: I have already talked to HAL and the four Spanish provinces (in northern Spain, Europe) presently owned by France (as consequence of Spain's collapse during the war) will be returned to Spain two by two in a phased fashion in order to secure sustainable tranquility for the southern frontier.
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Tonio, shut up ;p I won the war! In moral way My government crushed previous one and took control over Spain
As for the effect of collapse: no reversing. As Delian said it was not intended since I had hope to retake some WS, but it happened and I'm against any edits. Spain is already negotiating with France, so next session should resolve, some at least, balance on border in Europe.
And stop whining like old ladies After all we at least had some action last session Unexpected things are the best
My government crushed previous one and took control over Spain As for the effect of collapse: no reversing. As Delian said it was not intended since I had hope to retake some WS, but it happened and I'm against any edits. Spain is already negotiating with France, so next session should resolve, some at least, balance on border in Europe.
And stop whining like old ladies
After all we at least had some action last session Unexpected things are the best
Yeah, OE isn't wrecked. It's in a much better position to get out of vassalage with Spain now than it was at the start of the session, and in overall terms you're not even the weakest country. Losing Greece was probably pretty discouraging, but it's not fatal and with some good diplomatic moves, doesn't need to be permanent.
I beg to differ
Besides why bother with low tax hard to defend Balcan, when there are numerous high tax/mp muslim provinses easy to defend to the east. Fighting AI after all is not that hard.
Tonio, Ampo, the amount of territory taken from Spain probably amounted to over 200 warscore. If Hal were now to try to take all of that back, it would require 2-3 victories. That is not an acceptable gain in one war without a proportionate cost to the taker, like the one provided by the game mechanics. The dangerous precedent would be to send a message to attackers that they can collapse the government of the country they invade, and expect to have their badboy wiped out afterwards. Moreover, this was a predictable outcome. When rebels spawn in the enemy capital, and stab is low, with more rebels spread across the countryside, it's only a matter of time before a government collapses. Your decision to send stabhits at a regular spate came with a risk, and this was the risk. The alternative option would have been to wait until the five year mark had passed, and then go for a forced peace. I don't like stubbornness on the part of losing parties either, but this is after all the reason we have the forced peace rule.
Of course, what I mean is that OE could take back those provinces in a well-fought war. Beating Venice wouldn't necessarily require another player's help, since it still has better manpower and comparable military tech.
A wrecked country is a situation like HAL in the last WATK campaign having less manpower as France than NL...
Though I seem to recall he actually won in the end.
I seem to recall your treachery after beating John and HAL up to save your hide, TC.