I've been doing some reading into this subject, and have consulted two or three regular Scandinavian contributors to this forum (and thus CK II players, of course) and so thought I'd get round to finally posting my findings.
Basically, due to the way 'Danish' (a common name for them, but they applied across Northern Europe) or 'Handfast' marriages worked, many of the Saxon and Norse nobility had second, common-law, wives and in some cases unmarried concubines as well. Nonetheless, their issue by these marriages were considered legitimate so long as the father accepted them as being his. This applied to the nobility (ie the sort of characters represented in CK II) as well as royalty, and there are numerous examples of what would have been considered (ineligible to inherit) bastards on the Continent becoming kings and dukes of the three Scandinavian realms. This practice was certainly extended to Anglo-Saxon England as well -- probably due to protracted Danish influence. Examples include a number of the Fairhair kings (Magnus the Good, Haakon Toresfostre, Magnus Barefoot, Sigurd the Crusader, Magnus the Blind, and so on), five of the sons of Svend Estridsen (Harald Hen, Cnut the Holy, Oluf Hunger, Erik Evergood and Niels) and Emund the Old of Sweden.
As detailed in this post, a 'Handfast' marriage would probably explain Harald Hårdråde's relationship with Tora Torbergsdatter, as well as Harold Godwinson's marriage to Edith Swanneck. In fact, I'd suggest removing Harold's first marriage (like Tora, she was not considered a queen) and making his five eldest children legitimized bastards.
Anyway, my suggestion is as follows, and seems to work pretty well in my test games. In birth_events.txt scroll down to event 301:
I see Muslims are already exempt from this, which is probably correct seeing as they can have multiple wives anyway. What this does is, when a bastard is born to a man of Saxon, Norwegian, Danish or Swedish culture, he doesn't have the option to acknowledge the child and let it be of his dynasty, but remain as a bastard. The two options are to renounce the child -- meaning it stays of the mother's dynasty -- or to fully legitimize it, which reduces relations with the man's wife and other legitimate children. This is basically what we want, as it will create friction between bastards and non-bastards, and will in some small way help to simulate some of the animosity that existed between some of these siblings historically, such as the period of unrest in Norway.
Let me know what you think here, but I think this should give better results. There are no Saxon bastards in their character file anyway, and I think it's already been suggested by Voy that the three Scandinavian files should have those bastards made legitimized bastards.
Thanks.
Basically, due to the way 'Danish' (a common name for them, but they applied across Northern Europe) or 'Handfast' marriages worked, many of the Saxon and Norse nobility had second, common-law, wives and in some cases unmarried concubines as well. Nonetheless, their issue by these marriages were considered legitimate so long as the father accepted them as being his. This applied to the nobility (ie the sort of characters represented in CK II) as well as royalty, and there are numerous examples of what would have been considered (ineligible to inherit) bastards on the Continent becoming kings and dukes of the three Scandinavian realms. This practice was certainly extended to Anglo-Saxon England as well -- probably due to protracted Danish influence. Examples include a number of the Fairhair kings (Magnus the Good, Haakon Toresfostre, Magnus Barefoot, Sigurd the Crusader, Magnus the Blind, and so on), five of the sons of Svend Estridsen (Harald Hen, Cnut the Holy, Oluf Hunger, Erik Evergood and Niels) and Emund the Old of Sweden.
As detailed in this post, a 'Handfast' marriage would probably explain Harald Hårdråde's relationship with Tora Torbergsdatter, as well as Harold Godwinson's marriage to Edith Swanneck. In fact, I'd suggest removing Harold's first marriage (like Tora, she was not considered a queen) and making his five eldest children legitimized bastards.
Anyway, my suggestion is as follows, and seems to work pretty well in my test games. In birth_events.txt scroll down to event 301:
Code:
# The father reacts to the bastard birth
character_event = {
id = 301
desc = "EVTDESC301"
picture = "GFX_evt_birth"
is_triggered_only = yes
option = {
name = "EVTOPTA301" # Legitimize the child
FROM = {
character_event = { id = 302 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP302" } # The child gets the father's dynasty
mother = {
character_event = { id = 303 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP303" } # The child's mother is very pleased
spouse = {
character_event = { id = 304 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP304" } # The child's mother's husband is pissed off
}
}
}
any_child = {
limit = {
NOT = { character = FROM }
dynasty = ROOT
NOT = { trait = bastard }
}
opinion = {
who = ROOT
modifier = legitimized_bastard
months = 12
}
}
}
option = {
name = "EVTOPTB301" # Acknowledge the child
trigger = {
FROM = {
is_female = no
}
NOT = { religion_group = muslim } # No bastards like this in the Muslim world
[COLOR="#FF8C00"]NOT = { culture = saxon }
NOT = { culture_group = north_germanic }[/COLOR]
}
FROM = {
character_event = { id = 306 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP306" } # The child gets the father's dynasty, but is not legitimized.
mother = {
character_event = { id = 307 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP307" } # The child's mother is pleased
spouse = {
character_event = { id = 304 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP304" } # The child's mother's husband is pissed off
}
}
}
}
option = {
name = "EVTOPTC301" # Denounce the child
FROM = {
character_event = { id = 309 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP309" } # The child founds a new "bastard" dynasty
mother = {
character_event = { id = 310 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP310" } # The child's mother is dishonoured
spouse = {
character_event = { id = 304 tooltip = "EVTTOOLTIP304" } # The child's mother's husband is pissed off
}
}
}
}
}I see Muslims are already exempt from this, which is probably correct seeing as they can have multiple wives anyway. What this does is, when a bastard is born to a man of Saxon, Norwegian, Danish or Swedish culture, he doesn't have the option to acknowledge the child and let it be of his dynasty, but remain as a bastard. The two options are to renounce the child -- meaning it stays of the mother's dynasty -- or to fully legitimize it, which reduces relations with the man's wife and other legitimate children. This is basically what we want, as it will create friction between bastards and non-bastards, and will in some small way help to simulate some of the animosity that existed between some of these siblings historically, such as the period of unrest in Norway.
Let me know what you think here, but I think this should give better results. There are no Saxon bastards in their character file anyway, and I think it's already been suggested by Voy that the three Scandinavian files should have those bastards made legitimized bastards.
Thanks.
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