Ballistic Weapons: Yay or nay?

[unmerged(401551)]

So on my last couple games (Sol Force because I really dig the new look) I always went with AP drivers as my main weapons for Cruisers and Beam lasers for non PD small mounts. Thing is that I just get buttraped by Protean Pods when I engage them in combat. So are Ballistic weapons just that shitty in SOTS II or are these pods just too powerfull for cruisers in general?

Cherio...

 

[eRe4s3r]

Can't comment on damage but the problem with ballistic weapons of all kinds is that in SOTS2 the gunners seem to be all severely drunk, the hit rate of heavy mass drivers in the firing range is 1 out of 3. That is, a standing target, on a standing target. In actual reality hit-rate would be 100% and remain 100% unless the target is actually actively avoiding, or very far away

Beam weapon and instant hit weapons will always be superior, as long as we have this broken aiming/accuracy system

 

[Friedericus Rex]

In Sots Prime ballistics were the most powerful weapons once AP was researched, and without it they were next to useless. Only problem was Specters, as they were invulnerable to ballistics.

 

[Friedericus Rex]

IIRC, AP mounts also have much improved accuracy, juts like Sots Prime.

 

[eRe4s3r]

And why would changing the tip of a projectile change its accuracy? (Remain by the opinion that accuracy is broken)

And you know why? Look at the weapon choices you have when you start SOTS2

Lasers = near 100% accuracy
Gauss/Mass = at best 50% accuracy
Missiles = 100% accuracy
Plasma = at best 50% accuracy
Beamers = 100% accuracy

So what weapons to choose.. mhh, hard decision..

Maybe beamers and missiles?

 

[unmerged(401789)]

One point to make about ballistic weapons in the SOTS series is that they can be very effective at taking out planets in comparison to energy weapons. I am part of the camp that says get armor peircing rounds or stick to energy weapons for most tasks though. Armor piercing heavy drivers can really take apart an enemy fleet. Stormers can be really useful with AI command modules but not all race ship sections are built well enough for that to work.

 

[Friedericus Rex]

Like I said, AP ballistics are very accurate, just checked again. They also get the neutronium rounds and HEAP rounds upgrades, making them very powerful guns. The energey cannons shine later on with their antimatter versions, high damage and high accuracy, however, only available much later in the game. Heavy Beamers (positron, etc.) strenghts are high damage and accuracy, plus they're turreted unlike combat lasers, but iirc their range is mediocre. Missiles get shot down.

 

[Myrrdin]

If the weapons are anything like in SotS, ballistics can benefit a lot from fire control and/or AI command, making them frightfully accurate while still having a higher damage output than most other early game weapons. AP and HEAT are also on the ballistic tree, and are probably nice improvements to the base ballistics in most situations. Add to this the different armor penetration characteristics as well that different weapons in all likelyhood have different critical hit properties and I am sure ballistics have lots and lots of uses. No weapon is the best choice in all situations, and that is, IMO, one of the greatest things about the SotS games. I haven't really been using the baseline ballistics all that much yet, do they still pust the ships they hit around? In that case, think of having a few baseline ballistic weapon mounts to push a beam heavy enemy around, making their pin point accuracy weapons useless since his turrets can't track fast enough to hit while his ship is wildly spinning around...

 

[Blackwarder]

Early game SotS1 I used to run with Gauss guns coped with predictive gunnery, I don't know how you reach it with SotS][ though...

Warder

 

[unmerged(402700)]

I never touch projectiles just like I never touch a melee class in an RPG or fantasy game. I'm always ranged or magic.

I devote myself to beams and avoid races that would have high infeasibility research for beam weapons.

 

[Tairneanach]

Early game SotS1 I used to run with Gauss guns coped with predictive gunnery, I don't know how you reach it with SotS][ though...

Warder

In the C3 tree: Expert Systems -> Predictive Gunnery
You'll want Expert Systems early on anyway, because it increases production on all your planets.

@eRe4s3r: 50 %? Yeah, right. You can't make such a broad statement. Of course the relatively tiny targets in the firing range won't get hit as often as cruisers, let alone dreadnoughts or leviathans. Every weapon has a certain deviation depending on the range the target is at. While ballistic wepaons have a relatively high deviation, they maintain their damage across all ranges, while lasers are weaker at extreme ranges. Ballistic weapons deal more damage and rip bigger holes in armour than most energy weapons.

 

[Daedalus117]

Meson and positron beams do far more damage to planets than any ballistic weapon (except siege drivers probably, but the stats for that aren't on the wiki and I'm too lazy to research it in-game). Meson beams kill exactly 100 times the population per hit compared to heavy drivers.

Ballistic weapons are amazing when used with AI fire control though. Their damage advantage seems more pronounced in SotS2. Check the wiki for damage on HEAP guns, and then look at everything else. It is slightly ridiculous how much more DPS HEAP heavy drivers have compared to other heavy mount guns.

 

[Elouda]

Meson and positron beams do far more damage to planets than any ballistic weapon (except siege drivers probably, but the stats for that aren't on the wiki and I'm too lazy to research it in-game). Meson beams kill exactly 100 times the population per hit compared to heavy drivers.

Ballistic weapons are amazing when used with AI fire control though. Their damage advantage seems more pronounced in SotS2. Check the wiki for damage on HEAP guns, and then look at everything else. It is slightly ridiculous how much more DPS HEAP heavy drivers have compared to other heavy mount guns.

Not to mention they will ingore one armour resistance layer on the target.

The REALLY scary weapons however, are the heavy beams. The wiki dosent give an accurate picture of their damage, because one shot will apply that damage profile repeatedly for a beam weapon, in this case SIX times. So a Heavy Combat Laser will result in a pattern 2 wide and 24 deep vs unarmoured targets. A Cutting Beam will do a 2 by 48 pattern.

 

[Blackwarder]

Just want to check that I checked the predictive gunnery and judging from the weapon test screen it doesn't seems to add accuracy to mass drivers shots ATM, either that or it's negligible.

Warder

 

[Kraxis]

Ballistics also destroy a lot of infra and environment. Energy weapons tend to be less destructive, while still quite deadly.

 

[STALKERGB]

And why would changing the tip of a projectile change its accuracy?

It could well be more than the tip that is changed, for example, if it's anything like modern APFSDS rounds then it's not just the tip that is different compared to say, certain HE rounds. The whole body is part of the munition to help it do it's job (in this case pierce armour).

Anyway, regarding SOTS2, I've been leaning towards energy weapons just because the accuracy seems really really poor with mass/heavy drivers etc

 

[unmerged(133116)]

As stated before: Beam weapons lose damage power over greater distances where as ballistics tend to remain constant. Again, as mentioned before, not every weapon is the be all end all, as there are different factors that control their accuracy and penetration, so it comes mostly down to preference. I like the large end AP mounts with advanced targeting for those first long range attacks.
You don't always hit but when you do, you tear up their armor.

I also like missile combat, Honor Harrington style, but as mentioned above they tend to have a hard time getting through PD later in the game. Laser/phaser are good general purpose weapons but the heavy line Meson, Cutter, etc are where the real damage is.

I don't use plasma much except on projectors where they are devastating at close range.

I try to have a mixed fleet with mixed weapons lay out to cover most contingencies but that generalization can get you owned with a serious specialized/homogenous weapon fleet.

So over all it comes down to your choice of weapon style once they get all the bugs worked out.

 

[unmerged(402700)]

As stated before: Beam weapons lose damage power over greater distances where as ballistics tend to remain constant. Again, as mentioned before, not every weapon is the be all end all, as there are different factors that control their accuracy and penetration, so it comes mostly down to preference. I like the large end AP mounts with advanced targeting for those first long range attacks.
You don't always hit but when you do, you tear up their armor.

I also like missile combat, Honor Harrington style, but as mentioned above they tend to have a hard time getting through PD later in the game. Laser/phaser are good general purpose weapons but the heavy line Meson, Cutter, etc are where the real damage is.

I don't use plasma much except on projectors where they are devastating at close range.

I try to have a mixed fleet with mixed weapons lay out to cover most contingencies but that generalization can get you owned with a serious specialized/homogenous weapon fleet.

So over all it comes down to your choice of weapon style once they get all the bugs worked out.

My morrigi Leviathan armor had the following:

Heavy Cutter Beams (would switch these modules to Professor X when fixed)
Turreted Dual Cutter Beams
Heavy Pulsed-Graviton Beam Turrets
Meson Beam Turrets
Phaser Turrets

 

[Acularius]

To be honest, I still like going through the tech tree in SOTS prime and pumping out Siege Drivers... it is fulfiling.

That and the Kill Kinectic projectiles in SOTS prime, while not the greatest damage dealers, had nice accuracy and long range.

However, I still have a soft spot for beam weapons, as they look nice when doing their thing.

Early game in SOTS prime I tended to use Missle boats, up until I started pumping out some tech into energy weapons, (or Ballistics)

 

[brn4meplz]

I'm a ballistics guy all the way. The only time I use energy in Sots 1 was when the module forced it.


Missiles I use too but nothing says HA HA like the Impactor rail guns in Sots1. sending ships completely off course.