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unmerged(1631)

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the_genius said:
Hey pals, just hovering around the stats page, I haven't checked fully the savefile, but why there's Castile and not Spain there? :confused: and there are governors everywhere and the countries are not even close to reach Infra5!.. how funny :p

Heya Genius. Castile becomes Spain in 1516 I believe and we started the game with mayors in place to encourage wars iirc.
See you tonight mon ami
 

HolisticGod

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All,

Tonio's stat page is down, so I'll put them up tomorrow.

Drew, if you're taking the OE chime in on what edits it needs. I'm open to give it some pretty substantial boosts in the realm of cores/cash.

Everybody make sure to chime in on the bumped start/end times and confirm that you can handle them. I don't want to hear "I can't play that late" next week if there's not a word about it now.

And lastly, farewell to CF, who's off to do good and make us all look like selfish slobs in Chad, Africa. I wish you all the best, man, and enjoy time spent with those gorgeous African women. :D It's been great having you, and it's a shame to see you go.
 

arcorelli

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I am very sorry but I just fell asleep in the middle of the session. That should not happen again.
 

DSYoungEsq

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arcorelli said:
I am very sorry but I just fell asleep in the middle of the session. That should not happen again.
I didn't notice. :rofl:


PS: HoG, you'll need to edit my land slider back to 5. I got a -3 movement from the establishment of the Admiralty event.
 
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the_genius

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Mrlifford said:
Heya Genius. Castile becomes Spain in 1516 I believe and we started the game with mayors in place to encourage wars iirc.
See you tonight mon ami
Oh ok, I don't remember but is AoI's intended? cause Viva España event is in 1475 IIRC... anyway, it's ok :) ... and hmm, you'll see me is next week :p :D
 

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Another war against my inheritance?? :eek: you evil HG :p give me back my Calais! :p .... guess that CF wanted to end his turn with another war huh? at least we are already at Infra3 and Trade2...
HolisticGod said:
And lastly, farewell to CF, who's off to do good and make us all look like selfish slobs in Chad, Africa. I wish you all the best, man, and enjoy time spent with those gorgeous African women. :D It's been great having you, and it's a shame to see you go.
Yep, Godspeed to CF... I'm so proud of him, having to move so quickly far away from home, and for a good and humanitarian reason.. :)... hey, if you have a chance, teach people around there the awesome things of EU2.. but perhaps you must show them the new maps, where Chad exists :p
arcorelli said:
I am very sorry but I just fell asleep in the middle of the session. That should not happen again.
LOL.. how can this happen? :confused: :rofl: hey, I'll give you the advice I give myself: resign from work :p
 

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DSYoungEsq said:
I didn't notice. :rofl:.

I just hope that my country is not full of rebels. Nothing strange you didn't noticed, apart of building the fleet not much I did in the session (and now that I am Protestand, I can't even send colonists, damn it).

And I kind of agree with Cas, that Austria is huge! (well Muscowy is huge too, but as far as I saw, Brandenburg could handle them in their own, so I guess not that terrible).
 

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arcorelli said:
I just hope that my country is not full of rebels. Nothing strange you didn't noticed, apart of building the fleet not much I did in the session (and now that I am Protestand, I can't even send colonists, damn it).

And I kind of agree with Cas, that Austria is huge! (well Muscowy is huge too, but as far as I saw, Brandenburg could handle them in their own, so I guess not that terrible).

IMO, not having an OE, really crashed this game... OE is much more important than BBurg... Sweden, Russia and Austria can easily cover the empty space BBurg left, but not have a OE is BAD for balance.
 

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Casluerj said:
IMO, not having an OE, really crashed this game... OE is much more important than BBurg... Sweden, Russia and Austria can easily cover the empty space BBurg left, but not have a OE is BAD for balance.
Indeed, without OE, AUS have overextended herself too much, owning Constantinople! :eek: wow!..
 

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TG,

Actually, CF requested the war. I'd offered an NAP for the session to make way for the new dynasty, which he accepted, but he wound up with nobody else to fight and so we agreed to one last round. I'd happily return Calais, except that it's a port. ;) When and if the Emperor's navy has more solid anchorings, it shall be a gift to his Majesty.

Cas,

I made all the same arguments and only Dave agreed with me. Even so, I made John play it until he was dismantled by Camisa and on the verge of being hit by Drake. At that point, he had no desire to continue with it and we've had a hard enough time finding a new Sweden and a France. Drew may perm it now, but it'd have to take on Austria, Venice, Russia and Castile to come anywhere close to its usual dimensions. It's best off as an Oriental power, extending far into Persia and India, but we'll see if that works out.

As for Austria, if you look at the numbers it's currently the second strongest power, but there's not a lot of disparity. Russia and Brandenburg, along with Spain which is on top, are quite strong and capable of handling Austria one on one, provided they have the advantage of leaders. And France, if it focuses on the new world for a while, should be able to avenge its defeats under Henri IV.

So by the numbers, Austria's not nearly as bad as it looks. It's gotten Poland and Hungary in this game instead of North Germany and Italy, which is a vastly different proposition. And as for Constantinople, it was until recently under the rule of the Tzar, which would soon be much deadlier (i.e. Greek culture). I don't see that Austria taking it makes any difference to anything, especially as the Venetian inquisitors failed to restore it to the True Faith.

The only reason I took it was to increase naval support, which is still hugely inferior to Venice, Spain and England's.
 

arcorelli

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HolisticGod said:
So by the numbers, Austria's not nearly as bad as it looks. (...)

The only reason I took it was to increase naval support, which is still hugely inferior to Venice, Spain and England's.

Now that Austria is worried (or even thought interesting telling) about his naval support is inferior to Venice, Spain or England says to me that Austria is really as bad as it looks.
 

HolisticGod

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Arco,

Why wouldn't it be? This is a land 5 game, so all countries have an interest in building a navy and acquiring sufficient ports to do so. Before the session, Brandenburg had the second largest fleet, right behind Venice.

And for the record, my naval support is quite a bit lower than theirs. It may be lower than BB's too, and it's definitely lower than Sweden's, or will be after it gets its tax events. I was just stating my reasons for wanting Thrace, and Calais for that matter.
 

arcorelli

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HolisticGod said:
Arco,

Why wouldn't it be? This is a land 5 game, so all countries have an interest in building a navy and acquiring sufficient ports to do so. Before the session, Brandenburg had the second largest fleet, right behind Venice.

Because a huge MP country, high income and high naval support (sizable fleet at least) is, let say, quite powerful?

It does have any shortcomings that I can see. So, yep, Austria is as bad as it looks ;)
 

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Austria is huge. It is the most powerful country in the game at present. Spain generates more income, but Spain's ability to increase it's technology probably isn't that much greater (if at all) than Austria's because it has so many more provinces, and I'll wager that most of the new ones are still unconverted pagans.

Don't let Austria's attempt to poor-mouth itself fool you. Three sessions ago, France could take on Austria one-on-one and acquit itself very nicely; the wars were almost always draws unless someone else stuck a nose into the situation. The last two sessions, Austria has handily won the wars one-on-one; CF, with the advantage of build-up and preparation was unable to stop Austria at all, and so far as I could tell, didn't fight one single significant battle in Austrian territory, let alone take any Austrian provinces.

Presumably, the new French minister will find other ways to engage French income and economy; probably with efforts to found an overseas empire (the lack of the Portugese makes a number of attractive opportunities available). If so, then the only potential check on Austria comes from three sources: Russia (which has no really good reason to attempt westward expansion), Venice (which simply doesn't have the ability to slug it out with Austria on land, and only exists because Johan gave it an impregnable capital province :p ), and Brandenburg. Brandenburg has, for the time being, been in a cozy bed with Austria; Austria leaves it some crumbs for comfort in North Germany and Brandenburg doesn't attack Austria. This allows Brandenburg to focus on technological investments in things like Trade and Infrastructure. Presumably, KJ will use this to his advantage by having a lead on everyone in LT when his really good leaders kick in during the late 1600's. Can't really argue with the strategy.

The Ottomans, of course, are for the forseeable future locked out of Europe. It's going to take some really strong effort on the part of Drew to change that.

What, then, could change the dynamic?

Well, Sweden can, for one. Now that Dago isn't in Sweden, there might be the chance of Sweden v. Russia in war, probably teamed up with Brandenburg. Austria might well not be willing to watch that go unchallenged, especially if (as it should) Venice were to join such a coalition.

Alternatively, France and Brandenburg could join forces and agree to carve up the Lowlands between them, which would cause Austria much distress, since it seems likely HoG intends to choose to keep the LowLands in 1556, Italy proper being already in the hands of the Venetians.

The official English policy, by the way, is that "we don't care." :p :rofl:
 

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DSYoungEsq said:
Presumably, the new French minister will find other ways to engage French income and economy; probably with efforts to found an overseas empire
:D you know me DS, I'm a trader-colonizer :D so perhaps FRA's policy would change :rolleyes:

But, hmmm... it's quite annoying that situation in Calais, a further discussion about it will occur ;)
 

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TG,

If you can come up with an alternative port to replace it, I'm certainly willing to hand it over.

DSY,

Er, the English foreign minister has evidently not been paying very close attention, which the Imperial Ministry of Fair and Balanced Information believes ought to discredit his whole analysis. ;)

There has never been a draw between Austria and France, in seven real wars. Austria won all five one-on-ones and lost two where England and Russia intervened. In every case except the Fifth Rhenish War, so four wars, Austria was in a position to take far more than it did and chose not to-taking, in order, Provence, Luxembourg, Luxembourg again (probably couldn't have taken more), Flanders and Brabant, and Calais.

In the first war France had both numerical and financial superiority. In the second, it had numerical parity and financial supeirority. In the third and fourth, it brought friends. In the fifth, it again had numerical parity and slight financial inferiority. In the sixth, it had near numerical parity and moderate financial inferiority. In the seventh, it had moderate numerical inferiority and significant financial inferiority.

In wars one through five France had the advantage of leaders and morale, and in at least three wars its leader advantage was great. CF himself has documented the reasons for France's various defeats, but none of them except this last were due to Austria's advantage in strength.

The Empire is second in power to Spain. The only argument is the one you make, that we'll have roughly equal tech speeds, and that's due principally to Spanish DPs, not its size. But that's more than made up for by Spain's greater (and soon to be much greater) income, healthy manpower and upcoming great leaders, where Austria gets none worth talking about until after 1600.

Russia is comparable to Austria. It has great MP (real potential MP greater than Austria's), a healthy income that'll go up once Drake gets a lengthy peace, strong colonial aspirations, etc. Drake's done a fine job with her.

Brandenburg is the weaker of the German states, but it has some advantages. The time to hypertech benefited it enormously, it has only one enemy (presently-Russia), it has only two other potential enemies (Austria and Sweden, of which only Sweden has an immediate motive for attacking). It has a robust income, it's small and compact with a much better ratio of income and manpower to size (helps tech, wartime stability, stab costs, etc.), etc.

France shouldn't be counted out. It needs to focus on colonies and trade for a while, but when it gets Henri IV the chances are fair that the Empire is in for yet another round of leaderless slogging against named French commanders. Although I'll much prefer Henri to Richemont and Dunois. :D

Venice and England are quite strong, and Venice in particular has the second largest navy, higher manpower than any Venice in memory and already a sizable colonial empire. It's also now completely insulated from the Ottoman Empire and Russia and has only to worry seriously about France or Austria at any given time.

Sweden always has great potential if it's strong economically and politically when Gustavus Adolphus rolls around. With no Holland or Portugal and random explorers and conquistadors, it should be.

And the Ottoman Empire has a long road ahead, but if your recall I argued vigorously in its favor over BB. ;) Austria fought zero (read = 0) wars with the Turks and even intervened to prevent a two way (although it didn't do any good in the end). So the Emperor is hardly responsible for their plight.
 

Mem de Sá

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HG, the first post say the time slot is 8:30 Eastern Time

Just to clarify...
With the move it will go to 9:00 EST then, ending about 1:00 am EST, if I get it correct. That would be 11:00pm to 3:00am here... I allways get confused with time slot... It can be done, I believe
 

King John

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A sundering has taken place in the HRE.

Following the state conversion to Lutheranism by Prince Johan Nestor, the illustrious emperor Karl V convened a meeting at Augsberg to discuss the new religious matters. In it, the emperor steadfastly insisted that catholic bishops of his choosing would need to be appointed over all places of worship in Brandenburg. No further repurcussions would be necessary.

However, this point was far more than the prince could accept. A devout lutheran himself, catholic interference with the protestant religious practices of his subjects was something he could not tolerate.

Said the imperial envoy, "the Emperor has nominated all of the Bishops since the reign of Henry II, and has been the Protector of the monastic clergy for some three hundred years. To repeal this authority is to rebel against the Emperor, not the Pope." The meeting broke up without any agreement.

It is not known where this will lead, but the Prince elector plans to expand the standing army of Brandenburg. Should an internecine conflict develope, the north marches shall be well defended.