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Nuukov

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Hey everyone.

My favourite country in previous patches was Atropatene in north-western Iran, however due to the Marius update they seem impossibly difficult now. In previous patches, you could get a sizeable army that could even defeat Armenia if you were careful in the very beginning, but now with the levy-system you have about 15-16 cohorts while Armenia has 60+.

In the past you could also wait for the Seleukids to be at war with the Antigonids then you just declare war on them and occupy Media. I could usually peace them out and take the two provinces you needed to form Media really easily, but now your army is so small it is hard to hold on to any land you occupy. Also you just get crushed by Bactria when they eventually show up and they have over 25k troops. If I try to peace out the Seleukids after occupying a lot of land before any Bactrian or Seleukid armies can show up, I just can't due to a "-50 War Balance" reasons penalty for peace. This may have been there before, but I don't remember ever having trouble peacing out the Seleukids.

I also tried enticing the Seleukid governor of Media too, but they seem to make the provinces loyal before they reach below 50 provincial loyalty, so I am really stuck as how to play them now and succeed.

So I am wondering what the current strategy for success is for Atropatene, in case any of you out there have managed to succeed as them in the Marius update? I would appreciate the help since I really loved playing as Atropatene in the past, but now I am just stuck. :(
 
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Battlex

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0bd0ed742059cd7f4c83882095aeb3752e45dfbfv2_hq.jpg

This strat works quite well as Atropante I find
 
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Nuukov

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This strat works quite well as Atropante I find

Hehe, true. After a little experimenting I found that intgrating Cadusian culture increases your levies from 15 to 34, but that is still no-where nearly enough to deal with either Armenia or even Bactria, let alone the Seleukids.
 

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Winning battles in the mountains by better generals and using terrain for the new combat width is of any help? I will try tonight if I have time
 
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Winning battles in the mountains by better generals and using terrain for the new combat width is of any help? I will try tonight if I have time
Possibly, depends on how many Armenia or Seleukid and Bactria bring all at once. If you do testing, let me know how it goes. I appreciate it a lot.
 
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Possibly, depends on how many Armenia or Seleukid and Bactria bring all at once. If you do testing, let me know how it goes. I appreciate it a lot.
Does the AI tend to attack you on multiple fronts? Or just sends death stacks through? You could make multiple forts and recapture them one by one, locking the AI in. Or just fight them to a white peace, raiding and sacking as much as possible
 

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Hehe, true. After a little experimenting I found that intgrating Cadusian culture increases your levies from 15 to 34, but that is still no-where nearly enough to deal with either Armenia or even Bactria, let alone the Seleukids.
Switching military law to military service should add about 10 cohorts to that. You should be able to hire an 11k mercenary army as well.
 
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Does the AI tend to attack you on multiple fronts? Or just sends death stacks through? You could make multiple forts and recapture them one by one, locking the AI in. Or just fight them to a white peace, raiding and sacking as much as possible

Armenia can somewhat be dealt with by allying them and then improving relations. The Seleukids however, I have not had them attack me yet when I was allied to Armenia. Otherwise I am not looking to whitepeace, I would like to be able to fight the Seleukids and take their land. If you don't you are just boxed in between Armenia and the Seleukids forever.
 

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Armenia can somewhat be dealt with by allying them and then improving relations. The Seleukids however, I have not had them attack me yet when I was allied to Armenia. Otherwise I am not looking to whitepeace, I would like to be able to fight the Seleukids and take their land. If you don't you are just boxed in between Armenia and the Seleukids forever.
I had similar issues when playing Macedon, Thrace and tribes in Gaul and Germania. With Macedon and Thrace I wanted to go east because of the new dlc content but instead of going east I constantly had to deal with Rome in the west that expanded really fast so I never had the opportunity to actually go east. With the tribes I had the same issue with Rome expanding relatively quickly towards me.
 

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mercs or allies i guess. Would armenia be willing to ally against the selucids? or iberia/colchis/pontus against armenia? Add a stack of mercs and it might work?
 
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mercs or allies i guess. Would armenia be willing to ally against the selucids? or iberia/colchis/pontus against armenia? Add a stack of mercs and it might work?

Armenia are willing to ally, but don't want to fight the Seleucids. Maybe with extra allies and mercs they might, but it was quite a hefty reason penalty.
 

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Integrating Cadusian and passing the military service law will pump up your army size considerably. You then have 2 basic strategies: either eat Armenia or go for Albania, Iberia and Colchis. The choice here is pretty obvious in each given game based on alliances etc, and you want to integrate all of the major cultures you conquer, focusing on fast religious conversion to keep provincial loyalty up. Then just jump on the Seleucids when they get into any major war, you don't need to be able to get a crushing defeat on them, you just need them to be distracted enough for you to occupy and annex a few provinces.

The worst possible result is if the Seleucids declare on Armenia early and absorb too much of their territory or if Armenia blocks off your growth into Colchis and insists on being aggressive towards you rather than allying, if this happens then you might need to restart unless you get somewhat lucky with the Seleucids getting into a bad war.
 
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Integrating Cadusian and passing the military service law will pump up your army size considerably. You then have 2 basic strategies: either eat Armenia or go for Albania, Iberia and Colchis. The choice here is pretty obvious in each given game based on alliances etc, and you want to integrate all of the major cultures you conquer, focusing on fast religious conversion to keep provincial loyalty up. Then just jump on the Seleucids when they get into any major war, you don't need to be able to get a crushing defeat on them, you just need them to be distracted enough for you to occupy and annex a few provinces.

The worst possible result is if the Seleucids declare on Armenia early and absorb too much of their territory or if Armenia blocks off your growth into Colchis and insists on being aggressive towards you rather than allying, if this happens then you might need to restart unless you get somewhat lucky with the Seleucids getting into a bad war.

This was an excellent answer, thanks a lot!
 
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Yesterday I started a campaing to test the ideas on this thread. This afternoon I wanted to test Seleukid forces and declared while it was destroying Antigonid. Bad idea, Bactria and Seleukid can get to my country very easily. I won most of the battles, but I lost the war as I could not stop them conquering my Province capitals. I am starting a new one with a focus in Armenia. With the help of Albania an Iberia, I hope I can cope. Let's see if I can make a stronghold of the north.
 
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Yesterday I started a campaing to test the ideas on this thread. This afternoon I wanted to test Seleukid forces and declared while it was destroying Antigonid. Bad idea, Bactria and Seleukid can get to my country very easily. I won most of the battles, but I lost the war as I could not stop them conquering my Province capitals. I am starting a new one with a focus in Armenia. With the help of Albania an Iberia, I hope I can cope. Let's see if I can make a stronghold of the north.
With this strategy I have been able to grab some provinces from Armenia in my first war. You need at least one good general mercenary stack and possible two (I took the second mid war), and before that you need to integrate the Cadusian as @Rabid said. I did also integrate the Persian for more trade route. For the war, get all your armies together and try to get your allies join your doom stack. In this run I was allied to Albania and Iberia, but only Albania joined the war.

Tech-wise, I decided to go the left civic advances tree to get more trade routes for the money, but If I have to start again, I would probably choose an assimilation/conversion option. As now my objective would be probably to integrate the Armenians to boost my levies and try to converse everyone to the Zoroastrian religion.

1615036070998.png
 
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With this strategy I have been able to grab some provinces from Armenia in my first war. You need at least one good general mercenary stack and possible two (I took the second mid war), and before that you need to integrate the Cadusian as @Rabid said. I did also integrate the Persian for more trade route. For the war, get all your armies together and try to get your allies join your doom stack. In this run I was allied to Albania and Iberia, but only Albania joined the war.

Tech-wise, I decided to go the left civic advances tree to get more trade routes for the money, but If I have to start again, I would probably choose an assimilation/conversion option. As now my objective would be probably to integrate the Armenians to boost my levies and try to converse everyone to the Zoroastrian religion.

View attachment 689311
Did you improve relations with antigonids or send them gifts at all to deter invasion?
 

IsaacCAT

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Did you improve relations with antigonids or send them gifts at all to deter invasion?
Nothing yet, I know they are involved with the Diadochi wars. But I will improve relations. Not that I think that will avoid a DOW from them.
 

Battlex

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Nothing yet, I know they are involved with the Diadochi wars. But I will improve relations. Not that I think that will avoid a DOW from them.
It won't avoid it but the delay can help you be more grounded, especially if you can build more forts near passes before then
 
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