Ascension Perks Guide to 2.2

[redrum68]

Good feedback. I admit I was definitely overly harsh on Arcology. To be honest the AI in 2.2 is so poor that a lot of my recent games I haven't played that far into to build as many Ecumenopolises. Nothing is perfect the first time you write it

Most of the feedback I agree with and in a few cases the descriptions where incorrect or misleading.

Updated:
- Revamped Arcology description and usage
- Fixed Consecrated Worlds description (it had been a long time since I'd used this Perk)
- Fixed Shared Destiny description to include time reduction
- Adjusted Executive Vigour description a bit
- Adjusted Mastery of Nature description a bit

 

[Bouchart]

Enigmatic Engineering might be useful for multiplayer deathmatches.

 

[PeterPancake]

I disagree strongly with Synthetic Age. This is a must-have for Machine Empire. Non-ME need to 2 AP to get useable and strong pops. Who would even deny 2 Machine Points (of total 6)?

Modification is easy to use as of right now. You get one points -> use it and see how your new sup-species grow. Your new pops have more weight in reproduction and you get the modification benefits pretty quick. Later on it's way cheaper (research) to pull all sup-species together because you laid a path to your desired outcome.

 

[Secret Master]

Wide spiritualist empires love this perk.

I was going to say this.

I'll just add that this perk is a great example of how cookie-cutter builds are problematic in Stellaris. It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking that ascension perks are builds in an MMO. You take X, Y, and Z in a specific order all the time, or you are a noob who shouldn't even be playing.

For Spiritualists, the discovery of Holy Worlds within an area that you can easily claim early in the game should result in a radical change of plan for perks. The bonuses to consecrating actual Holy Worlds are amazing. You aren't going to colonize them early in the game anyway, so you might as well buff your entire empire instead.

I wouldn't take this perk in every spiritualist game, but it's like the RNG putting you in the area to find Fen Habbanis. You change what you are doing to fit what kind of situation you are facing. Only a fool would ignore the possibilities opened by the availability of this perk and the sudden appearance of Holy Worlds.

It occurs to me that I haven't run a Prosperity Preacher Megacorp with easy access to Holy Worlds and this perk. I can only imagine the trade boost from spiritualist attraction coupled with the boost to amenities is more or less this:

 

[Peter Ebbesen]

Your updated description of Excutive Vigour suggests that you still underestimate it's early game power allowing the player to permanently run multiple campaigns (healthy, CG reduction) earlier than otherwise as well as the benefits that accrue to the influence edicts (and any competent player will in SP explore the universe for bonus influence from contacts early, both to boost expansion and, if events warrant, early mineral edict. Probably running Map the Stars until all has been surveyed after two decades or so, depending on galaxy size)

While true that you have more possibilities of using its full potential later in the game, it delivers a lot of power up front and in a game as prone to snowballing as Stellaris early benefits properly applied are very powerful.

Edit: expanded on argument. I'm not saying it is a must have, but it IS very powerful both early and late in the game.
Edit2: Sorry if this comes across as aggressive. Not intended that way, just trying to help.

 

[moyang]

I thought there was a consensus that one vision is a trash tier perk.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/ascension-perk-elimination.1129315/

 

[Peter Ebbesen]

I thought there was a consensus that one vision is a trash tier perk.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/ascension-perk-elimination.1129315/

In what world does an elimination contest frequented by the self-selected group that care to participate represent a consensus of anything but that group at best, and not always that due to the format?

Okay, say that an elimination contest does represent a consensus anyway. In that case, in what world does an elimination contest of the 2.1 perks to gauge the at the time perceived values of perks carried out before 2.2s release so based on no hands-on experience of 2.2 and with the criteria for scoring being explicitly based on 2.1 victory conditions, that were scrapped in 2.2, represent a consensus about 2.2?

Ps: For what it is worth I also consider One Vision a weak perk except for role-playing purposes, but it IS an easy way out for a player that has problems with the faction system and just want people to follow the chosen ethics. Certainly it cannot be recommended in general to players adept at the game.

 

[redrum68]

I disagree strongly with Synthetic Age. This is a must-have for Machine Empire. Non-ME need to 2 AP to get useable and strong pops. Who would even deny 2 Machine Points (of total 6)?

Modification is easy to use as of right now. You get one points -> use it and see how your new sup-species grow. Your new pops have more weight in reproduction and you get the modification benefits pretty quick. Later on it's way cheaper (research) to pull all sup-species together because you laid a path to your desired outcome.

I don't consider myself a Machine Empire expert so would be interested in other opinions here. I've mostly seen that some people take it and others don't. +2 trait points and cheaper pop mod is nice and will let you pick some pop bonuses. I guess I'd be interested in when you do pick it what traits you usually select to understand what you would be sacrificing in comparison to other AP bonuses.

Your updated description of Excutive Vigour suggests that you still underestimate it's early game power allowing the player to permanently run multiple campaigns (healthy, CG reduction) earlier than otherwise as well as the benefits that accrue to the influence edicts (and any competent player will in SP explore the universe for bonus influence from contacts early, both to boost expansion and, if events warrant, early mineral edict. Probably running Map the Stars until all has been surveyed after two decades or so, depending on galaxy size)

While true that you have more possibilities of using its full potential later in the game, it delivers a lot of power up front and in a game as prone to snowballing as Stellaris early benefits properly applied are very powerful.

Edit: expanded on argument. I'm not saying it is a must have, but it IS very powerful both early and late in the game.
Edit2: Sorry if this comes across as aggressive. Not intended that way, just trying to help.

I think your have some good points and maybe its just we have different play styles. I tend to very highly value influence and pop growth early game. I think Executive Vigour is a good perk, just in my experience when taking it especially as my first perk, I don't feel that I get that much benefit early on especially in comparison to Interstellar Domination. Probably the best thing is to put some numbers to it to see how much bonus you would normally get.

So looking at say the first 50-60 years of the game where you are mostly expanding to gain lots of systems and colonizing planets, I rarely spend influence on edicts. So its mostly looking at campaigns, which early game I'm usually trying to constantly run Healthcare Campaign and if I can then run Recycling Campaign to see how much energy you'd save. Are there any others you would normally run early game?

Based on trying to run both of those say right after I get Executive Vigour and looking at the next 30 years, I'd only have to pay for them twice (year 0 and year 15) instead of three times (year 0, year 10, year 20). Generally the cost of campaigns rises over time since you are expanding above the admin cap. But let's estimate I'm right about at the admin cap initially so year 0 it costs 1000 energy, year 10 it costs 1500, year 15 it costs 1750, year 20 it costs 2000 so that the total cost taking those numbers would be 2750 vs 4500, a savings of 1750 energy per campaign for a total of 3500 energy (I realize that this estimate can vary some and glad to compare different numbers). The other thing to note here is that you don't see any of the savings until year 10 since you are really saving by not having to renew the campaign as often.

Now let's consider Interstellar Domination over those 30 years. Assuming I'm getting around +5-6 influence per month so I can build about 1 outpost a year. So if say I build around 30 outposts during those 30 years, then I'm saving 75 * 30 * 20% = 450 influence. I'm also getting the savings immediately as I build new outposts which I can then build the next outpost sooner.

So looking at those numbers I would definitely prefer to save 450 influence over 3500 energy. In both cases, you get some significant savings but early expansion tends to be limited by influence so anything you can do to save influence is really important.

 

[Lady Lacroix]

Three quick notes:

1) Executive Vigour, applying as it does to every credit, food, or influence campaign, edict, and unity ambition is not weak in the early game and strong later on. It is a strong pick throughout the game. It faces stiff competion for first perk pick, but is always worth considering for that role.

2) Consecrated Worlds does not work the way you think it does. You should use a perk before rating it, you really should. It does not provide a bonus to three worlds you have colonized, it provides empire-wide percentage bonuses to amenities, unity, and spiritualist attraction, based on the quality of three uncolonized worlds you consecrate (anything from theologically insignificant uninhabitable planets to gaia). A typical outcome with good but not perfect consecration is around +20% to unity and spiritualist and +10% amenities when all three are declared, but it depends greatly on what kind of real estate you are willing to declare sacred and off limits. Your notion that this perk is something only potentially useful, and then only to tall builds, couldn't be further from the truth. Now, whether one wants to spend a perk to gain unity, amenities, and spiritualist attraction in the first place is another question, but if one does, this perk delivers in spades. Wide spiritualist empires love this perk.

3) Arcology project.. Really? REALLY? Arguably the single most powerful ascension perk in the game for how it transforms the economy if you don't conquer Fen Habbanis, and certainly the most powerful one of those that involve construction or planetary changes, is "rarely used"? I'm not one to consider it a no-brainer and must-have like some in this forum, but if you've got Megacorp and thus access to this perk and truly believe that it is seldom worth taking and that thus it is rarely used by players, your judgment is deeply suspect.

The hilarious part is that Arcology is especially good for wide empires that have the resources to funnel into an "alloy lung"

In what world does an elimination contest frequented by the self-selected group that care to participate represent a consensus of anything but that group at best, and not always that due to the format?

Okay, say that an elimination contest does represent a consensus anyway. In that case, in what world does an elimination contest of the 2.1 perks to gauge the at the time perceived values of perks carried out before 2.2s release so based on no hands-on experience of 2.2 and with the criteria for scoring being explicitly based on 2.1 victory conditions, that were scrapped in 2.2, represent a consensus about 2.2?

Ps: For what it is worth I also consider One Vision a weak perk except for role-playing purposes, but it IS an easy way out for a player that has problems with the faction system and just want people to follow the chosen ethics. Certainly it cannot be recommended in general to players adept at the game.

And here I was picking it up because I liked the unity buff. I just considered the ethics attraction an extra bonus.

 

[Peter Ebbesen]

Different playing styles indeed.

When playing moderately aggressive wide expansion, which seems to be the playstyle you base the guide on, no way would the first 30-60 years pass without me spending hundreds of influence on edicts as well as the energy campaigns. By 60 years I have transitioned from what I consider early game strategies to midgame.

In fact, it is not uncommon for me to run Map the Stars from soon after start when I have the first two science ships running (I tend to go for 6-8 of them up and running before concentrating on other matters; One science ships explores the universe and meets strange new people for fun and profit, the others survey) and for one extension, making them last until around 2222 without Executive Vigor and 2227 with. This is in 800 star galaxies with default settings and Glavius, and I generally don't play xenophobes so no influence cost reduction for expansion there.

By the 2230s when things go well, 2240s at the latest, I'll be running the mineral influence edicts nonstop if I have Executive Vigour, occasionally if not, as there's often a mineral rather than influence bottleneck at that point to fund construction and alloys.

This is the general case: As always, developments in the universe can trigger contingency plans. Perhaps I'm boxed in? Perhaps I have some exceptional early game opportunity determined by circumstances that makes me switch to an early war footing? Perhaps I have lots of high mineral systems within easy reach? But in the general humdrum case, that's how it goes due to the substantial bonus influence from meeting others and exploring anomalies.

Note that I also like starting with Interstellar Dominion for aggressive wide, but it really is a toss up between that and Executive Vigor, and I'm not averse to taking the two of them as my first and second perk in aggressive high unity builds where I anticipate overrunning most of the galaxy in the first century and a half or so. To be fair, in such games I usually take the Cutthroat Politics as well for savings on edicts and campaigns.

 

[evilcat]

Personal opinion:

1. Interstellar Dominion - Only important if you are not xenophobe AND you have like big pocket of personal space to fast grab. Otherwise you probably have enought influence for your needs. Some map settings may favour/disfavour. Like less empires make it better. Also arm galaxies have less pockets.
2. Executive Vigour - good and safe. Works also on Unity, Energy and rare resources.
4. Mastery of Nature - just pick habitats?
5. Technological Ascendancy - Good and safe
6. One Vision - if you go for Unity build you dont need it, ethic attraction isnt important

- Voidborne - Yes, generally you pick it when you want habbitats, that is what this perk do. Good if you are Authoritarian or Xenophobe (slaves livestock or domestic sevitude). Other empires may use it as love hotel. Could pick as 0 perk for some wonder rush.
- Nihilistic Acquisition - If you want to play that way it is ok. But you can also claim enemy capital and resettle. Or vassalize and integrate. It could be more efficient to vassalize more neighbours instead of bombarding.
- Consecrated Worlds - mass templess provide enought unity. But if you neighbour Spiritualistic FE there is probably bunch of worlds you cant settle (for now).
- Shared Destiny - integration is (bugged) not important cost
- Transcendent Learning - garbage, you can reach high values without it.

Tier 1 Options - Ranked
1. Imperial Prerogative - Only if you play Admiral and your name is Ackbar since it is trap. Not worth tradition slot.
2. Grasp the Void - You can get more fleet cap from habitats. But there could be scenerio and situation when you need that extra bases.With new trade system and some wide play it could be good, just never happened to me.
3. Enigmatic Engineering - MP thing.

Tier 2 Options - Generic
- Galactic Force Projection - Habitats are still better source of fleet cap. Better with total war civic (like devouring swarm or fanatic purifiers) so you can very early field more fleet, before technology.
- Master Builders - It gives you pernament choice of mega engineering. So this could be important if you want to rush wonders.
- World Shaper - There are several others ways to get "gaia" worlds as bonus planet (or at least districts) so this one is not special
- Eternal Vigilance - Very weak indeed

Tier 2 Options - Specialized
- Hive Worlds - not important
- Machine Worlds - not important
- Synthetic Age - not important

Tier 3 Options
- Galactic Wonders - generally before you can build new wonder the game is very late. There are generally some precursors megastructures. But Dyson sphere is nice.
- Colossus Project - Instead of building wonders just total war galaxy and get which ever wonder there is.
- Defender of the Galaxy - Ok 8th pick. At this point you probably do not need anything else.
- Galactic Contender - FE planets are generally good, and killing them before they awake that is some solution to the problem. Sometimes there could be like 3 FE nearby.

Ascessions: I prefer Evolution or Psionic. With synthetic you can just go with flesh is week without second and keep all your special perks and maybe focus on megastructures.

 

[Peter Ebbesen]

And here I was picking it up because I liked the unity buff. I just considered the ethics attraction an extra bonus.

It is a nice unity buff to all your pops, but, well, it is only 10% when all is said and done. You can gain the same for your starting race with the traditional civic, get a much more powerful unity effect from Consecrated Worlds perk for Spiritualists. Even Transcendent Learning, one of the weakest perks around, will potentially provide +6% unity if the ruler lives long enough in addition to its other bonuses. Of course One Vision provides its bonuses up front, so at least it has that.

Or you can get a perk that'll help you expand faster, allowing you to get more unity producing pops sooner, and thus increasing your unity gain by even more. It is not that +10% unity is bad, it is just that if you are min/maxing at all, it is hard to justify given the competition.

50% ethics attraction, on the other hand, is something that especially for a conqueror has some value that is hard to gain elsewhere. And even that isn't enough to make the perk generally competitive unless the player is a softy that wants happy pops.

Then again, that's just my opinion and thankfully neither you nor I need to min/max if we don't want to. In fact, SP games are funnier when I limit myself and craft narrative for the game that supports the limits. Fanatic Spiritualist/Authoritarian empire with Aristocratic Elite, and Cutthroat Politics (later adding imperial cult) with Executive Vigour, Consecrated Worlds, and One Vision, then PSI ascendance's 2 perks as the first 5 picks and in that order? Bring it on! The entire galaxy will be singing from the same hymn book ere the end.

 

[Slynx]

main value of colossus is not colossus itself, but Total War Casus belli. making it almost must have pick for non-genocidal warmongering empires.
also in 2.2 ecumenopolis\hive world\machine world is almost must have (and to a certain degree Galactic wonders)
and...I guess I disagree with almost everything on your list.
for example from tier 0 perks I think only voidborne, nihilistic and xeno-compatibility are useful. others are crap\weaker\outright waste of slot

 

[redrum68]

Different playing styles indeed.

When playing moderately aggressive wide expansion, which seems to be the playstyle you base the guide on, no way would the first 30-60 years pass without me spending hundreds of influence on edicts as well as the energy campaigns. By 60 years I have transitioned from what I consider early game strategies to midgame.

In fact, it is not uncommon for me to run Map the Stars from soon after start when I have the first two science ships running (I tend to go for 6-8 of them up and running before concentrating on other matters; One science ships explores the universe and meets strange new people for fun and profit, the others survey) and for one extension, making them last until around 2222 without Executive Vigor and 2227 with. This is in 800 star galaxies with default settings and Glavius, and I generally don't play xenophobes so no influence cost reduction for expansion there.

By the 2230s when things go well, 2240s at the latest, I'll be running the mineral influence edicts nonstop if I have Executive Vigour, occasionally if not, as there's often a mineral rather than influence bottleneck at that point to fund construction and alloys.

This is the general case: As always, developments in the universe can trigger contingency plans. Perhaps I'm boxed in? Perhaps I have some exceptional early game opportunity determined by circumstances that makes me switch to an early war footing? Perhaps I have lots of high mineral systems within easy reach? But in the general humdrum case, that's how it goes due to the substantial bonus influence from meeting others and exploring anomalies.

Note that I also like starting with Interstellar Dominion for aggressive wide, but it really is a toss up between that and Executive Vigor, and I'm not averse to taking the two of them as my first and second perk in aggressive high unity builds where I anticipate overrunning most of the galaxy in the first century and a half or so. To be fair, in such games I usually take the Cutthroat Politics as well for savings on edicts and campaigns.

I'd say we have a fairly similar approach and play fairly similar settings. I guess I just tend to experience influence as the limiting factor for expansion so usually avoid spending it for pretty much anything but outposts during say the first 50 years. I do wonder what the average return for map the stars is and how much +10% anomaly discovery chance gives as I hardly ever use it. In 2.2, it seems there are a lot more high value mineral deposits on systems so I tend to have a lot of minerals which avoids alloys becoming a limiting factor on expansion and don't feel the need to run Production Targets (essentially rather take that 300 influence and instead plant 6 more outposts at least while I still have decent systems to expand to).

But if you do tend to run some edicts early game then it definitely closes the gap between Interstellar Domination and Executive Vigour. To some extent, it also depends on spawn location and how much room you have to expand as well as whether you are able to cut off other empires.

Here's a game where I was playing all standard settings except Grand Admiral (no Glavius) using United Nations of Earth (so about as vanilla as you can get). I got a pretty good starting position with lots of space and was able to cut off Tzynn Empire which left me with a ton of space to expand. Influence has essentially been the bottleneck for expansion the entire game with no issues around minerals/alloys. I definitely think Interstellar Domination made a significant difference here as I'd probably have 20% less systems (so like 14 less if I hadn't taken it). I also find it hard to think about spending influence on anything else those first 50 years but who knows maybe I would have found more anomalies which could have even given influence if using Map the Stars. And yes border gore is alive and well at this point

 

[Peter Ebbesen]

I'd say we have a fairly similar approach and play fairly similar settings. I guess I just tend to experience influence as the limiting factor for expansion so usually avoid spending it for pretty much anything but outposts during say the first 50 years. I do wonder what the average return for map the stars is and how much +10% anomaly discovery chance gives as I hardly ever use it.

It helps a lot. With the significant caveat that I haven't tested it's mechanics recently, from memory the way it once worked and possibly still does was that there was low base chance for any first survey to yield an anomaly 5% or 10%, something like that, to which every failed survey increased the chance by a percent or so, and any successful survey reset the chance to the base.

The pre 2.2 Discovery opener and Map the Stars, both of which increase the chance, thus significantly add to the number of anamolies you will find. And Map the Stars boosts survey speed too, which is a nice bonus. Which is why the Discovery opener was finally changed in 2.2 because it was just too bloody powerful as a first pick when coupled with science ship spam, which 2.0+ made trivial to engage in.

There's no guarantee you'll recover the influence you spend on it from anomalies, but with aggressive surveying before AI empires have a chance to survey much it is likely, and even if you don't you end up with a lot more anomaly rewards of either direct value or more valuable systems. I find it very, very hard to justify NOT running Map the Stars for at least one period in the earliest game, because it is just so good when you've got a lot of systems to survey as the first and a fleet of science ships.

But as noted, I've not tested the exact functionality recently. In fact, I don't think I've tried playing without Map the Stars in the early game in 2.2 at all. So I might be wrong on this with regards to current functionality.

Ps: Lovely screenshot. That's an Interstellar Dominion opening position if ever there was one.

 

[Dustman]

There was a thread at some point about Nihilistic Acquisition and it turned to be quite funny. Got ideas for some crazy builds from it, like Life-Seeded Barbaric Despoilers. This perk is wonderful if you don't go for 'grab everything, even if it's 2 energy deposit star system' playstyle. Selective claims are relatively cheap, so no need for Interstellar Dominion, and no need for armies is easier on economy, plus these days AI likes to build 3 enforcer buildings on every rock, making invasions quite difficult. Not as good if target's out of you comfort climate, but can be used for slave trading or resettlement. Even genocidal states can find uses for it once in awhile. Normally homeworlds are worth getting, due to development and large resources in star systems themselves, leaving other planets for constant pop milking. Pop growth is a king in 2.2.x, and Nihilistic Acquisition is very good at creating new pops for you at lower admin overhead.

@redrum68 Try starting as f.spiritualist authoritarian with cutthroat politics + imperial cult one day. Just see real power of edicts. Although f.spiritualist + authoritarian + exalted priesthood + cutthroat politic isn't bad either. Executive Vigor is the king with such combos.

 

[redrum68]

There was a thread at some point about Nihilistic Acquisition and it turned to be quite funny. Got ideas for some crazy builds from it, like Life-Seeded Barbaric Despoilers. This perk is wonderful if you don't go for 'grab everything, even if it's 2 energy deposit star system' playstyle. Selective claims are relatively cheap, so no need for Interstellar Dominion, and no need for armies is easier on economy, plus these days AI likes to build 3 enforcer buildings on every rock, making invasions quite difficult. Not as good if target's out of you comfort climate, but can be used for slave trading or resettlement. Even genocidal states can find uses for it once in awhile. Normally homeworlds are worth getting, due to development and large resources in star systems themselves, leaving other planets for constant pop milking. Pop growth is a king in 2.2.x, and Nihilistic Acquisition is very good at creating new pops for you at lower admin overhead.

@redrum68 Try starting as f.spiritualist authoritarian with cutthroat politics + imperial cult one day. Just see real power of edicts. Although f.spiritualist + authoritarian + exalted priesthood + cutthroat politic isn't bad either. Executive Vigor is the king with such combos.

Yeah, if you combo some of the edict cost decreases then Executive Vigor becomes really strong. In some of those cases, I think you have a good argument for both Interstellar Domination and Executive Vigor if you are going really wide so you can save as much influence as possible to take edicts but still be expanding to lots of systems.

 

[LeanneKaos]

I don't consider myself a Machine Empire expert so would be interested in other opinions here. I've mostly seen that some people take it and others don't. +2 trait points and cheaper pop mod is nice and will let you pick some pop bonuses. I guess I'd be interested in when you do pick it what traits you usually select to understand what you would be sacrificing in comparison to other AP bonuses.

Not an expert either, but I play machines a fair bit so here are my thoughts:
I think it's still good, just not quite as good as it was before 2.2, mostly because you don't have quite as fine control over pop building to minmax your specialization possibilities. And I think that's put a lot of people off of it.

As for what I do with it, I sort of have two approaches.

One is that you try to build specialist templates, and then set your planets to only build the relevant specialists. This is a bit micro-heavy, but could be strong. (For really insane levels of micro, you can go further and swap templates to get a mix of menial and complex drone specialists matching up to the jobs available in your buildings, and then try to force the AI to put the right ones in the right jobs.. which might involve gaming the priorities a bit as well to encourage proper placement, and the occasional bout of "empty all jobs then refill them.")
An approach I like here (which may not be the best) is to start with Mass Produced + Durable. Save the point from Robomodding until you unlock Synthetic Age, then create four templates as follows:
+ Double Jointed, + Superconductive (for generator worlds)
+ Double Jointed, + Power Drills (for mining worlds)
+ Double Jointed, + Logic Circuits (for research worlds)
+ Efficient Processors (for forge worlds, it's the only boost with relevancy there.)

(The reason to save the point from Robomodding instead of just adding Double Jointed straight away is to avoid doing an extra round of upgrades before unlocking the cost reduction from SA.)
The second, less complex approach is to just take the Forge template bot as a Generalist bot, since the bonus applies to all jobs.

I'm thinking of trying a slightly different one now though. Start with a Mining template using Luxurious for the extra points needed, then go into the full specialist spread (using the points from SA to remove Luxurious from the main template.)

...
I am a bit curious how robot templating works with leader-specific perks, though. Specifically: if I start my initial species with Enhanced Memory for my initial leaders and then take it out of the template later on, do my current leaders lose it or do I just not get it for any replacements I might have to hire later on? If I add it to the template later, does it get added to my existing leaders as well or do I have to replace them to get leaders with that trait?

 

[Dustman]

I am a bit curious how robot templating works with leader-specific perks, though. Specifically: if I start my initial species with Enhanced Memory for my initial leaders and then take it out of the template later on, do my current leaders lose it or do I just not get it for any replacements I might have to hire later on? If I add it to the template later, does it get added to my existing leaders as well or do I have to replace them to get leaders with that trait?

Not being an avid user of machines, I can tell tho' that bio leaders change traits if their producing species is modified. Even if you modify a single planet, all leaders from that particular planet will change traits, like adding/removing Erudite, and you can't see in advance which leaders will be affected.

 

[PeterPancake]

I don't consider myself a Machine Empire expert so would be interested in other opinions here. I've mostly seen that some people take it and others don't. +2 trait points and cheaper pop mod is nice and will let you pick some pop bonuses. I guess I'd be interested in when you do pick it what traits you usually select to understand what you would be sacrificing in comparison to other AP bonuses.

Synthetic Age and Machine World is the equivalent to Ascension (Bio, Psionic, Synth). If you don't pick these as ME you shouldn't go that way with fleshy empires, too. There are 8 AP what else is more important? ME have even less ascension perks to choose from. As Synthetic Age is a rather late pick and you can slowly feel your housing/amenities constraint. Get Emotion Emulators and Double Jointed. Machine Worlds don't need a 2 maintenance depot (mostly relevant for +20 size) and need less housing districts.

Machine Empires are forcefully constraint on buildings because they don't need CG and Food (or less as DA or if you Amalgamate). So they tend to have a higher desire for Amenities, and Crime Reduction.