Army Disintergartion BUG MP

[ForzaA]

That your the first paragraph of your post meant exactly what I tried to say with so many words was interesting to hear. I congratulate you on your in-depth knowledge of the game engine. Apparently not one single player in her game knew about it. Neither did I. And nor did Tonioz if I interpret what he wrote correctly.

Anyway, good we know of it now. Sending in re-enforcements is apparently a dangerous thing to do. Even Buonaparte with a 500k/100k/300k army might be killed in 1 second by a 1000/0/0 army if I understand it correctly.

I don't think such a roll is possible.
However, if the Austrians had an exceptional roll (a possibility, if the russians had few troops left, and the Austrians had a leader superior to the Russian leader, and better morale) - say a roll of "each unit kills an enemy per calculation" [several calculations per phase]
and the russians had an extremely poor roll (bad morale, few troops, no good leader) - say "kill nothing"
then even lag of only one calculation in the battle may cause the destruction of a significant force.

new calculations are made only at the beginning of a phase, which is when Brandenburg's leader and extra forces WOULD have had an effect on the rolls.

That is, atleast, how I understand the whole combat resolution.

This means, then, that Austria managed to kill say 2/3 of the Brandenburger army in a few "calculations" - leaving her with a far greater cavalry force for the anihilation calculation.

EDIT: To be sure - this is not to say that Bumblebee is a liar, and if I had been there I would've probably wanted to pause the game to decide on a reasonable resolution - as it is, if I am correct, an EXTREMELY unlucky stacking of game effects, and could be a bug if this is not how it happened.

 

[unmerged(6147)]

Interesting. You may well be right. When I gave my Boney example I assumed that the new nation appearing on the arena was entirely disregarded and just suffered losses in proportion to what the old army present from start suffered. If that old army (RUS in our example) army was annihilated (i.e. lost 100% of its army), so was the new incoming army (be it BrB or Boney with his 1 million men army).

So, the inner mechanics are still not entirely clear.

 

[Dago]

well,i was russia even if i did take care much of that battle coz fighting also in other fronts
btw,i had a 4 1 5 leader with LT18 ( same of Austria,even if morale is much worst for some dp slider,and austria was CounterReform and DOFT also iirc )
i had there 10k inf and about 25k cavaklry
bra was arriving with 60-65 about
while austria had 90-95 with about 50k cavalry (bra had about 20-25 cav )
my army were annihilated together brandeburg ( not before ) ,and command of battle was took by bra leader ( dont know his stats )
in first phases we were fighting about 80-90 vs the same
then,in a couple of days our troops disappeared
but i dont think is a bug,just bad luck

 

[Slargos]

That you do not consider that a bug is fascinating

And do not for a second believe that all features and game mechanics are chosen by the designer of a system/program. These men are not all-knowing Gods although we sometime consider Johan to be one.

I agree with Forz, this is not a bug.

It is a very unfortunate effect of the annihilation routine and should probably be changed if possible, but it's hard to call it a bug, IMO.

Just because Johan did not intend this to function this way doesn't mean it's a bug. It's rather an unintended effect of the system.

A bug is when you design something and it works contrary to intended.

 

[Slargos]

Take it like a man, LE.

- Whine.
- Curse.
- Respond to any objections to the nature of this socalled "bug" with profanity against the person raising the objections and also anyone with a similar avatar and/or name.

 

[Wyvern]

Doesn't sound like a bug to me. These things happen, live with it.

 

[unmerged(17563)]

Dago is incorrect as he himself just said he wasnt watching the battle so how can he know what happened so preciesly.

I have heard nothing here to suggest to me that it wasnt a bug and I'm gonna continue to believe this.

 

[unmerged(27108)]

It's like the faith.

 

[Dago]

Dago is incorrect as he himself just said he wasnt watching the battle so how can he know what happened so preciesly.

I have heard nothing here to suggest to me that it wasnt a bug and I'm gonna continue to believe this.

i ve watched the battle,and i saw a momente there were 2 great armies fight,then i went in another place for some mom,i come back and i saw our army disappear
and has gone as i said : i ve nothing interest for come here and say false

 

[unmerged(6147)]

A bug is when you design something and it works contrary to intended.

Johan says to himself: "Now let me see. Bumble Bee entered a battle with an army about the same size as her opponent, some 60-70k at LT 17-18, and got annihilated in one 'split second'... Wow, that was not something I intended to be possible..."

I have underlined the word "intended", just to make sure you won't miss it Slargos.

 

[Slargos]

Johan says to himself: "Now let me see. Bumble Bee entered a battle with an army about the same size as her opponent, some 60-70k at LT 17-18, and got annihilated in one 'split second'... Wow, that was not something I intended to be possible..."

I have underlined the word "intended", just to make sure you won't miss it Slargos.

Well, mr precision. There is a difference between unintended effect and unexpected effect. The former is a bug, the latter is an unintended design feature.

Putting it in simple enough terms for your precision requirement:

If you build a ladder that breaks when you step on the top-rung, you've got a design bug. If you build a ladder that creaks on the top-rung, you've got an unintended design feature.

I don't know Johan's intentions on this, but the kind of situation sounds like something leaning towards unexpected rather than unintended. That doesn't mean I think it should stay because I certainly don't. I think this is unfortunate in the extreme if true and should be remedied. It's not frequent enough to warrant a big fuzz however.

Let me clarify: If I were in the position of Johan, it is not something I would prioritize ahead of more important changes.

I'm not passing judgement on this bug/feature, I'm just expressing my opinion on its severity..

 

[K'shar]

Johan says to himself: "Now let me see. Bumble Bee entered a battle with an army about the same size as her opponent, some 60-70k at LT 17-18, and got annihilated in one 'split second'... Wow, that was not something I intended to be possible..."

I have underlined the word "intended", just to make sure you won't miss it Slargos.

I would also point out that the original information about timing and strength of numbers that LE pointed out were not totally correct. I have personally had worse battles then this case and so have many others, hence the reality that it's occurence is not taken by the community of our players (in game) to warrant something on the scale of an edit. Tha battle did indeed last for some 6 days as well, so it was not a split second situation. That LE missed most of the battle and then lost her last remaining hope for winning a war is a much stronger factor in describing her insistance that the battle was a bug and one that must be corrected, as well as her subsequent leaving when her request was denied, which in turn spawned this thread.

For a synopsis of the battle in actuality from beginning to end (due to its importance i did not deign to attend to other matters at the time) one can check the War III thread.

 

[unmerged(11216)]

Doesn't sound like a bug to me. These things happen, live with it.

Agreed, sometimes you're just very very unlucky.