AoW - New Trade Nodes

[Red John]

As for the MP side of things, I'm worried that this will now create even more of an incentive for the Burgundians to start taking the mighty french Johnson gleefully.

On the other hand, it might make England actually give two s**** about Europe. Yay.

 

[delpiero1234]

On another note, why is Seville an end node? One of the most important structural weaknesses of the Spanish Empire was that by the late 17th century, 60% of Spain's income that arrived from the Americas into Cadiz would quickly leave Spain to other parts of Europe. How can this be represented if Seville is an end node? Of course, I'm not arguing that this should be set in stone to happen, but given that this is what historically happened it should at least be possible.

Paradox should just use the trade node network from VeF because in VeF Sevilla is not an end node and you can therefore steer trade away from it.
Also making Bordeaux an end-node makes Frances even more OP. Good thing that I don't play vanilla EU IV anymore

 

[Amosblanco]

The new trade node map will give more incentive to drive those European countries into their historical role, colonies. But in compensation, the new one give countries more inflexibility.
According what i have seen in Atlantic trade:
Bordeaux trade node receives trade income from St. Lawrence but not from Chesapeake.
English Channel receives trade income from Chesapeake but not from St. Lawrence
Sevilla can only get income from Caribbean.
Safi trade node, designed for Morocco, can not steer trade from either America or from Ivory coast.
.........
Therefore, France will be driven to colonize there Quebec
Dutch will be driven to colonize Chesapeake bay
Iberian North America will not likely to show.
Poor Moroccan and Algerians will become Barbary pirates targeting Spanish trade fleet
........
I don't want to get a comment on these changes
But it is controversial I have to say.

 

[Ralepozozaxe]

The thing is Paris isn't in the Bordeaux trade node, it's in the champagne one. Not that it matters since they own all of the Bordeaux one anyway. The other colonizers will still get more trade as they will have more boats and better trade ideas.

 

[saegoto]

Bordeaux should not be an end node since eng/ned and cas/por share node.

 

[Golladan]

Not that it matters since they own all of the Bordeaux one anyway.

Technically they own most of it. There's some of Bordeaux in Iberia.

 

[Eldorian]

Technically they own most of it. There's some of Bordeaux in Iberia.

Brittany and Navarre, oh the competition.

 

[PiriReis]

The new trade node map will give more incentive to drive those European countries into their historical role, colonies. But in compensation, the new one give countries more inflexibility.
According what i have seen in Atlantic trade:
Bordeaux trade node receives trade income from St. Lawrence but not from Chesapeake.
English Channel receives trade income from Chesapeake but not from St. Lawrence
Sevilla can only get income from Caribbean.
Safi trade node, designed for Morocco, can not steer trade from either America or from Ivory coast.
.........
Therefore, France will be driven to colonize there Quebec
Dutch will be driven to colonize Chesapeake bay
Iberian North America will not likely to show.
Poor Moroccan and Algerians will become Barbary pirates targeting Spanish trade fleet
........
I don't want to get a comment on these changes
But it is controversial I have to say.

Should have made a Tunis -> Safi connection instead of Seville

 

[Andrzej I]

Brittany and Navarre, oh the competition.

The Franks and their 'mighty' armies shall fall before the wealth of Brittany and Navarre! :laugh:

 

[Achanei]

I am happy to see the death of that terrible west europe node. colonial nations are useful again! The other node changes, I think its too early to tell how it'll play out - I like the changes to antwerp in principle, but the overall design now seems to make sevilla that much easier to control in comparison, especially since now you don't even have to eat the increased coring coast lands of the north africans.

overall, I still think the trade system needs to be less static with options to change the direcion of trade flow or the routes entirely, but that is a bigger project. next expansion maybe?

 

[Hakuromatsu]

Solid changes!

Though Bordeaux becoming an end node is an unfortunate choice -- Europe is too cluttered with end nodes now, to say nothing of the quasi-buff to France. If there had to be a new end node I wish they'd put it somewhere off the wall, like in Hangzhou.

overall, I still think the trade system needs to be less static with options to change the direcion of trade flow or the routes entirely, but that is a bigger project. next expansion maybe?

Next game, rather. It's not happening in EUIV.

 

[Blindbohemian]

France gets a trade not for herself, POR/SPA and ENG/NET have to share one. I detect imbalance

I think you'll find its a bit more balanced than you think. The Champagne node contains France's capital, and is fed from English Channel (competing with England and Netherlands), Bordeaux (competing with Castile) and Genoa (competing with Italy and Aragon). They still have competition, just not in their home node... Which means a lot of wealth will get siphoned off no matter what. Of course, they could move their trade port to one of the others but then they'd be losing out on 2/3 of trade. It's an interesting setup.

Edit: wtf Bordeaux is an end node I stand corrected.

 

[jockedahl]

Other major trade nations can still make a lot of money in Bordeaux considering France has the same collect malus as everyone else if they collect there. Just send light ships as Spain and you can steal a lot.

I like the changes.

 

[Frederick III]

Is England getting any kind of buff to compensate for the fact that it's losing a monopoly over its trade node? It was already kind of underpowered, though mostly because of the AI's inability to mount an amphibious campaign.

 

[Frederick III]

Other major trade nations can still make a lot of money in Bordeaux considering France has the same collect malus as everyone else if they collect there. Just send light ships as Spain and you can steal a lot.

I like the changes.

What do you mean, "same collect malus." France will just set Bordeaux as their preferred trade port. Boom, no malus.

 

[Demetrios]

My own take: in a no-WETN situation, there are many possible points of competition, and you can attempt to focus on one or many of those points with ships, province capture and buildings. With WETN, all ships get piled into one node regardless of geography. (And/or people end up collecting without ever steering to Europe at all.) Furthermore, that one node can't even have provinces or trade buildings. It's a far less interesting implementation.

Nothing irked me more than playing an Iberian power, doing all the work building up colonies and trade networks, and then siphoning all that trade back to Europe - only to watch all those other nations, who have done nothing at all, divert a good portion of the cash at the WETN.

 

[Eldorian]

Is England getting any kind of buff to compensate for the fact that it's losing a monopoly over its trade node? It was already kind of underpowered, though mostly because of the AI's inability to mount an amphibious campaign.

Um, England is fine. The Low Counties are screwed. England used to lose trade to Antwerpen, but now they can steal trade from Lubeck!

 

[Pornek]

Realism aside, now its just more micro again. There is really no difference wether I send my ships to Chesapeake & Carrabean or WETN. Just more fleets to keep track of.

 

[lucaluca]

Paradox should just use the trade node network from VeF because in VeF Sevilla is not an end node and you can therefore steer trade away from it.
Also making Bordeaux an end-node makes Frances even more OP. Good thing that I don't play vanilla EU IV anymore

Did you ever play EUIV before 1.4? Because Sevilla used to flow to Bordeaux and Antwerpen and WETN did not exist before CoP

 

[Ethanol]

Champagne node !, that makes the trade routes more historical and more interesting for burgundy, after all it always bugged me a bit how the Rhone/champagne route was merged with the north sea coast of the low countries.

And the death of wetn is nice, always had mixed feelings about that node (understood the logic, but felt it took away a lot of immersion and allowed gamey tactics vs the AI).

Champagne looks like a big feeder node (which is more or less historical), it feeds into bordeaux and antwerpen it would seem, and is feeded by genoa, not sure about the relation with rhineland (i would say it gets feeded but well honestly it could go both ways).

and the new saxon trade node will hopefully make the hre a bit more interesting, great changes overall !