anyone know what defines being "greater power" now?

[atwix]

I Always thought you need to be in scorelist for admin, diplo or military rank..

Now i'm not too sure.

I see people that can't ally anyone since even OPM are considered "greater power" now.

Whats up with this?

I need to know what exactly defines being a "greater power" for my RM guide...

So, did ,they change this, or is it buggy now? Seeing Luxembourg or Liege being considered as greater power sounds... off.

 

[unmerged(484926)]

I'm not 100% sure on the following.

It's based on the nation's score gain in the past month. The OPM great powers generally get their score from being near the top of the diplomatic ratings. If you go to the score comparison ledger entry, you can see what's causing it. They get diplomatic score for having strong allies (I think this is also based on score), for participating in wars (even if they don't contribute and also lose), for technology, and most importantly for a bunch of trade-related stuff. In other words, it goes to any HRE OPM that gets Trade Ideas and go to war a few times.

 

[Kirikano]

What the others have said. If you are top 10 in score in any category in the past month, you are a great power. Score calculation is kinda f*ed up though, since at the beggining of the game, small nations dominate diplomatic score for having allies larger than they are.

You can also get score for winning a war against someone stronger than you. I've seen OPMs jump to #1 ranking in every category for a few years at a time when they win a lucky war against someone bigger than they are. Also, winning a war against a colonial nation declaring independence gives a MASSIVE boost to your score, way more than normal.

 

[Illianor123]

i think it is if they are in the top 10 for a points scored per month list (so adm, dip and mil). Allies are quite a strong part of the dip points, so a OPM with 2 big allies can be in that top 10.

 

[kente]

in 1.6 great power were the top 16, not top 10.
Anyway the Great power list changes very quick at beginning of the game, but it stabilize after a while

 

[herrhals]

I forgot that a score system exists at all. To me, it is a completely useless and ambiguous part of the game.

 

[Aries666]

Winning tough wars where the odds were against you now provides a large boost to your score, which early in the game an OPM beating a 3-4PM can often give them enough score to get into the top 10 albeit temporarily making them a great power.

 

[ahyangyi]

Winning tough wars where the odds were against you now provides a large boost to your score, which early in the game an OPM beating a 3-4PM can often give them enough score to get into the top 10 albeit temporarily making them a great power.

I remember that's what happened when my Kathiawar eat Bahmanis (with the help of Vanametoolongicantremember, of course).

 

[atwix]

so, any nation in any top 16 is considered greater power? Or only the best 16 nations in overall score? Seems the first right? Because many nations would be in top 16 for multiple categories, reducing the greater power number?

 

[TheDarkMaster]

so, any nation in any top 16 is considered greater power? Or only the best 16 nations in overall score? Seems the first right? Because many nations would be in top 16 for multiple categories, reducing the greater power number?

Maybe, the key seems to be how fast you're gaining points at that time, not your overall score.

 

[Aries666]

Maybe, the key seems to be how fast you're gaining points at that time, not your overall score.

I think this is the case, I have beaten a great power and they have lost their status due to major negatives for the war being applied to their score gain, only to regain status a few years later.

 

[Sandmann]

I forgot that a score system exists at all. To me, it is a completely useless and ambiguous part of the game.

Hehe ye i rarely even look at it, the only exception being that it might play a role in the chances of getting a PU or dynasty, see Atwix PU thread.

 

[atwix]

I think this is the case, I have beaten a great power and they have lost their status due to major negatives for the war being applied to their score gain, only to regain status a few years later.

this is useful but weird info.

So he best wa to get score gain is to win versus a really big country as small country huh. It would explain why i was geater power asFOIX with jutthree provinces (rest was vassal territory).

This would also mean that BEST time to ally and rm big nation is when they lost war, since they might have lost their greater power status. This is good info for my RM guide. Come to think of it: England loses greater power status after losing HYW bad. It explains why i could marry and ally them whe i already had 3 greater power allies. Well, all makes sense now.

Can you see score gain in ledger? I will check ingame.

 

[unmerged(484926)]

Yes. It's fairly easy to ally with most of the major powers by waiting until your allies are temporarily not great to avoid the malus. You can probably even manipulate it by allying a few OPMs with trade ideas and dragging them into a few quick wars for the score boost, then breaking alliance.

 

[Bragi]

This is really ridiculous. We need a proper long-term ranking, the one of VicII comes to my mind.

 

[Hexmage]

A potential solution would be that a great power needs to be in the top 16 of 2 of the score groups.
Another one could be that he has to be in the top 16 for longer then one month.
The only problem with these changes is that they might upset game balance and cause some crazy alliances.

 

[Aries666]

this is useful but weird info.

So he best wa to get score gain is to win versus a really big country as small country huh. It would explain why i was geater power asFOIX with jutthree provinces (rest was vassal territory).

This would also mean that BEST time to ally and rm big nation is when they lost war, since they might have lost their greater power status. This is good info for my RM guide. Come to think of it: England loses greater power status after losing HYW bad. It explains why i could marry and ally them whe i already had 3 greater power allies. Well, all makes sense now.

Can you see score gain in ledger? I will check ingame.

After a war its even easier as you will be getting positives for army and navy strength too. You can look at the breakdown for your score gain in all three by mousing over them in the ledger. Interestingly losing a big war can apply the malus to all three groups and will read someting like "Russian crusade against Kazan" -10.

 

[Strangedane]

A potential solution would be that a great power needs to be in the top 16 of 2 of the score groups.
Another one could be that he has to be in the top 16 for longer then one month.
The only problem with these changes is that they might upset game balance and cause some crazy alliances.

The alliance system is already crazy.
My Current Naples game had me allied to France, Sweden, Bohemia (Who ate hungary) and Castille.

My current GP ally malus is down to 150 because I decided to PU castille when they had a regency on a weak claim.

 

[TheDarkMaster]

A potential solution would be that a great power needs to be in the top 16 of 2 of the score groups.
Another one could be that he has to be in the top 16 for longer then one month.
The only problem with these changes is that they might upset game balance and cause some crazy alliances.

How about, being in the top x score per month nations for 3-4 months gives you great power status, while being outside of them for 3-4 months takes it away?