I am always reluctant to do civil wars, I am not very good at that ! How do you organise your armies and political factions, if you can enlighten me?
Anybody completed Sick Man of Europe for OE yet?
- Thread starter Green Giant
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Not hard when you try it a few times.
1. Urbanization - just build up what you need in each province - easy
2. Suppress separatism - you get this automatically - i guess you can fail if you ruin your SoL (btw always crack down rebels in events.. otherwise it gets worse)
3. Army Modernization - build Barracks in last 5 years (or mobilize conscript in war it works) - easy - just mostly build in Turkish provinces - you can have problems getting workers and officers to populate barracks. Btw build up at least 5-10 Arms factories
4. Bureaucratic Reform - this can be hard - its luck based a bit. . Landowners are a pain - but if you remove them from power and supress them they quickly go <20%. Don't radicalize them quickly. You may want to pass Dedicated police and then remove them from government. Fire their generals they give them clout power - generals reroll on game start so its random. I think safest bet is to Focus first on Elected beauracrats, then Agrarianism (you need it is prereq) then Per Capita Taxation and it is done. There is enough time to pass laws even with low percentage. Reform government a bit to increase percentage.
- Education Reform - I think it is impossible to raise education _by_ 35% - maybe if you build 20 Unis very early and use decrees all the time
- Reclaim Syria - I didn't do it - but early war is good when Russia is busy. Naval invade Egypt Nile delta for the win - safest bet I think. It it luck based both diplomatically and in battles. Artillery general +30 attack is equal to a cheat early - whoever has it has a HUGE advantage to win the war.
1. Urbanization - just build up what you need in each province - easy
2. Suppress separatism - you get this automatically - i guess you can fail if you ruin your SoL (btw always crack down rebels in events.. otherwise it gets worse)
3. Army Modernization - build Barracks in last 5 years (or mobilize conscript in war it works) - easy - just mostly build in Turkish provinces - you can have problems getting workers and officers to populate barracks. Btw build up at least 5-10 Arms factories
4. Bureaucratic Reform - this can be hard - its luck based a bit. . Landowners are a pain - but if you remove them from power and supress them they quickly go <20%. Don't radicalize them quickly. You may want to pass Dedicated police and then remove them from government. Fire their generals they give them clout power - generals reroll on game start so its random. I think safest bet is to Focus first on Elected beauracrats, then Agrarianism (you need it is prereq) then Per Capita Taxation and it is done. There is enough time to pass laws even with low percentage. Reform government a bit to increase percentage.
- Education Reform - I think it is impossible to raise education _by_ 35% - maybe if you build 20 Unis very early and use decrees all the time
- Reclaim Syria - I didn't do it - but early war is good when Russia is busy. Naval invade Egypt Nile delta for the win - safest bet I think. It it luck based both diplomatically and in battles. Artillery general +30 attack is equal to a cheat early - whoever has it has a HUGE advantage to win the war.
I managed it first try. Some points
- don't jack up taxes, so you don't have angry radicals. The more loyalists, the more all parties love you and less likely to have revolutions
- first tech should be in the army, to be as powerful as Egypt. Don't build more troops, Egypt will usually want to fight if nobody calls allies, and then you can naval invade into Alexandria and Cairo and win with your first war securing all cores.
- Note that reclaiming Egypt has 2 entries, each worth a point. The other one involves puppeting egypt or owning key provinces. By that time you should be able to puppet it, and do it.
- bureaucratic reform is annoying, but suppressing landowners and appeasing them via police laws and similar should service to successfully pass all needed reforms
- In events, just try to have as few minority radicals as possible, so nobody wants to secede
- spread out your buildings for the urbanization goal
- when all other priorities are sorted out, spam out barracks to reach the 250 unit goal for the modernization entry.
It's not that hard if nobody messes with you in the first years.
- don't jack up taxes, so you don't have angry radicals. The more loyalists, the more all parties love you and less likely to have revolutions
- first tech should be in the army, to be as powerful as Egypt. Don't build more troops, Egypt will usually want to fight if nobody calls allies, and then you can naval invade into Alexandria and Cairo and win with your first war securing all cores.
- Note that reclaiming Egypt has 2 entries, each worth a point. The other one involves puppeting egypt or owning key provinces. By that time you should be able to puppet it, and do it.
- bureaucratic reform is annoying, but suppressing landowners and appeasing them via police laws and similar should service to successfully pass all needed reforms
- In events, just try to have as few minority radicals as possible, so nobody wants to secede
- spread out your buildings for the urbanization goal
- when all other priorities are sorted out, spam out barracks to reach the 250 unit goal for the modernization entry.
It's not that hard if nobody messes with you in the first years.
I am always reluctant to do civil wars, I am not very good at that ! How do you organise your armies and political factions, if you can enlighten me?
Politics: Try to lower Landowners powers without making them radicalized.
1. Get landowners out of the government and put Rural folk into. Spend 200 authority to oppress landowners. Spend another 200 to intelligentsia backing up. (why rural folk?= they are supporting professional army and agriculturalism. You won't need to rebuilt your government again and again to even discuss this laws. (rebuilting the government creates radicals out of the thin air.))
2. Remove landowners from the bureaucracy. This is -25% political power loss for them.
2. Switch to professional army. Another - 25% political power on Landowners. This will also make army faction extremely happy for some time. Their loyalty gives 10% offensive and defensive which is very useful.
3. You should remove landowner generals and admirals to lower their political power. (You can do this in the beginning. Make sure you won't trigger civil war before switching to professional army.)
4. Abolish slavery. This will make landowners rebellious. Start the debating law the moment professional army enacted. So you can use Army faction loyalty perk.
5. You can try to get into some defensive pact but you don't have to. Its just make things easier.
Army:
1. You need army quality. To achieve that there is a couple option. Better weapon / loyal army. You can try to build weapon factories their productions are not expensive but their construction cost is very high. It will delay raw material industry. The easiest way to acquiring them is entering custom unions with France/Great Britain.
2. Remove Kars barracks. It is harmful (not even useless) Build some in balkans if you can. (They only cost 50 construction. You can easily spam them. However you need to wait their employment rate is fulfilled. (BTW built everything in balkans. When civil war starts you will lose access to Anatolia.)
3. make sure your infantry quality is level 2 and artillery is lvl 3. Make sure you can acquire enough weapon and artillery. (Also switching equipment give %100 penalty to your army. Switch equipment 1 year before the civil war.
I hope this helps. Enjoy
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Civil wars can be trivial and abused in most games to beat down landowners.I am always reluctant to do civil wars, I am not very good at that ! How do you organise your armies and political factions, if you can enlighten me?
Since Ottomans is a large nation, you let the revolution counter to start ticking. Mouse over it to see which provinces will secede in it.
Cancel the law being passed to stop the revolution.
Delete barracks in those provinces.
Start passing the law again.
When they are at 90% revolution, go to the Conscription centers of the revolting provinces and upgrade the infantry unit or artillery unit and then downgrade it immediately. This gives those units a -75% defense and offense malus, so they can't really win.
If you have maybe 30-40 barracks in your provinces when they revolt, they might just give in once the revolt starts.
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In my experience reclaim Syria, reclaim Egypt, and Suppress Separatism are the easiest ones. Egypt hasn't backed down so far in my games (they did at release), and you do need to be a Great Power to claim all of Syria. My problem is we can't puppet Egypt in that second war and I'm reduced to burning a ton of infamy reclaiming the surroundings of Cairo. You can spend that extra money to ensure ethnic conflicts don't spiral out of control. It's not a long term expenditure.
The fourth reform is up to your luck. Administrative Reform can be a pain but you need to work towards it via ending Traditionalism and Land Taxation, at the very least. Urbanization is doable within the time limit. Army Modernization is a given: you need the napoleonic techs to beat egypt and expanding the army is important as well. What really seems daunting to me is raising Literacy rates by 35% in 20 years.
The fourth reform is up to your luck. Administrative Reform can be a pain but you need to work towards it via ending Traditionalism and Land Taxation, at the very least. Urbanization is doable within the time limit. Army Modernization is a given: you need the napoleonic techs to beat egypt and expanding the army is important as well. What really seems daunting to me is raising Literacy rates by 35% in 20 years.
Return state is bugged in current version. Thats why you are getting very high infamy.
The balance is for sure off on some of the Tanzimat journal entries, we're going to be looking into making some tweaks there (particularly to the literacy goal).
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I did it, but it took many attempts. It's really easy to over focus on one objective and run out of time. Winning the war against Egypt is not hard if you leave battalions in reserve for your generals or Tripoli takes Cairo. Also if you can get an ally it helps. If GB or Russia helps Egypt it can be tougher. If you do win the war, make sure to get connecting land (especially Adana and Aleppo because they are already integrated iirc) because they will occupy isolated states quickly and you will lose the war quickly as well. You may not want to integrate the low infrastructure states until you get that goal finished.
Taking Tabriz and some other provinces from Persia for opium access is doable. You can also puppet Wallachia, Moldavia, Serbia, and Greece, but it is questionable if it's worth it at that point. Montenegro usually falls in line unless France decides to support them. Still an easy war if you want to get them back fast. It's not really worth is to go after new, small states, like Ionia (I think that's the name) because of low infrastructure.
I find the 250 Battalions one to be the one I ignore, but it is doable. The education reform one is probably doable, but I for me it seemed impossible to achieve in 20 years. I'm sure there are people that know some tricks like releasing vassals or something, but I think that one is by far the hardest and synergizes the least with the other goals. It's safe to ignore.
Oh, you may want to remove Russia as a rival at the start to lessen the chance the attack you or get involved in your affairs. It's hard to tell how much it helps tbh, but I think it did. You can then rival Spain to replace the bird mana for example.
Taking Tabriz and some other provinces from Persia for opium access is doable. You can also puppet Wallachia, Moldavia, Serbia, and Greece, but it is questionable if it's worth it at that point. Montenegro usually falls in line unless France decides to support them. Still an easy war if you want to get them back fast. It's not really worth is to go after new, small states, like Ionia (I think that's the name) because of low infrastructure.
I find the 250 Battalions one to be the one I ignore, but it is doable. The education reform one is probably doable, but I for me it seemed impossible to achieve in 20 years. I'm sure there are people that know some tricks like releasing vassals or something, but I think that one is by far the hardest and synergizes the least with the other goals. It's safe to ignore.
Oh, you may want to remove Russia as a rival at the start to lessen the chance the attack you or get involved in your affairs. It's hard to tell how much it helps tbh, but I think it did. You can then rival Spain to replace the bird mana for example.
I don't like how army modernization mostly just consists of making it bigger. Is a small but well trained and equipped army not modern?
It was pretty simple for me to do this. I did the following:
Reclaimed Syria
Reclaimed Egypt
Army Reform
Suppress Separatism
I focused on hitting Egypt hard and that really made it easy. As soon as I could declare war on them, I did (for as many provinces as I could take).
The war is difficult, but I mobilised my entire country to fight in it. A handful of my armies were alone Infantry. Egypt doesn’t quite have enough to fully man the Asian and Libyan fronts. They virtually left Libya undefended—I waltzed into Cairo.
After that, I waited 5 years and tried to grab the two more remaining provinces—they backed down, though, so I only got Jordan.
At this point, a bit of luck helped me out. Egypt got involved in a war with Britain for an extended period. It bankrupted them and the British sank their fleet, so their rank dropped like a rock.
I was able to go to war with them for Palestine, Crete, and puppeting them. They did not back down. This was super easy, they had around 25 battalions and 25 they could mobilise.
Now here’s the good part—puppeting Egypt counts for the reclaim Egypt Tanzimat. So at this point I had 2 done.
I honestly did not think at all about suppressing separatism—I just didn’t increase taxes beyond level 4, didn’t try to pass any laws (that’d create radicals), and just tried not to get on anyone’s bad side.
For army reform—you just need to click it and then you can click off it. Conquering Syria will give you 250 battalions.
Reclaimed Syria
Reclaimed Egypt
Army Reform
Suppress Separatism
I focused on hitting Egypt hard and that really made it easy. As soon as I could declare war on them, I did (for as many provinces as I could take).
The war is difficult, but I mobilised my entire country to fight in it. A handful of my armies were alone Infantry. Egypt doesn’t quite have enough to fully man the Asian and Libyan fronts. They virtually left Libya undefended—I waltzed into Cairo.
After that, I waited 5 years and tried to grab the two more remaining provinces—they backed down, though, so I only got Jordan.
At this point, a bit of luck helped me out. Egypt got involved in a war with Britain for an extended period. It bankrupted them and the British sank their fleet, so their rank dropped like a rock.
I was able to go to war with them for Palestine, Crete, and puppeting them. They did not back down. This was super easy, they had around 25 battalions and 25 they could mobilise.
Now here’s the good part—puppeting Egypt counts for the reclaim Egypt Tanzimat. So at this point I had 2 done.
I honestly did not think at all about suppressing separatism—I just didn’t increase taxes beyond level 4, didn’t try to pass any laws (that’d create radicals), and just tried not to get on anyone’s bad side.
For army reform—you just need to click it and then you can click off it. Conquering Syria will give you 250 battalions.
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Something that's a big help with bureaucratic reforms is that the ottomans get a special event chain that fires once you hand landowners out of government and less than 25% clout which gives you a series of events that let you grind the landowners into the dust in a fairly short time period. Since the sultan is intelligentsia aligned you can relatively easily pass appointed bureaucrats which will strengthen them even further, then boost industrialists and bring them into the coalition to help pass some economic reforms
Its actually very easy. You put an army on both fronts and then naval invade Lower Egypt which will work 100% of the time and since it contains the Egyptian capital you just chill and sip some çay.
Not in this time period. It is the era of large professional armies. A small but well trained army is really the model of the previous era. Besides modernization does require that you research line infantry and Napoleonic warfare doesn't it?
I was always under the impression that the British Army was relatively small during the time period.
While not exactly backwards as such, the British Army between 1836 and the passage of the Cardwell Reforms was... really, really not the template of modernity.
i have done it. took 3 attempts.
the separatism one is very easy. did it all three times without any explicit effort. urbanisation and reclaim Syria has synergy as most of the Syrian states already has urban centers.
selling tea to the British is incredibly profitable.
The states have to be incorpareted. Syrian states may not make it in time.
