Antolian Turkish Minors

[chegitz guevara]

From the time the Turks adopted Islam through the early modern period. It includes Russia, Central Asia, China, and India, as well as the Middle East.

Wait . . . you have an Ottoman lecturer? So, why don't you solicit his help?

 

[|AXiN|]

Her help, and she's pretty snowed under atm from teaching three courses concurrently. Also, he speciality is more the Viccy timeframe. Still, she sent out an email about the cancellation of that Armenian Genocide conference - did you see about that?

 

[Norrefeldt]

Still, she sent out an email about the cancellation of that Armenian Genocide conference - did you see about that?

It was big news in Europe since it affects Turkey's EU application. (Not trying to rekindle a debate that Yasko so graciously ended.)

 

[Yasko]

I didn't buy it though; I borrowed it through interlibrary loan. I'm begining to think I might need to learn Turkish, which, uhm, I'm not gonna do. Where are Yasko and the other Turks when you need them? I want to give them some assignments.

Not many people can read the Ottoman language nowadays, not even in Turkey. The problem is that the Ottomans used a language(obviously similiar to turkish) but wrote in "official Ottoman language" that is very difficult to understand. It was a mix of languages and sometimes you can interpret it wrongly if you think that its like Turkish.

You know, i happen to have a book titled "Ilk Osmanlilar ve anadolu beylikleri"(or a similiar name). Something like "First Ottomans and the Anatolian principalities", only in turkish. Its a composition of different articles that have been writen lately, so its pretty fresh information.

But i´ll be in Turkey this summer and planning to buy couple of History books, just tell me what kind of info you need, i´ll try to get it. The kind of information you seem to look for, is ussually easier to find in turkish. I also remember Tuna that posted on EU earlier had an interest in this period. But i dont know he is still active.

 

[chegitz guevara]

I suppose asking for precise dates that Aydin, Tekke, and Jandar were annexed would be a bit much, but if we could even get a month, that would be better than what we've got.

Any events that occured, would also be cool. Unfortunately, because I have to leave town for a funeral suddenly, I had to return all my interlibrary loan books before they were due. I had at least one event about a particular troublesome Turkish adventurer, who kept trying to set himself up as an emir, finally seizing Smyrna in 1426 before the Ottomans finally just killed him.

I'm going to be in Chicago for a week, so I'm going to try and get down to the Oriental Museum at the Univerity of Chicago and see what resources I can find there.

 

[Yasko]

I have only found the years so far. Candar also called (Isfandiyar/ogullari) later survived as a Ottoman vassal untill 1461. Their bey revolted against Murad II 1423 but lost the battle of Bolu. Murad kept him as bey and vassal. Very tight dynastical ties to Ottomans, they were of same tribe (Kayi). Annexed peacfully late 1461.

Teke 1423

Aydin late 1425. early 1426. The annexation of Aydin is not a pretty event. Entire family and relatives of the Cuneyd Bey(he rebelled against Ottos several times) was executed to give an exempel to other turkish aristocrats in the area.

I could not find the exact dates, but found background info about their annexation by the Ottomans, wich you probably know already.

Much of the information that i read is taken from Halil Inalcik and Fuat Köprulu, im gonna try to get find their works about the anatolian principalities when i am in Turkey during the summer.

 

[unmerged(21523)]

Question: Would Kastamonu make a better state for Kastamon province than Candar? Candar was already pretty well incorporated into the OE in 1419 (several of Murad II's officers were scions of the Candarli dynasty) while Kastamonu retained a greater degree of independence until its annexation in the 1460s( I believe 1463, at any rate on the same campaign in which Trebizond was conquered). Any thoughts?

 

[chegitz guevara]

Kastamonu is Jandar.

 

[Emre Yigit]

Hi guys. I've generally played Vanilla EU2, but am now thinking of making the switch. I'd be happy to help with Turco-centric events and data checking.

 

[unmerged(21523)]

Kastamonu is Jandar.

You seem to be correct here. It seems the Candar and Kastamonu were reuinted after Timur's invasion in 1402. In which case, Candar should be an Ottoman vassal.

 

[dharper]

Hi guys. I've generally played Vanilla EU2, but am now thinking of making the switch. I'd be happy to help with Otto-centric events and data checking.

Wonderful! The more the merrier.

I hope you enjoy the AGCEEP setup.

 

[Garbon]

You seem to be correct here. It seems the Candar and Kastamonu were reuinted after Timur's invasion in 1402. In which case, Candar should be an Ottoman vassal.

You do realize that a lot changed after his death, right?

 

[unmerged(21523)]

You do realize that a lot changed after his death, right?

I certainly do. Furthermore, I do not devote my spare time to these forums to be either insulted or patronized. I made a mistake and I admitted to it when it was brought to my attention. May I take the liberty of assuming that I'm not the only person on this forum ever to have made a factual error?

 

[|AXiN|]

Calm down, I'm pretty sure no insult was intended.

 

[LlywelynII]

One problem I've run into in my BYZ game is that once (is QAR the Black Sheep?) - anyway, whichever set of Sheep was supposed to get annexed by the other Sheep (AKK, if they're the white ones), didn't. There needs to be a backup set of events to start the Persian revolt if AKK is already kaput - or a "you are now AKK" event where the country changes tags.

I didn't notice for about sixty years, and now Persia is a mammoth, happily-converting Turk Sunni tribe with no destabilizing events (or any events) for the rest of the game.

jay.

 

[|AXiN|]

Yeah, that's a known problem. Garbon's supposedly on a solution, but hasn't posted anything. I'd be in favour of giving QAR an event if either they hold AKK's capital or it's about time for the first post-annexation AKK event to trigger which turns them into AKK.

 

[unmerged(21523)]

Yeah, that's a known problem. Garbon's supposedly on a solution, but hasn't posted anything. I'd be in favour of giving QAR an event if either they hold AKK's capital or it's about time for the first post-annexation AKK event to trigger which turns them into AKK.

Why don't we just let QAR form Persia if they annex AKK and survive ahistorically beyond their time?

 

[LlywelynII]

Well, let me know...

Why don't we just let QAR form Persia if they annex AKK and survive ahistorically beyond their time?

I was thinking of just cutting and pasting the PER revolt events and editing the dates, but if it's realistic that QAR would've fallen to a Sh'ia coup without an army forcing it, too, maybe I can script that...

In the meantime, though (PLUG)

I just wanted to let y'all know about a side project I'm working on between scripting BYZ events: fixing those so-called "strategy guides" that show up when you start a new GC.

Right now, for eu2 and AGCEEP, all those files do is repeat the "history brief" next to it. So my thought - since no one cares about every tag & many hands make fast work - is that we could start a new thread here and write little two and four paragraph guides on a) how to survive and b) what to do with yourself once you're thriving.

It might not make that much difference to anybody here, but I think it would really help out the new kids, especially for harder starts like Candar. So, yknow, pick a tag that you love (AKK, QAR, IRA) or one of the majors you think you've got a handle on and pitch in!

Salam!
jay.

 

[Garbon]

Soon darlings, I promise, soon. School just out and as soon as I get all my things up in my new apartment (including my external harddrive) I'll post what I currently have for discussion (all of it! )

 

[LlywelynII]

Soon darlings, I promise, soon. School just out and as soon as I get all my things up in my new apartment (including my external harddrive) I'll post what I currently have for discussion (all of it! )

You know he's just got a bunch of stuff written on a legal pad and he'll be up all night with carpal tunnel syndrome before he posts anything.

C'moooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooon...

I wanna get my BYZ game going again!
jay.