I’m interested to see how and when Austria makes its first intervention. Vienna’s going to be more than a little wary watching all of this.
Well...a victory and expansion of power for the first time in a long while, but despite papal peloponnesia being very defensible, I wonder on the wisdom or use of such a possession. What exactly does the pope and papal states gain from this, aside from precedent to commit war again?
Austria remains terrifyingly large in Northern Italy and you're going to need some solid, overwhelming alliances to get them out. But if the minor Italian states can be gained, and the two major ones allied and subverted, slowly if needs be, there remains hope. France has to be kept as an ally however, and honestly the pope would do well to get the british and russians on side as well if possible. But france is key, for without her, austria or sicily can roll up the papacy by themselves.
Sounds like matters became suddenly quite urgent. Britain and Russia linking up must have been a nasty shock.
It really shouldn't have been. The Czars had pretensions to be the Defender of the Orthodoxy (Russian not Greek, but the point stands) while much of the British upper classes had a distinct Hellenophile tendency. If anything the shock is them giving up so early without pushing the Pope back out of Greece, but one cannot expect too much of the Vicki AI (well you can, but you will always be disappointed. ).
"I understand that decisive victories are needed if the bloodshed is to end." - You can see why Cardinal Aloisi is a favourite of the Pope, he lacks the insight to work out that the best way for the bloodshed to end would be the Papal States not going on unprovoked wars of aggressive conquest.
Yeah, I was wondering when the russians would show up, it was only a matter of time (which is why earlier I asked if the papacy was trying to claim the mandate of orthodox protection in the ottomans rather than them). As for the british, they do love their Greek, enough for various heirs to go fight and die for their independence...though not enough to really do anything officially. Indeed, officially, the british were hardly nice to Greece all the way through the 19th century and all through ww1 too. But the british are generally unpleasent to smaller Mediterranean nations so this was not really out of character.
A successful conquest of a nice halfway point between Rome and the Holy Land, could be useful if a future, far more powerful Papacy decides to liberate Christ's home from the Ottomans (with the aid of a mighty bloc of allies of course)...
I feel like they'd have to at least annex Italy first. They need to be at least a decent secondary power for everyone to bother helping them beyond stopping austria or sicily from eating them. They need to build a fleet that can patrol half the med if they want the holy land. They need an army two or three times the size as well...and all the allies on top.
It just seems like a pointless grab compared to the main goal of italy, in universe. In game, it makes sense.
Reassuring to see the Vicky engine sort of knows what it’s doing and eventually sent the British and the Russians after you. France and Rome beating up on Greece together for little appreciable reason would no doubt cause one hell of a stir around the conference tables. Is Louis Napoleon in yet? I forget but it would make sense. Wonder whether this will all lead to a slightly accelerated Crimea in a few years, or something like it. Going after those Holy Land privileges will probably seem like a nice little prize now that the gloves are off…
Out of interest, are the Whigs in in Britain? Palmerston’s not going to like this at all.
crimea is going to be different if the pope is in the mix and russia and britian just fought a war together against France's allies interfering in the balkans...and lost.
I’m interested to see how and when Austria makes its first intervention. Vienna’s going to be more than a little wary watching all of this.
Yeah, I would love to see what various goverments reaction to the papal states are. Britian would be bemused and a little angry, probably take the oppuritny to kick the Irish or something. France must be delighted to not have to waste an army defending Rome anymore and also the idea of chaos and confusion in Italy and potebtially austria. Austria meanwhile must be annoyed, both because Catholicism is a complex issue for them and because italy is also. Both then showing up in the balkans would presumably be the last straw...
Well this really has the potential for a real conflagration. It is terrifying, actually, as every Great Power has a stake - Austria and France are obvious, Russia must have a view of a Papal seizure of a fellow Orthodox region (and close to the Black Sea), Britain will be furious and the Ottomans, dear God the Ottomans...
Urban went with that name for his Greek Adventure? Dredging up the history of any crusade is risky, but to pick the Fourth was a.. courageous... choice.The coup de grace to my hopes came when Urban declared his renewed Fourth Crusade. I still cannot fathom why he would waste the Papacy's limited resources on a foreign adventure to subjugate a people that do not want us, but that is the case.
Urban went with that name for his Greek Adventure? Dredging up the history of any crusade
The change from his enthusiasm at the start of these entries to the disillusionment at the end is very stark indeed.
The first entry reminded me of an anecdote I’ve mentioned before on here, but which seems appropriate in this instance, where a 19th century Cambridge college master declared that the coming of the railways to the city would “displease God”. Evidently our esteemed cardinal has no such scruples.
Having the Greek adventure bring all of this work to ruin feels telling of the fact that there will be more than a few voices in Rome who regret the Holy Father’s newfound taste for foreign conquest.
It sounds like they are biting off a lot more theh can chew and sinking a lot of costs into Greece that they will never get back...
A very disapointing setback for industry in Italy but I have no doubts it will all be worth it once the Medeterranian becomes a Papal lake!
Urban went with that name for his Greek Adventure? Dredging up the history of any crusade is risky, but to pick the Fourth was a.. courageous... choice.
Cappellini does indeed come across as a broken man by the end, but then he had picked an awkward mission; Industrialisation and reactionary-Catholicism are uneasy bedfellows at the best of times. And these are very much not the best of times.
Well...it certainly did destroy greece, so at least it fits descriptivley.
That is a very mysterious reply @slothinator