Annexing fleets

[Dead William]

Sorry if this has bene posted before, I couldn't find it with search.

I was wondering why exactly it is impossible to get hold of the battlefleet of the British Empire.

I am playing Germany. I have defeated France (Creating Vichy) France again, ( I didn't annex, foolish of me) Australia, which left it's fleet to Brittain, New Zealand, idem. Then I totally annexed Brittain. The Canadians were the last remaining members of the Alies, they got the British fleet. Then I conquered Canada and the Fleet went to the unallied French. I declared war upon France and annexed and they gave it to the bloody USA! I think it should be possible to get hold of at least a few ships by annexing, (many would be scuttled) even if no army units are inherited, but it definitely should not go to an unallied, neutral nation!

Opinoins? Thanks, DW

 

[Enravota]

I tottaly agree, though i think you should reman them when you get them. ships in port should go to the victor, when annexed.

 

[unmerged(14249)]

About the only country to surrender its navy in the way you imagine is Italy (of course). The idea that the RN would ever meekly hand its ships over to the Nazis is ludicrous.

What's weird is that people seem to suppose that ships are natural booty when there's little evidence of this ever happening. Germany was able to loot lots of tanks, planes and manpower from its conquests in places like CZ, France and SU but players don't ever whine that they can't capture land and air units. Odd.

Andrew

 

[Enravota]

well vessels in in ports during annexation should be captured or disbanded (like planes).

i think the big rant is about the point that in the end some country gets a turbo uber fleet for free, and while allied fleets should be transfered to alied countries after annex, i do not find it plausible they'll simply join a random neutral country.

i think fleets are the most static part of the game - you either have it from the begining or you don't. the posibility to become a naval power from mediocre or weak marine nation is very low cause of the long time of construction and the lack of upgrading.

 

[unmerged(11633)]

I've captured a couple of ships when overunning ports in HOI2- not many, but there is a very small chance of capturing ships when overrunning a port province in game already.

Anyway, how are the french unallied? Surely they are part of the allies at the beginning of the scenario?

 

[Dead William]

the french became unallied after I allowed the creation of Vichy and then conquered France, without annexing it. I thought it would be better for my BB, but little luck there... They were no longer in the alliance at the time of the death of th English empire.

I don't mind NOT getting the ships and planes and armies (Which you should if you believe the tooltip blurb over annex nation) but I dislike the fleets going wholesale to some sitback third party like the US.

DW

 

[binTravkin]

I dislike the fleets going wholesale to some sitback third party like the US.

You might not like it, but yet it would be the first place to sail to for british navy in case there's no British Empire anymore.
Even if the fleet would be somewhere in North Atlantic and all what's left from GB would be India and other Indian Ocean posessions, they won't likely sail there, they'd sail to Canada and after that to US, not French.

Nationality and politics still means much after all (not that british are the same as americans but still they're closer than french or evenmore, germans).

I would expect that there could be a scenario when a desperate british captain sails to some little island in Oceania, evacuates the ship and sinks it in case Germany had conquered all the world.
Just to not let those Nazis get it.

 

[Dead William]

You might not like it, but yet it would be the first place to sail to for british navy in case there's no British Empire anymore.
Even if the fleet would be somewhere in North Atlantic and all what's left from GB would be India and other Indian Ocean posessions, they won't likely sail there, they'd sail to Canada and after that to US, not French.

Nationality and politics still means much after all (not that british are the same as americans but still they're closer than french or evenmore, germans).

I would expect that there could be a scenario when a desperate british captain sails to some little island in Oceania, evacuates the ship and sinks it in case Germany had conquered all the world.
Just to not let those Nazis get it.

I made a fairly big goof there, forgetting the not. Eheh. Well, yes, I think scuttling the ship is totally realistic. Sailing the ship into a US harbour and claiming asylum there and handing the ship over should at least give me the ability to declare war without gaining BB. Annoyin' Yanks!

 

[binTravkin]

One ship probably no, but in case >50% of the GB RN went there I think it should give you a 'Casus Belli'.
Those hundreds of ships would be worth a huge chunk even if recycled!

 

[unmerged(15088)]

Wasn't the Vichy Med. fleet sunk by the British to prevent their use by the Axis? The rest of the fleet sailed to Britain just like they would do in the game. One thing I do hate is that a ship can switch nations and appear in a port well beyond their range.

Here's a suggestion, I'm not sure if it can be done in scripts.

Ships caught in port:
Captured - (MP required to crew ship. Org = 0)
Surrendered - crew remains on ship. attacker replaces officers. (Org = 0)
Scuttled in port - (Slight increase in scrap METAL)
Makes a run for it - take a "Ship at Sea" options.

Ships not in port:
Return to port and Surrender.
Offer services to nation in alliance within ship's range.
Offer services to neutral nation within ship's range.
Scuttle at sea.
Go down in a blaze of glory.

Factors effecting decision:
Moral
Countries disposition toward attacker. (Convincing an Vichy captain to surrender to the U.S. is a lot easier than convincing a Brit. to fly the Iron Cross)
Time to capture port (does the crew really have time to get the ship out?)
Attacking Commando would have better chance of capture or surrender.

Logical order of choices before considering factors should be:
Alliance
Neutral
Scuttle
Run/Fight
Capture
Surrender

Also, how about getting a portion of the supplies when an army is overrun?