Am I missing something or is this game just broken?

[Gemberkoekje]

Not sure if it has been mentioned before, but all Paradox titles are titles where failure is built into the game, and can be fun in it's own right if you adopt the right mindset.

In this case, you were too aggressive, and you were penalized as a result. You should learn from this, and try again, with more mechanics in mind. You will feel 'defeated' another number of times (Even wars which don't actually end up in you technically losing the game but still end you up losing land can cause that) and the only right mindset is to see what went wrong, and try again.

it's quite possible that you can't keep it up. That's no problem either, but I'd advise you also not to play EVE or the X series then

 

[Jake Dust]

The Inca Empire was the same size as the Western Roman Empire. Yes, really.

Europe is incredibly small IRL, especially when compared with either South or North America. Brazil is by itself bigger than the Roman Empire at its greatest extent, during Trajan's reign.

 

[Sebuk]

I had that event happen to me under similar premises! It was my second Game as Ottomans and I decided to go on a murderous rampage to see just how much land I could get my hands on. I think I was sitting at 130% overextension after having fought off a muslim alliance and consequently claimed parts of the levant. I believe was in better shape ecomomically though, and had some ADM to spare to bring stability (partially) back up. Even so the event was quite scary, even turkish muslim provinces rebell so I was effectively crippled for the duration of the peasant war. It did end with a nice event boosting stability and giving me some other stats temporarily.

I just finished reading A Distant Mirror by Barbara Tuchman, about Europe (mostly France) in the 14th Century. The entire century seems to have been a never-ending series of -6 events. It happens in life too.

That's a great book

 

[Kyoumen]

But there IS something for the Ottoman takeover of Egypt. You get claims on all the territory and can swiftly conquer it in 2 or so wars. It is not perfect, but it is still pretty great for the Ottomans.

There is something for Burgundy's fate too - it has more trouble getting heirs. But instead of leaving it to game mechanics, it has a special unique mechanic that divides it between France and Austria. Why wasn't their trouble getting heirs good enough? Why'd they need a special mechanic to simulate a weird one-off historical event that isn't possible under normal game rules?

Besides, if OP's experience is correct, it will take at least 3 wars to annex the Mamluks, and in reality, of course, other countries will pounce on them after you smash them long before the truce period is up (unless you want to break truce and suffer all the fun consequences for that, of course), meaning realistically you'll probably only get the levant and maybe bits of Egypt proper.

It would not be hard to fix this. An annexation with instant cores for Ottomans (not counting provinces occupied by anyone else fighting the Mamluks) fighting a AI-led Mamluks, when Ottomans have that mission, and are using the CB granted by that mission, and have achieved 100% war score. It will not happen every game; it won't happen if the Ottomans can't beat the Mamluks, or if they never border the Mamluks, or if they get in enough trouble that they have to settle for less than 100% war score. Put a time limit on it too, if you like, maybe it can only happen before 1550. I imagine the AI will still fail at it a lot of the time if not heavily pushed. But at least it will be possible, and there is no excuse whatsoever for it not to be possible when things like the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth and the partition of Burgundy are given special mechanics to make them possible to happen.

 

[Kyoumen]

Europe is incredibly small IRL, especially when compared with either South or North America. Brazil is by itself bigger than the Roman Empire at its greatest extent, during Trajan's reign.

Well, yeah, but they're still legitimately big by empire standards, and certainly bigger than the game makes them out to be.

 

[Alley]

The Inca Empire was the same size as the Western Roman Empire. Yes, really.

'The Inca empire was bigger actually' don't think the difference is that important but still.

 

[huskerfrk1]

due to this massive conquest, the Ottoman's killed their future because they never really modernized. they reached their peak at the point you're talking about with Suleiman and after he died the empire never really recovered from the loss of his leadership. While the game may have just accelerated the demise of the empire... the Ottoman Empire began die the same slow death the Hapsburg Empire died at that point you are referring to. Too many various cultures, too much corruption, too little leadership... it killed the Ottoman Turks, literally.

This game also doesn't take into account many real life things that happened... in this game if you take over a Christian province as a Muslim, you'll get rebellions, when in reality this didn't happen because of the high levels of tolerance that the Ottoman Empire showed during that time period. It also helped in tax collection and administration as well. They really missed the boat on being able to set your tolerance levels in the Empire, it was a major success trait of the Mongols, Ottomans, and several other Empire builders.

Considering this happened historically in less time then I even did it (I think it took like 3 years to occupy all tiles, while in reality it was 2 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman–Mamluk_War_(1516–1517) ) and only about 15 years after I did it, and it also was a damn mission I figured it would be a good idea.
But I guess the game is just more difficult then reality then? As I'm pretty sure the Ottomans didn't emediatly give their lands back because the people where rebelling so hard (if they did so at all).

 

[Kyoumen]

due to this massive conquest, the Ottoman's killed their future because they never really modernized. they reached their peak at the point you're talking about with Suleiman and after he died the empire never really recovered from the loss of his leadership. While the game may have just accelerated the demise of the empire... the Ottoman Empire began die the same slow death the Hapsburg Empire died at that point you are referring to. Too many various cultures, too much corruption, too little leadership... it killed the Ottoman Turks, literally.

That's a hell of a slow death, considering they kept expanding for two hundred more years, which is all together rather more than half of the entire time period of the game (a time period they ended while still having a massive empire).

 

[Thanik]

This game also doesn't take into account many real life things that happened... in this game if you take over a Christian province as a Muslim, you'll get rebellions, when in reality this didn't happen because of the high levels of tolerance that the Ottoman Empire showed during that time period. It also helped in tax collection and administration as well. They really missed the boat on being able to set your tolerance levels in the Empire, it was a major success trait of the Mongols, Ottomans, and several other Empire builders.

Ottoman deas + other ideas + buldings + advisors + decisions + stability can help achieving "historical result"

If you pick good ones you can become tollerant empire...

 

[Gustav91]

Awesome peasant wars! I now hope for more and better pretenders that can kick my ass.
Wars for keep a balance of power! Everyone together against the biggest ass!

 

[Searry]

I liked playing the Ottomans, though it was a bit too easy. So here's the things I did:
As a #1 rule, take care of WE, OE ASAP.
The Ottoman economy is so strong, the first thing you should do is replace most of your infantry with mercenary infantry to have a large manpower reserve incase something catastrophic happens.
Next, don't spend your dip points on anything and just go for the grand navy ASAP, you'll also get the Ghazi this way.
Also, I always went for less piety for the obvious bonuses it provides.
Get DoF so you can get the extra missionary and start converting unaccepted culture provinces(bulgarians, serbs and such slavs).
Take Ragusa for the trade power in there.
Put all admin points in stab so you don't have to harsh treatment everywhere.(Except if someone obviously is supporting rebels[>+5%RR].)
Vassalize Tripoli ASAP, it's a bit easy.(If they have less than 4 provinces.)
Guarantee the emir next to the Adana province, ally, just be a good friend and exert your influence there.
Then I declared war on Ramazan, I guess it was, It was easy to beat the Mamluks and the petty emir there, so the victory was quick.
After the truce I took Alexandria and Libya, and a bit of Syria. And the cycle continued.

In the end, I pretty much dominated the trade in Alexandria and Constantinople, with a rushed grand navy, you can quickly dominate the Med.

I'd say the game is way too easy in it's current form for big empires with a huge economy like the Ottos. They should get constant stab hits if you mismanage something.

 

[Bonkster]

OP sounds as if he wanted to play total war and accidentally clicked on the eu 4 demo

 

[unmerged(10773)]

About The Ottomans and the Mamlukes,

the conquer egypt mission gives the Ottomans claims on all
Mamelukes provinces.
And claims also decrease coring cost.

It is probably the single most powerfull mission in the game.

No you can't take all of the Mamelukes in one go but you can core all their
land very cheaply.

+ottomans get 33% less coring cost.
++combined with the diplomatic idea even cheaper.

 

[Bad_Haggis]

You could make it so that the Mumluks control only Egypt, with the rest of the areas being Vassals. That could make it easier to annex, like in real life (even if it's not really accurate).

 

[grechzoo]

OP sounds as if he wanted to play total war and accidentally clicked on the eu 4 demo

I love this forum, everyone is so polite, even when an angry and ignorant poster comes and shouts down the game with pathetic arguments that only illustrate his impatience.

But still you guys rationalize all his misguided complaints and try to help. Better than I could be, I just dont like rude people, and dont respond to them. It's kind of a principle I have set in stone at this point in my life. It's nice to know I can come here and see less cynical folks help no matter what though.

 

[JustinianI.]

Yeah OP, you would have saved yourself a lot of trouble if you had just waited a day before posting this and not posting it out of frustration. Aside from the original post, you seem like quite a polite and smart person, but I have to admit that I wasn't really sympathetic to your anger, however justified it might be, until like page 4. The original post just seemed very rude, and calling something that many people here like very much "retarded" or "stupid" will make people lose patience. But well, I kinda understand where you are coming from, since you did basically get the "one in a million chance of complete game destruction", and I hope it doesn't happen to you again. Just wait next time before you post about it, please.

 

[Jorleif]

# Peasants' War
country_event = {
id = peasants_war.1
title = "EVTNAME3021"
desc = "EVTDESC3021"
picture = ANGRY_MOB_eventPicture

major = yes

trigger = {
num_of_cities = 5
NOT = { has_country_flag = religious_turmoil }
NOT = { has_country_flag = peasant_war }
NOT = { has_country_flag = internal_conflicts }
NOT = { has_country_flag = FRA_french_revolution }
NOT = { has_country_flag = revolution }
NOT = { has_country_flag = liberalism }
NOT = { has_country_flag = civil_war }
NOT = { has_country_flag = total_war_series }
government = monarchy
NOT = { manpower_percentage = 0.25 }
NOT = { is_year = 1600 }
is_at_war = no
OR = {
war_exhaustion = 10
overextension_percentage = 0.25
NOT = { legitimacy = 75 }
num_of_loans = 10
}
}

mean_time_to_happen = {
months = 640

modifier = {
factor = 0.85
NOT = { has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 0 } }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.75
NOT = { has_opinion = { who = PAP value = -100 } }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.15
has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 0 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.25
has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 100 }
}

modifier = {
factor = 0.9
NOT = { stability = 0 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.9
NOT = { stability = -1 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 0.9
NOT = { stability = -2 }
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.1
stability = 1
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.1
stability = 2
}
modifier = {
factor = 1.1
stability = 3
}
}

immediate = {
set_country_flag = peasant_war
}

option = {
name = "EVTOPTA3021" # Dire times are ahead of us
add_stability = -6
add_prestige = -10

 

[SchwarzKatze]

# Peasants' War
country_event = {
	id = peasants_war.1
	title = "EVTNAME3021"
	desc = "EVTDESC3021"
	picture = ANGRY_MOB_eventPicture
	
	major = yes

	trigger = {
		num_of_cities = 5
		NOT = { has_country_flag = religious_turmoil } 
		NOT = { has_country_flag = peasant_war }
		NOT = { has_country_flag = internal_conflicts }
		NOT = { has_country_flag = FRA_french_revolution }
		NOT = { has_country_flag = revolution }
		NOT = { has_country_flag = liberalism }
		NOT = { has_country_flag = civil_war } 
		NOT = { has_country_flag = total_war_series } 
		government = monarchy
		NOT = { manpower_percentage = 0.25 }
		NOT = { is_year = 1600 }
		is_at_war = no
		OR = {
			war_exhaustion = 10
			overextension_percentage = 0.25
			NOT = { legitimacy = 75 }
			num_of_loans = 10
		}
	}

	mean_time_to_happen = {
		months = 640
	
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.85
			NOT = { has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 0 } }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.75
			NOT = { has_opinion = { who = PAP value = -100 } }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.15
			has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 0 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.25
			has_opinion = { who = PAP value = 100 }
		}

		modifier = {
			factor = 0.9
			NOT = { stability = 0 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.9
			NOT = { stability = -1 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 0.9
			NOT = { stability = -2 }
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.1
			stability = 1
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.1
			stability = 2
		}
		modifier = {
			factor = 1.1
			stability = 3
		}		
	}

	immediate = {
		set_country_flag = peasant_war
	}
	
	option = {
		name = "EVTOPTA3021"			# Dire times are ahead of us
		add_stability = -6
		add_prestige = -10

Errm... Already posted in the second page, and please use the code wrapper like what I did here.:blush:

 

[unmerged(738483)]

This is to the original post...

I stopped being an engaged reader after you said that the stability factors are idiotic. I scanned over the rest.

1) Stability is kind of an important thing. i.e. What is the Egyptian government doing right now in 2013 without stability? Nothing because it has -3 right now.
2) I played a game as Ottomans and it was relatively easy. So it is quite apparent that you are not a capable leader. Become one and don't cry when you lose. Good leaders get positive results from bad situations.
3) Learn the game mechanics and buy in to them. It makes the game easier and more fun for you. Maybe you will win one.

 

[brifbates]

Errm... Already posted in the second page, and please use the code wrapper like what I did here.:blush:

To be really nice you can stick it in a spoiler box too.

As for the ongoing discussion, if I'm not mistaken Johan (I think, one of the Paradox posters) mentioned in a thread somewhere (near a pic of that part of the world) that there were DHE involving the OE/Mamelukes interactions. It's entirely possible they are affected by the later start date of the demo invalidating part of the chain or somesuch.