Am I misremembering things or was defensive nerfed in an early patch?

[Hakairyu]

I remember that at some point, defensive gave you a whopping 50% morale bonus. Now, I cannot confirm this due to not having access to the past versions; but does anyone know if it always was 25% or was it nerfed?

This might be why I lately feel like I overrate defensive a little, 50% morale bonus alone was worth the 2800 MIL. I mean, it still has solid ideas but it's not the "out of the other MIL ideas' league" idea group it would be with the 50% bonus. It still is always my first MIL idea, no matter who I am save for Poland(aristocracy in which case). In fact, can anyone tell me if that's a wise choice or if something else would be better as the first MIL idea?

 

[Red John]

I believe it was always 25%.

Defensive is an alright group, but imo, it's overrated.

Offensive is arguably one of the best, if not the best mil group. It cannot be stated how useful Force March is.

Defenisve is good due to it's really early +25% Morale bonus, which gives you an edge over the offensive group for the first few ideas.

 

[SuperSFX]

I'd argue that the army tradition is what makes defensive arguably the best military idea. 25% moral is nice, but being able to sit at 75-100 army tradition constantly and pump out 6/6/6/3 generals is hard to beat.

 

[brifbates]

The early nerf to defensive had to do with how the attrition bonus worked. Originally it allowed you to have double the normal supply limit for the province with no attrition resulting in silliness like being able to drop in excess of 200k troops in a province with no attrition.

 

[aitaituo]

Also, like all morale bonuses, it used to give you a flat morale increase instead of a percentage.

 

[Novacat]

I'd argue that the army tradition is what makes defensive arguably the best military idea. 25% moral is nice, but being able to sit at 75-100 army tradition constantly and pump out 6/6/6/3 generals is hard to beat.

If im not mistaken, in the absence of any NIs, you will only remain steady at 50% Army tradition with Innovative, Defensive, and a War College. Still a fair amount, but certainly not uber. Muscovy will sit on 66% army tradition, Daimyos can get up to 83% steady army tradition, and Prussia can get 100% mainly because of that -1% army tradition decay bonus which can reduce tradition decay from -3% to -2%.

 

[hwoosh]

If im not mistaken, in the absence of any NIs, you will only remain steady at 50% Army tradition with Innovative, Defensive, and a War College. Still a fair amount, but certainly not uber. Muscovy will sit on 66% army tradition, Daimyos can get up to 83% steady army tradition, and Prussia can get 100% mainly because of that -1% army tradition decay bonus which can reduce tradition decay from -3% to -2%.

And as Muscovy, I'm constantly at 85–100 army tradition after about 1475 without any bonuses whatsoever, simply by virtue of being always at war. Army tradition bonuses are of limited use if you've perfected your wargame.

 

[Novacat]

And as Muscovy, I'm constantly at 85–100 army tradition after about 1475 without any bonuses whatsoever, simply by virtue of being always at war. Army tradition bonuses are of limited use if you've perfected your wargame.

Well, yeah, being constantly at war does help, I was referring to 'break even' point where you dont gain or lose tradition.

 

[Korashy]

Forced March is simply incredible. Not only does it increase your chances of stackwiping over all, even if you dont to wipe them you will have the terrain bonus, it also allows you to lure and reinforce with a lot less casualties.

 

[Gunburned]

Prety shure Defensive had the +50 Morale you were talking about pre 1.2. Long since nerfed

 

[fleetothemoon]

I faintly recall that it was +0.50 morale from defensive in early patches. It later got changed to +25% morale so that for better or worse, it actually scales. Still a pretty decent tree I think.