Allying a Competing Great Power

[ComaPrison]

Hey all. I'm trying to ally France as Ming, in order to keep Spain off my back. My relations with them are high enough to get a green check mark next to the ally option, but they haven't used their diplomat on me to improve relations so my people's view of them is too low to propose an alliance. Is there any way around this? Or perhaps a way to incentivize them to send a diplomat to improve relations with me?

 

[Xara]

What on earth is Ming going to do to help you against Spain? Launch fireworks after you fend them off yourself?

 

[Slym]

He's Ming, he wants to ally France.

which makes a lot more sense than the other way around.

 

[Xara]

He's Ming, he wants to ally France.

which makes a lot more sense than the other way around.

What I get for a lack of coffee

 

[ComaPrison]

My military and admin tech levels are ABOVE Spain and France right now just FYI (in Ironman game). If it makes any difference. I also own all of Siberia (right up to the Euro/Asia regional geographic border by what used to be Perm, almost all of Southeast Asia, half of South Asia, and vassalized half of Central Asia, half of Japan, etc. etc. And my overall score is rank 3 right now. (monthly Adm rank 1, Dip rank 1, Mil rank 3)

So this isn't exactly a case of a reach in terms of alliance attempts. Alliance possibility positive 62, negative 54. So the only reason I can't even propose it is because my own PEOPLE are the ones who have a poor view of France. Now, anyone know how to fix this?

 

[Xeorm]

I think you can ask for military access. That should give some relations boost.

 

[Xara]

My military and admin tech levels are ABOVE Spain and France right now just FYI. If it makes any difference. I also own all of Siberia, Southeast Asia, half of South Asia, and vassalized half of Central Asia/Japan.

What do you need France for, then? It's not like Spain is going to ship their whole army over. They tend to be easier to beat when they're all colonial, since their armies end up scattered everywhere. I'm assuming this means you are westernized.

 

[TheBloke]

Hey all. I'm trying to ally France as Ming, in order to keep Spain off my back. My relations with them are high enough to get a green check mark next to the ally option, but they haven't used their diplomat on me to improve relations so my people's view of them is too low to propose an alliance. Is there any way around this? Or perhaps a way to incentivize them to send a diplomat to improve relations with me?

What's your opinion of them? -35?

You can increase this by 45 fairly easily:

Get Military Access, +10
Rival their Rival (Enemy of Enemy), +20 (takes 20 months to build up to that)
Give them War Subsidies, +15 (only while they're at war, obviously. You can give any amount, including 0.00, to get the full 15.)

So rival one of their rivals ASAP. Then keep an eye on wars, and as soon as they're at war, give war subsidies for 60 months. Then take the MA if you're still short.

 

[ComaPrison]

My opinion of them is -5. Their opinion of me is 100-something. I've already got military access and rivalled their rival. I'm just waiting on war subsidies, since they're not at war. Edit: I thought war subsidies improved THEIR opinion of me? I need to improve MY people's opinion of FRANCE.

What's your opinion of them? -35?

You can increase this by 45 fairly easily:

Get Military Access, +10
Rival their Rival (Enemy of Enemy), +20 (takes 20 months to build up to that)
Give them War Subsidies, +15 (only while they're at war, obviously. You can give any amount, including 0.00, to get the full 15.)

So rival one of their rivals ASAP. Then keep an eye on wars, and as soon as they're at war, give war subsidies for 60 months. Then take the MA if you're still short.

 

[ComaPrison]

What do you need France for, then? It's not like Spain is going to ship their whole army over. They tend to be easier to beat when they're all colonial, since their armies end up scattered everywhere. I'm assuming this means you are westernized.

Because Spain declared war on me previously and shipped a stack of troops all the way to Southeast Asia by ship. I only managed to get out of the war by paying them big $$$. Also, my tech level wasn't enough to help my army beat them, since I'm still using un-westernized troops.

 

[calvinhobbeslik]

Because Spain declared war on me previously and shipped a stack of troops all the way to Southeast Asia by ship. I only managed to get out of the war by paying them big $$$. Also, my tech level wasn't enough to help my army beat them, since I'm still using un-westernized troops.

Wait, if you have a higher MIL tech, how are you not westernized?

 

[Gundi]

One of the few advantages of Ming's faction system is it's possible to get tech reduction bonuses good enough to theoretically keep up with European countries.

 

[ComaPrison]

Wait, if you have a higher MIL tech, how are you not westernized?

Never found a good time for it. Was waiting for +3 stab with +1 stab event also on standby, plus -10% stab cost advisor, plus young ruler with high ADM, plus no war going. Considering how often I'm warring, it's hard to find a spare 10-20 years to pursue Westernization. I have no trouble keeping up with being in the lead/tied for lead with 2 out of 3 (ADM/DIP/MIL). Killing off my first heir almost always gets me one with at least 8 stat points, vs 3 stat points for starting heir. I've gotten some pretty awesome ~13 stat rulers/heirs that way. Once I've got the heir to age 15, I kill off the starting 1/1/1 ruler. This pretty much gives me a huge leg up. Heck, even my regency councils are much better than starting ruler/heir. I've gotten a bunch of really awesome 5/3/4 or 4/2/3 etc. regency councils. 9-12 stat points. Not bad. On top of that, I always have +3 stat advisors when they pop up. If I don't see them, I switch to bureaucracy faction for +1 # of advisors in pool to re-roll for better advisor. When it comes to the events that offer 50 MP for 0.5 inflation, I always say yes.

 

[ComaPrison]

Still require recommendations about how to get my people's opinion of France from -5 to 0 or better. Already taking advantage of enemy of enemy and France giving me military access.

Edit: Nevermind! Figured it out. Proclaimed guaranteed and accepted their attempts at dragging me into war. Boosted my people's view of them (ironically) by more than enough to propose alliance. Awesomesauce.

 

[ComaPrison]

Die Spain Die! Notice Date on the list (one of my vassals). Ming is further down. Global rank 3 biatch (monthly rank 1 adm, rank 1 dip, rank 3 mil) STILL haven't westernized. Definitely need to do it when I hit tech 23 mil at the latest (for better units thereafter)

http://i.imgur.com/Z91MLZz.jpg

and diplomatic map http://i.imgur.com/CMgTvau.jpg

 

[unmerged(465279)]

How annoying for the tag to pop up over there...

 

[ComaPrison]

How annoying for the tag to pop up over there...

I don't quite understand what you mean.

 

[unmerged(184583)]

I don't quite understand what you mean.

The gigantic Ming font up in manchu... its silly that its not in your heartland.

 

[ComaPrison]

The gigantic Ming font up in manchu... its silly that its not in your heartland.

Oh that's nothing. I've seen much worse. I once had "Mi" in the mainland and an UPSIDE-DOWN "NG" in Siberia.

 

[unmerged(465279)]

Oh that's nothing. I've seen much worse. I once had "Mi" in the mainland and an UPSIDE-DOWN "NG" in Siberia.

lol I can stand ugly borders but misplaced tags drive me nuts!