Allies Not Granting Provinces In War Without Cossacks?

[FiveOD]

I have not purchased the Cossacks expansion yet. It looks neat but frankly seems a bit pricey for what it offers. Since its release, I can't recall a single province being granted to me in peace in a war where I am called in by my allies no matter what my contributions are. In the past, you could pretty reliably count on being given a province or two that you have a claim on if you have occupied them and have good relations with your ally. No more, it seems. I can single handedly win an ally's war myself and fully occupy the entire enemy nation and be given nothing. Without being able to identify important provinces in the DLC, the AI just seemingly refuses to grant provinces in peace. Now there is very little incentive to actually contribute to most ally wars, and being given a truce timer on your claims for nothing is weak.

This is probably an oversight and not intentional (I hope) but it's pretty frustrating to suddenly have base game features disabled until I spend $22 to unlock them in a game I have spent tons of money on already. I hope it gets fixed soon.

 

[chapstix]

Also not having purchased Cossacks I can mention the only time a province was handed to me by an a.i. ally. They gave me a core back.

 

[LS22]

Same here. I don't have a single peace agreement where my allies give me provinces although i occupy claimed/core provinces. I also don't have the DLC.

 

[Edmon]

The expansions have always removed stuff from the free edition.

Art of war removed vassal feeding without prestige hits and tons of constraints, unless you have the DLC.

Common sense removed building for most of the RotW provinces, plus vassals became a liability because you can't manage liberty desire (but are still stuck with it), unless you have the DLC.

Cossacks has made diplomacy a nightmare without it, you have no favours nor can make any promises and the negative "go to war" modifiers are balanced around you being able to offset them with favours or promises, which you can't.

It's a subscription game, you need the expansions to keep using all the features properly, even pre-existing ones that worked before.

Unless you roll back to a previous version, which they have very nicely allowed you to do.

 

[LS22]

What did CoP removed from the base game?
What did Res Publica removed from the base game?
What did WoN removed from the base game?

Where is written that EU4 is a subscription game?

The principle of a DLC, is that gives you more than what is in the base game. It's not that it removes features if you don't buy it.

 

[Edmon]

What did CoP removed from the base game?
What did Res Publica removed from the base game?
What did WoN removed from the base game?

Where is written that EU4 is a subscription game?

The principle of a DLC, is that gives you more than what is in the base game. It's not that it removes features if you don't buy it.

Not sure about CoP because my first version of the game had it.

WoN killed a lot of distance based Cassis belli (loan, call to arms, etc) which were replaced by fabricate trade conflict... which you couldn't do without the DLC.

Not sure Res Publica is particularly required for anything important as I wasn't a republic player, but it was the expansion that killed off the 5 year truce so I hated it all the same. Until I discovered the guarantee trick that everyone has been using to this day to enjoy the war aspect of the game, which is the bit everyone mostly likes.

Paradox are very clever in that it is the "balance changes" that kill off the old ways to do things, meaning you need the DLC more and more as the game goes on, as it's balanced around you having all the available actions (like subject interactions for reducing liberty desire.)

 

[Xara]

WoN killed a lot of distance based Cassis belli (loan, call to arms, etc) which were replaced by fabricate trade conflict... which you couldn't do without the DLC.

Nonsense. Loan payback failures and failures to respond to Call to Arms were removed because they were exploited by players to get easy casus bellis. Trade conflict was not added to 'replace' them.

 

[Edmon]

Nonsense. Loan payback failures and failures to respond to Call to Arms were removed because they were exploited by players to get easy casus bellis. Trade conflict was not added to 'replace' them.

And this is why Paradox is so clever.

The fact remains that all the tools to get an easy distance belli were removed from the game for base players, but if you have the all important DLC, the trade conflict one remains there for you to use.

The "balanced" new belli is behind the DLC, the unbalanced ones that weren't were simply removed.

These are just things off the top of my head anyway, there are plenty more examples I'm sure, just need time to think about them. Their strategy is subtle and clever and I can't help but admire it.

 

[LS22]

Not sure about CoP because my first version of the game had it.

WoN killed a lot of distance based Cassis belli (loan, call to arms, etc) which were replaced by fabricate trade conflict... which you couldn't do without the DLC.

Not sure Res Publica is particularly required for anything important as I wasn't a republic player, but it was the expansion that killed off the 5 year truce so I hated it all the same. Until I discovered the guarantee trick that everyone has been using to this day to enjoy the war aspect of the game, which is the bit everyone mostly likes.

Paradox are very clever in that it is the "balance changes" that kill off the old ways to do things, meaning you need the DLC more and more as the game goes on, as it's balanced around you having all the available actions (like subject interactions for reducing liberty desire.)

That just shows their bad practices. And that (plus the ridiculous amount they charge) is why i always wait for a sale to buy any of their products.

 

[Xara]

And this is why Paradox is so clever.

The fact remains that all the tools to get an easy distance belli were removed from the game for base players, but if you have the all important DLC, the trade conflict one remains there for you to use.

The "balanced" new belli is behind the DLC, the unbalanced ones that weren't were simply removed.

These are just things off the top of my head anyway, there are plenty more examples I'm sure, just need time to think about them. Their strategy is subtle and clever and I can't help but admire it.

Trade conflict is far more limited than either of those were. It's not comparable. It's of highly limited use.

 

[Edmon]

And yet you can still use it to achieve some of what you used to be able to do.

You simply 100% cannot achieve any of what you used to be able to without WoN.

I told you, it's brilliant really. If it wasn't for the buildings change in Common Sense, I doubt many would have even noticed the quiet incentives in the balance changes over time that force you to get the DLC's as you start feel you "need" the new functionality.

As I said, liberty desire is a classic. It's absolutely punishing without any DLC's. You can't manage it without interactions. You struggle to give vassals what they want without art of war and if you wanted to use them for feeding, that is now punishing without art of war. You never "needed" the DLC's before, but have come to over time and balance changes.

 

[LS22]

And yet you can still use it to achieve some of what you used to be able to do.

You simply 100% cannot achieve any of what you used to be able to without WoN.

I told you, it's brilliant really. If it wasn't for the buildings change in Common Sense, I doubt many would have even noticed the quiet incentives in the balance changes over time that force you to get the DLC's as you start feel you "need" the new functionality.

As I said, liberty desire is a classic. It's absolutely punishing without any DLC's. You can't manage it without interactions. You struggle to give vassals what they want without art of war and if you wanted to use them for feeding, that is now punishing without art of war. You never "needed" the DLC's before, but have come to over time and balance changes.

Extorsion is brilliant?

 

[Edmon]

You are free to roll back to the old versions, which you did not need the DLC's to manage liberty desire (for example) because it didn't exist.

Just don't think you can play the latest version without the DLC, as I said, it's a subscription game.

Otherwise I'd agree with you. Play the version you've paid for and your set.

 

[LS22]

EU4 is not a subscription game. Where is that stated?

A DLC is an add-on that gives you more than the original, but doesn't take away gameplay. Stating otherwise is just misinforming.

 

[Edmon]

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you. If you didn't buy the DLC, then you are not entitled to any "additions" at all. Newer versions will presume you did.

 

[LS22]

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you. If you didn't buy the DLC, then you are not entitled to any "additions" at all. Newer versions will presume you did.

If they released the DLC's without the free features, i had nothing to complain about. The problem is that they release free features that "makes" you need the DLC. Also, if you choose to stay in past versions, you're not entitled to get bug fixes.

 

[marineFC]

Yet another example of something being removed with the expansion, and then only becoming available with DLC. The Common Sense thing was the worst, it basically removed the ability to improve provinces (because there's less building slots), unless you use development, which, you guessed it, is only available with DLC!

 

[FiveOD]

I'm not sure what you want me to tell you. If you didn't buy the DLC, then you are not entitled to any "additions" at all. Newer versions will presume you did.

I don't think anyone is upset about not receiving free additions. It's the removal of functionality that upsets people. Trade Conflict isn't even remotely comparable to the Call to Arms and Loan Repayment CBs. Those were clearly abusive and their removal was for balance. Allies granting provinces in peace deals has always been around and was not removed for abuse purposes, it was merely shifted over to the new DLC diplomacy system.

I'm not quite cynical enough to believe that this function was intentionally locked in to the DLC to force players in to buying it, but it's a pretty egregious oversight and I certainly hope it gets fixed soon. I should not have to roll back my software version including other changes and improvements, disabling achievements in the process, in order to play the game.

 

[Laexio]

EU4 is not a subscription game. Where is that stated?

A DLC is an add-on that gives you more than the original, but doesn't take away gameplay. Stating otherwise is just misinforming.

you're pretty determined to ignore everything he says, aren't you?

 

[Edmon]

I don't think anyone is upset about not receiving free additions. It's the removal of functionality that upsets people. Trade Conflict isn't even remotely comparable to the Call to Arms and Loan Repayment CBs. Those were clearly abusive and their removal was for balance. Allies granting provinces in peace deals has always been around and was not removed for abuse purposes, it was merely shifted over to the new DLC diplomacy system.

I'm not quite cynical enough to believe that this function was intentionally locked in to the DLC to force players in to buying it, but it's a pretty egregious oversight and I certainly hope it gets fixed soon. I should not have to roll back my software version including other changes and improvements, disabling achievements in the process, in order to play the game.

Worry not, you can still get achievements in older versions.