Alliances

[unmerged(29119)]

Before nothing, I would like to request excueses for my English, really is very bad...

Seeing the systems of alliances of HOI...It will be able in HOI2 to separate of an alliance, for example when a "coupe d'etat" take place in any country?

I'm playing a game with Italy, and a democratic coupe d'etat take place...it doesn't have muche sense that I continue comprsing of Axis...

Thanks.

 

[unmerged(31131)]

I understand what you are saying, and if idealist has his way you will be forced to leave the alliance your apart of if you fall from their faction beliefs. But i don't think we have enough info to tell if you can or not.
I sure hope that it forces us to leave the alliance though(with the exception of the CCCP)

 

[Oscu]

Well, if you look at it....

If I bomb the hell out of your country, would you make an immidiate peace if my goverment changes.
And strategic considerations should be taken into account. Democratic Germany could be just as likely to attack poland as facist. Japan required land and raw materials, regardless of political system. And Japan was not even facist and still was part of axis

 

[unmerged(4474)]

Thats a cool idea, but in those days nobody particularily cared about idiology when "shit hit the fan". Atleast to a degree. Stalin and hitler were the best of allies in 1936 onwards. They trained each others officers and divided poland for lcrying out loud! Hitler and Stalin had many simularities in their personas between the two, they might have formed a great allience, exept that neither particulary trusted one another, and what happened was that stalin was planning to attack hitler, exept the russian forces were caugh by Pre-emptive strike. Otherwise history would be extreamly different.

Also, Chrchhil was a radical anti-commonist, and stalin hated britain and Usa beacuse of their support for white army during russian civil war aswell as some Anti-commonism tactics employed aggainst CCCP in its early years. And yet Stalin Chirchhill and Rosevelt got along just fine.

What I would love to see, is more than Allies Vs Axis.
Situation: I have took out the Axis, and now I mop up in the latin america. Usa, does nothing and what does each nation simply sits thir and waits for it to be the next victim of my annex game? It is posibl that latin america might form an allience of their own.

 

[unmerged(26876)]

I just had a look back through the developer comments and noted that Johan DID say that you would be able to have minor alliances (not just Axis / Allies / Comintern).

But the diplomatic screen does not really reveal much

The triangle is gone - (I rather liked that)


Spheres of Influence bug me a little in HoI because they seem to be more geographical than ideological. To my mind SoI should reflect both.

Ideological SoI would change as the game progressed based on a countries political leanings. Obviously ANY nation which invested a great deal of time nurturing a relationship by influencing another nation toward the same political viewpoint would be upset if it's new friend got invaded.

Have to wait and see I suppose.

 

[unmerged(23902)]

I just had a look back through the developer comments and noted that Johan DID say that you would be able to have minor alliances (not just Axis / Allies / Comintern).

Excellent

 

[unmerged(14689)]

Thats a cool idea, but in those days nobody particularily cared about idiology when "shit hit the fan". Atleast to a degree. Stalin and hitler were the best of allies in 1936 onwards. They trained each others officers and divided poland for lcrying out loud!

I think you've got some things mixed up. The Red Army worked together with the Reichswehr, i.e., the armed forces of the Weimar Republic Hitler killed off in 1933. Also, the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was from August 1939, not 1936. And, last but not least, the Germans and Soviets never were "the best of allies". The M-R Pact was a marriage of convenience. For both. They still hated/disliked/distrusted each other.

 

[Quivis]

I think you've got some things mixed up. The Red Army worked together with the Reichswehr, i.e., the armed forces of the Weimar Republic Hitler killed off in 1933. Also, the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was from August 1939, not 1936. And, last but not least, the Germans and Soviets never were "the best of allies". The M-R Pact was a marriage of convenience. For both. They still hated/disliked/distrusted each other.

But they still helped each other

 

[unmerged(23904)]

They bought each other time. Both knew someday in the near future there was to be a war against each other.

 

[unmerged(15982)]

If I bomb the hell out of your country, would you make an immidiate peace if my goverment changes.

- Err, why not? If Mosley had come to power in Britain, Germany would have signed an immediate peace treaty and it was bombed to smithereens.
In fact, Germany had signed an immediate peace with Churchill if the latter had only been so inclined.

 

[unmerged(4474)]

I think you've got some things mixed up. The Red Army worked together with the Reichswehr, i.e., the armed forces of the Weimar Republic Hitler killed off in 1933. Also, the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was from August 1939, not 1936. And, last but not least, the Germans and Soviets never were "the best of allies". The M-R Pact was a marriage of convenience. For both. They still hated/disliked/distrusted each other.

ummm. suvorov. In 1930's and hitler germany was building a chemical weapon plant in soviet union, in exchange the german officers underwent pilot training in soviet union. Also the "Molotov-Ribbentrop" pact was NOT thought of overnight you know. The soviets and germany had a conjoined troops training together.

 

[unmerged(14689)]

ummm. suvorov. In 1930's and hitler germany was building a chemical weapon plant in soviet union, in exchange the german officers underwent pilot training in soviet union. Also the "Molotov-Ribbentrop" pact was NOT thought of overnight you know. The soviets and germany had a conjoined troops training together.

Little late (just got back from the USSR... er... Russia ), but got some sources for that? (The chemplant, I mean) And yes, the M-R pact was virtually thought of overnight. Soviet attempts to create some sort of alliance with the West were much older.

 

[unmerged(14683)]

Little late (just got back from the USSR... er... Russia ), but got some sources for that? (The chemplant, I mean) And yes, the M-R pact was virtually thought of overnight. Soviet attempts to create some sort of alliance with the West were much older.

Never heard about join-venture in creating chemical weapons, although during the industrialization many engineers from all the world worked in USSR (building well known industrial facilities like STZ in Stalingrad), so it's perfectly possible that Germans have build some chemical plants as well...

And don't make me started about Stalin's attempts to create alliance with the West...

Nevertheless - we are off topic, don't we?

 

[unmerged(14689)]

Never heard about join-venture in creating chemical weapons, although during the industrialization many engineers from all the world worked in USSR (building well known industrial facilities like STZ in Stalingrad), so it's perfectly possible that Germans have build some chemical plants as well...

And don't make me started about Stalin's attempts to create alliance with the West...

Yeah, started in 1934... A tad bit earlier than the M-R pact...

 

[Darkrenown]

Also, Chrchhil was a radical anti-commonist, and stalin hated britain and Usa beacuse of their support for white army during russian civil war aswell as some Anti-commonism tactics employed aggainst CCCP in its early years. And yet Stalin Chirchhill and Rosevelt got along just fine.

No, they never got along just fine. When asked Churchill was asked why he wanted to support the USSR when Germany invaded them he said he'd support the devil if the Nazis invaded hell. Both Hitler and Stalin regarded the M-R pact as a handy way to gobble up Poland while building up to invade each other. And then you've got the whole allied rush to stop the USSR occupying too much of Europe/Asia. Stalin was convinced the allies would turn against him after Germany was defeated and wanted to take as much of europe for a buffer zone as possible.

 

[unmerged(14689)]

No, they never got along just fine. When asked Churchill was asked why he wanted to support the USSR when Germany invaded them he said he'd support the devil if the Nazis invaded hell. Both Hitler and Stalin regarded the M-R pact as a handy way to gobble up Poland while building up to invade each other. And then you've got the whole allied rush to stop the USSR occupying too much of Europe/Asia. Stalin was convinced the allies would turn against him after Germany was defeated and wanted to take as much of europe for a buffer zone as possible.

Well, they got along just fine for practical reasonse, though. Stalin and Churchill dividing their spheres of influence in Eastern Europe on a napkin...