Albania or Iberia - still possible?

[chochko12]

I tried this:
Get Urbino - one in 2 you can get it without Urbino allies Aragon. Got it 2 times - both got DCed by Venezian scum - gg.
Get Ragusa - not possible, because Otto comes and stomps you - tried 3 times same result without single difference.
Get Bosnian Land - tried 2 different ways - trough Serbia or Hungary. 20 or more attempts resulting of Otto getting MA or using mine to come and kill me.
Strange thing happend when i declared on Bosnia and baited Otto to follow me trough Hungary and this way allowing Bosnia to be the siege leader of my province (essential is to have MA with Serbs), but still was unable to survive because Otto got MA from Serbs/Bosnians.

 

[ParadogsGamer]

It's certainly been made a lot trickier now with a) no looting possible, b) new MA mechanics and c) new vassal liberty desire mechanics.
I will try and see if I can figure it out.

 

[chochko12]

I had best intentions to do it, but was unable - did something like 40 attempts (without counting those in which forgot to scorch my land).
The thing that makes it near to impossible is the new MA mechanic. I can live with the new looting - still was able to stop Bosnia from building troops by moving the 3rd free troop in the provinces where they build them few days before completion.

 

[ParadogsGamer]

Yes but also the new liberty desire makes it hard to just grab one province and vassalize the rest, because they will hate you. So not only is the beginning gone harder, but if you actually make it out of the Otto war, you're still in a world of pain.

 

[Tweakee]

No, I don't think it's possible.

Urbino appears to be the only target that you can core that the Ottomans can't chase you to. But since you can't make any allies while at war, and have to eat a bazillion AE declaring on Urbino w/ no CB, and have to win the war long before the Ottomans will take peace, you've got no chance of surviving w/o someone in Italy thumping you.

I think this achievement needs a rethink. Either Serbia needs to start w/ lower opinion of Ottomans so they won't give MA, or Albania needs to start w/ either more troops or a claim to keep the world from declaring on them after a no-CB war.

 

[chochko12]

If i get out of Otto alive... i can live with no vassal
Getting land near HRE was my plan and joining it to get some "protection" - Urbino is good way to do it if you can make it work, both tries in the moment i get Urbino annexed - Venice declared. I tried to Annex before Otto get Albania or after - there was no difference, i was easy prey for the AI - no allies and in war with strong foe.

 

[TheDecider]

...But since you can't make any allies while at war...

You can make allies during Defensive wars (you were attacked) but not during Offensive wars (you declared)

 

[Zelius]

You can make allies during Defensive wars (you were attacked) but not during Offensive wars (you declared)

You cannot call allies into wars started before day 1 of the game anymore. You can make allies though; everyone else acts as though there is no war.

 

[Jack45]

Would like to here from DDRJake on this...

 

[TheDecider]

You cannot call allies into wars started before day 1 of the game anymore. You can make allies though; everyone else acts as though there is no war.

Ah, that's a bummer.

Shouldn't you be able to get an alliance with an italian whom you can call in vs Urbino though?

 

[Zelius]

Ah, that's a bummer.

Shouldn't you be able to get an alliance with an italian whom you can call in vs Urbino though?

Did a quick test using console, results:

1) Almost nobody will ally you anyway (you are a OPM...)
2) Get the 'will be called into multiple wars' -1000 modifier, so.... nope.

 

[chochko12]

Getting allies to help you vs Otto is dead end.
Survival is the only option for.. .survival
There are not many valid targets - OPMs that are not in HRE or any other country with 3-4 regiments. Serbia, Ragusa, Bosnia, Walachia, Blurple - are not valid targets because Otto borders them or can easy reach you. This bring good ole Urbino back - how to survive Venice.

 

[Tweakee]

You don't need an ally to beat Urbino - you need them to survive after you've taken Urbino. But I couldn't find anyone that would ally Albania even before declaring on Urbino. And once you declare the no-CB war, fuhgeddabout it.

 

[chochko12]

If you declare on Bosnia - Austria does not care about them and will ally you, but with Urbino the things go south from 1 to "Exit to menu" in few seconds. I was thinking something like - Circassia or Touggourt

 

[birincikalite]

It' certainly possible. There are two basic routes for it. One is Gazikumukh(or whatever it is) and the other Urbino. There can be other possible routes too ofc but I'll write few basic steps for Urbino route. Note that you need luck at start.

Before unpausing
1) Make sure Aragon and Urbino aren't friendly, Meh i actually forgot that one but I Think when Aragon starts a diplpmat then he seems to want to ally then vassalise Urbino.
2) Roll a siege general.
3) Put highest manuever general on your army and march to Vidin.
4)Declare war on Urbino(note thay you still haven't unpaused)
5)Improve relations with Austria

5)Unpause
6)Get MA from whoever you need to get to Urbino
7)Put siege leader on army right before arriving at Urbino(Idk if it changed, you can swap generals on MA territory right? If not ignore this)
8) Hope to end siege before Ottomans do
9)Don't peace Urbino
10) Pass the game untill Ottomans send a peace offer.
11) Annex & core Urbino
12) Ally Austria( Even if he wont you should still have enough relations, but you will eventually need to ally him to expand in HRE) and join HRE
13)Wait some years to cooldown the or the coalition will stomp you, and Austria won't ally you.
14) And the rest is yours... Ally big nations and use them to stomp others for you while you make sure to maintain good relations with Austria. Get big and go for Iberia first, you can delay Georgia untill Imperialism if you wish.

If any of above fail, restart.


Editt : You gotta change capital before joining HRE

 

[piccamo]

What if instead of day 1 declaring on Urbino, you go for Theodoro? That at least lets you survive the initial war with the Ottomans and then you can look at possibly going for Urbino. Maybe declare on both Theodoro and Urbino at the same time?

During the time of the wars, you should be sending a diplomat to Austria, wait for each month to end, cancel diplomat, resend so you get the double-boost to relations and can build it up faster so you can ally after your wars.

 

[birincikalite]

What if instead of day 1 declaring on Urbino, you go for Theodoro? That at least lets you survive the initial war with the Ottomans and then you can look at possibly going for Urbino. Maybe declare on both Theodoro and Urbino at the same time?

During the time of the wars, you should be sending a diplomat to Austria, wait for each month to end, cancel diplomat, resend so you get the double-boost to relations and can build it up faster so you can ally after your wars.

Crimea would insta declare on you. In fact, very possibly Crimea would have declared the war and started sieging Theodoro by the time you got there.

 

[piccamo]

Crimea would insta declare on you. In fact, very possibly Crimea would have declared the war and started sieging Theodoro by the time you got there.

Really? In all of my recent games, Theodoro lasts fairly late into the game. Probably just good luck for them. I haven't really watched how they survive. In one of mine, they even ended up taking over the Crimean lands. I didn't see how since that one was an Aztec game for me.

 

[birincikalite]

Really? In all of my recent games, Theodoro lasts fairly late into the game. Probably just good luck for them. I haven't really watched how they survive. In one of mine, they even ended up taking over the Crimean lands. I didn't see how since that one was an Aztec game for me.

Well, my bet is Crimea attacks Genoa> Austria & Genoa defeat Crimea and force to release Theodoro

It survives sometimes, but in most of my games Crimea attacks really fast. Ah, also don't forget the AE you'd cause with a no cb. Now combine that with wrong religion. I believe he would attack before you finished coring...

 

[piccamo]

Well, my bet is Crimea attacks Genoa> Austria & Genoa defeat Crimea and force to release Theodoro

It survives sometimes, but in most of my games Crimea attacks really fast. Ah, also don't forget the AE you'd cause with a no cb. Now combine that with wrong religion. I believe he would attack before you finished coring...

That's a good point.