AI War Declarations just after loading a game

[unmerged(18254)]

I'm aware of this issue quite some time ago back in previous version. I then stop playing for other reasons. Just now, after I notice 1.08 is out and read the change list, I'm thinking about starting a new game. Just wondering if this issue is resolved in 1.08 (or any other previous versions which I missed) because I didn't see it listed. Thanks for any pointers.

 

[unmerged(4444)]

Nope, still happens.

 

[|AXiN|]

It isn't really an issue which is all bad, as sometimes save/reload to get AI DoWs is necessary. The situation is actually there because of the way the diplomatic matrix is set up. Under the current system, diplomatic ralations between coreligionists naturally moves towards +125. The AI doesn't like DoWing countries with which it has such high relations, and tries to DoW countries with which it has relations of about 120 and lower. Thus, over time, the AI will DoW less and less. The only exception to this is when a game is loaded - for a short while, I think about a month, the AI doesn't refer to relations when choosing targets for a DoW. The reason this is a new(ish) thing is that until a few patches ago, the diplomatic matrix was set such that relations between coreligionists defaulted to +0. This, of course, meant the AI could effectively DoW anyone.

I think. IDLF could probably explain it better than me.

 

[unmerged(18254)]

Hmm.. isnt that exactly the point of relation?

 

[|AXiN|]

That people with good relations don't DoW? Yes, but it's a qualified yes. Friendly nations don't DoW, and hostile ones do, but over the course of especially the GC, all coreligionist relations end up at +125. The AI sees this as being friendly. No real problem, you might say, but states with different religions have relations which normalise to +100. The AI also sees this as being friendly. So it stops DoWing. The other contributing factor is the AI's tendency to have randomly large alliances. The AI won't DoW unless it is of equal or greater power, in its alliance, than the alliance it is DoWing. The end result is, after a long enough period of uninterrupted play, say 150-200 years, AI DoWs slow to a trickle.

When you reload, however, that AI doesn't look at the relations it has when DoWing for a short period, and so it only considers the normal criteria - borders, relative power, and CBs/cores.

 

[unmerged(18254)]

I didnt know about +125 +100 thing you mentioned, but isn't two country with at least one have casus belli on the other has their relation deteriorate overtime? so even after 150-200 years, there will always be some low relations, thus some DoWs.

The other factor is if you increase your relation with country A, your relation with country B will deteriorate if country A and B have low relation (the friend of my enemy is my enemy). So assuming at the start of game there is at least one low relation, there will never be a world where all good relation. Again, there will always be countries with low relation, thus some DoWs..

 

[|AXiN|]

Right, there are always some, but the number decreases over time because of the relations, and is responsible for stuff like the colonial powers declaring war on pagans they can't even get to, simply because the relations between the two are at 0. The major thing which affect relations, particularly in Europe, is annexation, which gives a fairly hefty hit.

I've never noticed this 'friend of my enemy is my enemy' thing before.

 

[Castellon]

The reason this is a new(ish) thing is that until a few patches ago, the diplomatic matrix was set such that relations between coreligionists defaulted to +0. This, of course, meant the AI could effectively DoW anyone.

I think. IDLF could probably explain it better than me.

Except it is not a new issue at all it has been around for ever.

IIRC it has more to do with the AI asleep problem. Loading a save game gets the AI to reevaluate it's strategies

 

[unmerged(18254)]

I've never noticed this 'friend of my enemy is my enemy' thing before.

Played as Prussia on vanilla 1.08, at the begining of the game, I send gifts to Poland to keep them off me. After the gifts, my relation with Poland is indeed increased significantly but my relation with OE is adversely affected (also significantly) while I never do anything to them. Poland and OE has low relation.

Actually, this 'DoWs on reload' issue didn't bother me much, it's just nice to see it resolved. However, I strongly hope it won't be around in EU3

 

[unmerged(17563)]

Except it is not a new issue at all it has been around for ever.

IIRC it has more to do with the AI asleep problem. Loading a save game gets the AI to reevaluate it's strategies

Exactly the ai resets everything after reload, merchants diplo moves, dows, events fire etc...

 

[unmerged(25696)]

Played as Prussia on vanilla 1.08, at the begining of the game, I send gifts to Poland to keep them off me. After the gifts, my relation with Poland is indeed increased significantly but my relation with OE is adversely affected (also significantly) while I never do anything to them. Poland and OE has low relation.

Who said you had done anything ? When an AI country annexes someone, your relations will decrease exactly the same as if you had annexed the same country.

And what about your tolerance sliders ? They change relations gradually.

 

[unmerged(25996)]

An effective way to avoid DOWs after a reload is to use the console cheat "tilly" for 2 months. While not the same as playing without reload, it eliminates the problem almost all the time. Just remember to repeat the "tilly" command after 2 months to re-enable DOW by the ai.

 

[unmerged(33557)]

Hmm.. isnt that exactly the point of relation?

No.
AI declare war at you for the BB