AI unwilling to get back its cores ?

[Magean]

Hi,

So... I was Morocco, allied with France, at war with Spain. France was the war leader. We reached like 70% warscore, at which point France made peace. Instead of demanding its two cores owned by Spain (Bearn and Toulouse), France took Roussillon (on which they had no core) and got many treaty revocations. They would have had enough WS to get back their cores, but they seemingly didn't want. They didn't even prioritize them.

Later, the same thing happened again : France and I against Spain, Spain got crushed, 85% warscore, France makes peace and conquers Navarra... while Bearn and Toulouse are left Spanish.

Could it be so, because I - and not the French - was occupying these two French cores ? Which would mean that its impossible to get back a core occupied by an ally ?

 

[grisamentum]

Hi,

So... I was Morocco, allied with France, at war with Spain. France was the war leader. We reached like 70% warscore, at which point France made peace. Instead of demanding its two cores owned by Spain (Bearn and Toulouse), France took Roussillon (on which they had no core) and got many treaty revocations. They would have had enough WS to get back their cores, but they seemingly didn't want. They didn't even prioritize them.

Later, the same thing happened again : France and I against Spain, Spain got crushed, 85% warscore, France makes peace and conquers Navarra... while Bearn and Toulouse are left Spanish.

Could it be so, because I - and not the French - was occupying these two French cores ? Which would mean that its impossible to get back a core occupied by an ally ?

Yes, it is absolutely because you were occupying the cores, not the French.

You cannot have a province ceded to you if an ally occupies it.

 

[wickermoon]

You can still use the "return core to xxx" option, if I am correct?

 

[LarryLeica]

You can still use the "return core to xxx" option, if I am correct?

Only if you are the warleader negotiating the peace.

 

[wickermoon]

But France was the warleader, if I understood Magean correctly. Can't you use that option for yourself as a warleader?

 

[LarryLeica]

But France was the warleader, if I understood Magean correctly. Can't you use that option for yourself as a warleader?

Yes, but he wasn;t the warleader. You can use it as a junior ally of course, but in the OPs case, the issue was France peacing out before he did it.

There's a slightly sneaky trick if you really want to hand back territory and semi-force your ally to occupy a province themselves. Tick the 'Attach to this' box on the unit, start sieging the province and wait for your ally to send some units to it, then untick the box and move your unit away, that leaves your ally now leading the siege. It's annoying, but until we get some sort of ally order hints similar to what HOI has, then there's very little you can do about it.

 

[unmerged(82265)]

But France was the warleader, if I understood Magean correctly. Can't you use that option for yourself as a warleader?

Negative.
War leader can return cores back to an ally, not himself.
War leader can cede to himself if he occupies the province.
War leader can cede to an ally if ally occupies the province using the ally's diplo points.
ceding is discounted if you have a claim.
ceding is almost free if you have a core.
occupation is determined by who gets there first, unless there is a core.
if both have cores, see who gets the first
if only one has a core, he gets it if both armies are there
if noone has a core, war leader gets the occupation even if not there

 

[TheBloke]

Negative.
War leader can return cores back to an ally, not himself.
War leader can cede to himself if he occupies the province.
War leader can cede to an ally if ally occupies the province using the ally's diplo points.
ceding is discounted if you have a claim.
ceding is almost free if you have a core.
occupation is determined by who gets there first, unless there is a core.
if both have cores, see who gets the first
if only one has a core, he gets it if both armies are there
if noone has a core, war leader gets the occupation even if not there

Very nice summary, thanks!

One question - are you sure of the last one: "if noone has a core, war leader gets the occupation even if not there"

I thought that an ally sieging a province got that province if no-one has cores. I thought it was only in the case of subject armies that a nation could siege a non-core province but not get the occupation? Unless it's changed in 1.4, I'm sure I've had times where I was WL and my ally got to a province before me and I only had the option to give it to them, not take it myself.

 

[Magean]

Thanks for your answer.

One question - are you sure of the last one: "if noone has a core, war leader gets the occupation even if not there"

I guess brekehan talks about the case where both army (war leader and secondary ally) arrive at the same time. Who gets the siege and the occupation, then.

Sure, when a secondary ally sieges alone, he gets the occupation.