AI still breaks fort rules? Come on Paradox!

[Caesar4]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=871631701
The link above is simply a screenshot of the problem i'm talking about. I am castile at war with Venice and their trade league, including France as their ally. I happen to have a fort in Navarra, as well as Aragon having a fort in Rousillon. Now in this situation, one would expect that under conventional fort rules France could not pass the Pyrenees without either taking one of the two forts or transporting past them. However as you can clearly see in the picture, they have done neither, and yet are clearly moving through Navarra without taking the fort. How is it justified to let the AI just walk through my forts like this, im on normal difficulty!!! This has been going on since forts were implemented in this fashion why is it not fixed?!

 

[Caesar4]

Also there is a fort in Pirineo and yet France is walking to Aragon which is in two zones of control...

 

[PhoenixG]

from my experience the ZOC works a bit wonky if you build it directly on the border and when two forts border each other. When I build forts I always build one province away from the border and never border each other.

 

[Makavcio]

ZOC doesn't work and PI has abandoned its improvements a long time ago. I've got 3 armies in a province, one of them cannot move at all, one can move to an adjacent province and one needs to go all around the continent to reach the adjacent province. At the same time, my vassal's army just prances around without any consideration for enemy forts.

 

[Anthedon]

Doesn't look like anything to me.

That seems like the approach towards the still existing ZoC issues.

 

[Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!]

At this point I would be satisfied if Paradox simply explained the current ZOC rules, forget fixing them. Half the time I can simply bypass forts just like the AI, and I'm not trying to break any rules, it just happens. I can't plan for it like the AI seems to though, since I have no idea which forts I will be able to bypass.

 

[Makavcio]

The problem is there are no fixed rules because the rules they tried to implement simply don't work.
The theory states that every fort has a zone of control that encompasses the fort itself and adjacent provinces. One can move into a ZOC province only from a non-ZOC province and movement from one ZOC province to another ZOC province is possible only if you are moving into a fort that exerts the ZOC.
The problem is that all rules die the moment there are 2 forts in adjacent provinces or ZOC is exerted into neutral or friendly territory. I was trying to figure out rules that govern such situations but look at my previous post, there are none. Different sets of rules apply to armies standing on the same plot.

 

[Lordkaiser]

ZOC doesn't work and PI has abandoned its improvements a long time ago.

I read this several times in this forum. Is it true? Why is it?
Arent Forts a Key element of the game?
Why would you abandon the fixing of the problems with forts?

 

[Dominion]

Half the time I can simply bypass forts just like the AI, and I'm not trying to break any rules, it just happens.

That's usually the case with coastal forts because the "return province" that's being provided by every ZoC is a sea tile.

As far as I can guesstimate from current rules.

 

[zoislk]

I read this several times in this forum. Is it true? Why is it?
Arent Forts a Key element of the game?
Why would you abandon the fixing of the problems with forts?

Although it is true they didn't change anything with regards to Forts and ZoC in the 1.19 patches, they did as recently as the 1.18. No idea if any changes will be coming in the 1.20 or 1.21 patches.

Generally, if you just follow the same idea that PhoenixG mentions (don't build forts next to another fort or your border), you will probably be fine. I have still seen some weird things happen in places like central Italy, though... it's not a perfect system.

 

[Dadrumer]

Yeah, At days like these I get really angry about the developers. Throwing one dlc after the other, when tha game could use polishing.
Hate it, when the AI just says: "Nah, we f*** on your little castle here, we can march right through your line of defense!"

(Link)

Edit: Okay, after watching Reman's Video I see, why they can do it (Distance of two ...) but still think it's BS.

 

[Badesumofu]

Yet to see a definite case of the AI breaking the rules, it always seems to turn out that it was just the player not properly understanding the rules that the AI is playing by.

Reman does a great job of illustrating what the rules actually are in his video:

 

[DS_McWerp]

Remand paradox just explained how forts actually work on YouTube. Was very enlightening. The rules don't make sense, but they do exist and the AI does follow them.

Beat me to it

 

[Magnificent Genius]

I just want to point out that if you have two forts next to each other, their ZoC cancel each other out, so to speak. Also, if you can get to a province on the other side of a ZoC by any means by land, no matter how long it would take, you can walk straight through the fort. I had never experienced that particular effect before my last game, though the ai has done it many times.

 

[GC13]

That is a fantastic video, incredibly helpful in explaining to everyone how the game is designed.

But dang does it expose the movement system as being completely inane and gamey to the extreme. The most egregious example is how a unit that comes off of a boat can ignore all of the forts it wants along the coast as long as they are adjacent to that sea province.

 

[Me_]

In Paradox defence it has been a long time since the last patch.

In OP's defence the rules were always broken and Paradox Devs themselves can't explain them.