AI medium ruthless

[Patgarret77]

Well it seems to me that the AI medium is better than 75% of players, roughly. It's just ruthlessly efficient in pumping out units, seeking encirclement and using (mostly) units the way they are supposed to be used. When I play 2vs2 in 1vs1 map I can do slightly better as I can concentrate better on a small part of the map but still that means that I have to fight big, efficiently managed, forces that usually create a super heavy amount of firepower.

Anyone having this hard time?

 

[evilcat]

Ai dont understand airplanes, and is rather fixed on one assault point at the time.
It is quite effective at managing (such APM).
There is always option to play at slower speed.

 

[Lomak]

Play couple of games against hard AI then go back to medium and you start thinking whether they have dumb down AI medium on the last patch or if it was that easy also before. (even if you take luftlande against 15. scotts)
Second you need to find out what is the best opener for the division you take. If you loose the race in phase A then it is much harder....

Ai dont understand airplanes, and is rather fixed on one assault point at the time.
It is quite effective at managing (such APM).
There is always option to play at slower speed.

Only on medium....on hard AI is using airplane a lot but as it is easy to counter one fighter with two fighter it isn't a problem

 

[TGApples]

If I were Eugen I'd annoy the heck out of the community and make it so you couldn't play online until you'd beaten medium AI.

 

[Grosnours]

I've had a lot of variation in the results fighting against AI medium (hard is consistently hard on the other hand). Sometimes it will perfectly use planes in phase A, some other times very sparingly. Sometimes it will fold past the first contact and never recover, some other times will hold the line fiercely.
In general it makes an excellent sparring partner which is not giving you too many bad habits and tries and keeps you on your toes without cheating too openly. IA loves to mini-blob in a general fashion, so it can be quite predictable too.

If I were Eugen I'd annoy the heck out of the community and make it so you couldn't play online until you'd beaten medium AI.

That wouldn't be a good move for gathering the good will of customers.
But yes, beating medium AI is an excellent test.

 

[Lomak]

If I were Eugen I'd annoy the heck out of the community and make it so you couldn't play online until you'd beaten medium AI.

Maybe too restrictive but they could show if they player in your team / oponent team were able to beat hard AI.

Maybe by showing a badge you could earn in a column at the matchmaking screen....

 

[evilcat]

If I were Eugen I'd annoy the heck out of the community and make it so you couldn't play online until you'd beaten medium AI.

Hard requirments is not user friendly, and it is not about players being good or bad, but on similar level (playing to end is also good asset).

 

[Patgarret77]

If I were Eugen I'd annoy the heck out of the community and make it so you couldn't play online until you'd beaten medium AI.

And you machism is useful/interesting in this discussion for exactly what reason?

 

[Kipsta]

Once you've realized the AI just keeps on attacking all the time, it's basically about learning where to build up the most efficient fire bases for you units to destroy all his stuff.

 

[Patgarret77]

Once you've realized the AI just keeps on attacking all the time, it's basically about learning where to build up the most efficient fire bases for you units to destroy all his stuff.

Yeah, dinamycally, unrelentlessly, and also advancing at the same time...

 

[Radioshow]

I find medium AI to be fairly easy. Hard is a bit of a challenge but still beatable. Have not tried very hard yet.

 

[Sir Garnet]

Wait a minute. Just because Eugen has joined up with Paradox to publish its game does not mean it needs to annoy its players unnecessarily (well, unless it's in the contract).

 

[Patgarret77]

Well switching to the Scots in Point du Hoc unlocked me winning pretty easily on medium. So I guess divisions unlocked till now ARE a bit asimmetrical after all (nothing inherently bad in it, just stating).

 

[Raventhefuhrer]

And you machism is useful/interesting in this discussion for exactly what reason?

He's making an intelligent, albeit probably tongue-in-cheek point.

Players with low skill or understanding of the game have been a bane for this franchise (including the Wargame series) since its inception. In some ways, this is unavoidable in a game with such a high learning curve. If you forced players to cut their teeth against the AI, it would act as a gate to keep these lesser opponents out of multiplayer. More skilled/experienced players wouldn't have to worry about stomping noobs as much, while noobs themselves might actually stand a chance once they got to multiplayer if there was a bit of a bar to get in.

I think such a system would have good and bad points to it, and you can argue over it. But the guy you quoted was making an interesting point.

 

[Patgarret77]

He's making an intelligent, albeit probably tongue-in-cheek point.

Players with low skill or understanding of the game have been a bane for this franchise (including the Wargame series) since its inception. In some ways, this is unavoidable in a game with such a high learning curve. If you forced players to cut their teeth against the AI, it would act as a gate to keep these lesser opponents out of multiplayer. More skilled/experienced players wouldn't have to worry about stomping noobs as much, while noobs themselves might actually stand a chance once they got to multiplayer if there was a bit of a bar to get in.

I think such a system would have good and bad points to it, and you can argue over it. But the guy you quoted was making an interesting point.

A matchmaking system is all it takes. And it has been requested so many times that I'm sure Eugen will address in some way.
Still, coming up with this in a post looking for sympathetic players having the same difficulties, and asking for advice, is questionable at best. And it surely doesn't add anything to the discussione the OP, me, wanted to create.

 

[Flyingkiki]

That's some elitist way of thinking multiplayer gaming.. That would mean two noob friends can't play together online as long as they have not beaten the Medium IA ? I'm not sure it will please/encourage casual gamers to be kept offline because of their lack of skills. A lot of players here gave their Steam name to help people progress, so multi is a way to improve.

But why not create a filter for game hosting, deciding that you want only people that have some victories on Medium IA, or Hard IA to play ?

 

[Grosnours]

A matchmaking system is all it takes. And it has been requested so many times that I'm sure Eugen will address in some way.
Still, coming up with this in a post looking for sympathetic players having the same difficulties, and asking for advice, is questionable at best. And it surely doesn't add anything to the discussione the OP, me, wanted to create.

Try to see it from another point of view:
- how much do you think has your game improved since you started this thread (given you've succeeded now in beating the medium AI) ?
- amount much do you think it's thank to the AI's very good level drilling you into making the right moves ?
- do you think, given your initial weaknesses, you'd have as much fun playing in multi that you will have right now, when you're arguably much better ?

It sounds very brutal and unfriendly or even downright hostile, but Tigga is essentially right on one thing : if everyone could only play multi after having beaten the medium AI at least once, the games featuring players new to multi would be much more pleasant as the level difference would be much smaller.

 

[TGApples]

It sounds very brutal and unfriendly or even downright hostile

Heh. I should have added some emoticon and perhaps a quote. It wasn't meant to sound mean, it was mainly a reply to the first sentence in the OP:

Well it seems to me that the AI medium is better than 75% of players, roughly

I personally think people should take some time to figure out the basics before jumping online. Another way of doing it is to play in specifically titled "noobs only" games. Beating medium AI may take some practise, but you'll learn a lot more from an opponent you can explictly set the difficulty of to get fair games rather than one who wins by 2000 points before Phase A is up.

 

[Raventhefuhrer]

That's some elitist way of thinking multiplayer gaming.. That would mean two noob friends can't play together online as long as they have not beaten the Medium IA ? I'm not sure it will please/encourage casual gamers to be kept offline because of their lack of skills. A lot of players here gave their Steam name to help people progress, so multi is a way to improve.

But why not create a filter for game hosting, deciding that you want only people that have some victories on Medium IA, or Hard IA to play ?

For one, I never took a stance on whether the idea was good or bad although I concede it's interesting and worth discussing. Furthermore, nothing else I said is objectively untrue - Wargame and Steel Division is a hard to learn franchise with an -enormous- skillgap between a new player and a veteran. Forcing new players to have to learn against AI for a few games (and not letting them join the general pool of gamers until they've demonstrated the ability to win) might feel elitist but the result could add up to a lot of good.

The fact of the matter is that we need to find some way to teach people the game. And the current Wild West system of 'just throw them in and maybe they'll learn' doesn't work. I can speak on this with some authority - in Airland Battle and Red Dragon I made threads for noobies, hosted 'learn the game' events, and even made a YouTube channel more or less dedicated to providing tutorials and informative gameplay for newer players to learn the game.

Now granted, when the tutorials are up and running that may be enough. Yet I suspect (as is often the case) the tutorials won't be enough to truly make you ready for the trials of multiplayer.