AI Garrisoning is broken - US has no defense

[ThuderLizard2]

Decided to invade US in China game to see how well new garrisoning discussed in patch notes is working. Short answer is: not so well.

China invaded Hawaii and LA with only one UK colonial unit in defense (see image):

Not finding any US forces, I tag-switched to see where they all are:

But there's more - Greenland is safe:

And the mighty Yorktown rules the waves - sans aircraft of any kind:

This is as bad or worse than 1.4.2.. I don't get what was done to improve garrisoning in this patch.

 

[Nickoteen]

wrong. in my game. UK was a nice enemy with hard defence. playing on hardest difficult

 

[Rider_of_Doom]

In my game it was the other way around: The US had the whole coastline full of units and I couldn't break through and the Axis troops wasted so many troops to invade the UK until they finally brought through the defence line after years with the help of thousands of airwings and hundreds nuke bombs (which finally have a meaningful impact against troops).

 

[Marcus]

Seeing the same here, UK and Vichy France are the worst offenders, can't figure out where to put their troops so they send them on suicide cruises.

 

[LakeClouds]

Wow. Pretty sad state of affairs.

 

[Meglok]

Was the USA at war in the Pacific when you invaded, or just at war with the Axis? Did you invade after someone else had whacked the US Navy and the ai was rebuilding, or did you DoW and fight your way across the Pacific and then invade.

The set up matters in the discussion.

 

[a_sophist]

The set up matters in the discussion.

Isn't this fact a problem in itself? If the country has sufficient divisions there should always be at least one garrison on each port and major VP.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Taureor demonstrates that it doesn't work for the player either. The game now straight up ignores that you added more divisions to a constrained garrison area and will happily leave a ton of them just sitting in spot rather than following orders.

If the player wanted that, the player could have ordered only the fraction of the troops that go to garrison. It's a strict regression on what was frankly an unreliable feature even before.

 

[shultays]

Please attach a save game to help me solve problem.

There are some problems with garrison orders I fixed recently (didn't make into today's hotfix sadly) which was causing problems when you edit orders or change settings, but I am not sure if it would affect AI.

 

[Meglok]

Isn't this fact a problem in itself? If the country has sufficient divisions there should always be at least one garrison on each port and major VP.

Well, given the USA's well-known manpower issues while in isolation, it does take a while to ramp up even garrison divisions. Especially with the new trickle flow of manpower when you increase laws, plus the US building production efficiency and starting to build MIC. How long the US had been at war and with who does matter.

So yeah, I can see situations now where if the USN is elsewhere and the US hadn't been in the war a while you can easily blitz the US West Coast. And we know the entire naval system is up for a complete overhaul. The ai USA has been a problem since HOI3.

 

[caedussl]

Does the AI decide when to prioritize defending? The US never would had garrisoned the country, although that might have changed that if Hawaii or Alaska fell.

In my game Britain was locked down tight. Significant amounts of defenders on every port and reinforcements close by (with high level forts). I was Qing and didn’t move to help Germany until 1946/47. Germany defeated the USSR in 1942 and didn’t really do anything, so Britain had 3-4 million on the Island. Had to organize a coup and use the fascists land as a beachhead.

 

[a_sophist]

Well, given the USA's well-known manpower issues while in isolation, it does take a while to ramp up even garrison divisions. Especially with the new trickle flow of manpower when you increase laws, plus the US building production efficiency and starting to build MIC. How long the US had been at war and with who does matter.

So yeah, I can see situations now where if the USN is elsewhere and the US hadn't been in the war a while you can easily blitz the US West Coast. And we know the entire naval system is up for a complete overhaul. The ai USA has been a problem since HOI3.

I generally agree, but I'm not even talking about seriously defending an invasion, just not letting the enemy walk into a port. The US starts with 22 divisions and 25 ports on the mainland. Every other important piece of land starts with a garrison too. IMO the AI should be forced to build 3 divisions to round out the port garrisons and then keep them there. Every other division can get shuffled at the AI's leisure.

 

[Kipsta]

Hm... they have plenty garrisons in my game. Lucky you.

 

[ThuderLizard2]

The US starts with 22 divisions and 25 ports on the mainland. Every other important piece of land starts with a garrison too. IMO the AI should be forced to build 3 divisions to round out the port garrisons and then keep them there. Every other division can get shuffled at the AI's leisure.

That would be a good start. At least Hawaii should have 3 divisions and some coastal forts.

Well, given the USA's well-known manpower issues while in isolation, it does take a while to ramp up even garrison divisions.

Then how can you explain the 25+ divisions on Greenland (see image)? Also tons of infantry and tank divisions in the Caribbean.

Was the USA at war in the Pacific when you invaded, or just at war with the Axis?

At war with US for a while. US joined Allies and China is at war with Allies.

There are some problems with garrison orders I fixed recently

I've had this problem also where units on garrison duty just sit someplace and don't go to where they're supposed to unless manually moved. See save file.

 

[LakeClouds]

I generally agree, but I'm not even talking about seriously defending an invasion, just not letting the enemy walk into a port.

Seems crazy that there's no units at all defending ports. This must be a bug right?

 

[a_sophist]

Seems crazy that there's no units at all defending ports. This must be a bug right?

AI garrisons have been always been nonsensical. I don't know the coding reasons why but for whatever reason the AI doesn't weigh defending its cores highly enough when arranging units.

 

[diceyy]

Seeing the same here, UK and Vichy France are the worst offenders, can't figure out where to put their troops so they send them on suicide cruises.

The garrison ai has always been the absolute worst at that. The amount of times troops I told to guard the east coast of russia only to look away for a minue then find them in the china sea because thay'd decided to sail all the goddamn way to iraq just to walk back across asia to where they started was INSANE

 

[Marcus]

The garrison ai has always been the absolute worst at that. The amount of times troops I told to guard the east coast of russia only to look away for a minue then find them in the china sea because thay'd decided to sail all the goddamn way to iraq just to walk back across asia to where they started was INSANE

If this can be fixed (and teach the AI to not try the same Naval invasion 27 times in a row) we are well on our way to making this a true gem (despite my whining here, I am loving the rest of the game).

 

[LakeClouds]

If this can be fixed (and teach the AI to not try the same Naval invasion 27 times in a row)

Garrisoning works better in Dark Hour compared to what I'm reading about here. The naval invasion issue was similar in DH but probably not as bad. Why is it so hard to program an AI to plan a sensible naval invasion?

 

[ThuderLizard2]

If this can be fixed (and teach the AI to not try the same Naval invasion 27 times in a row) we are well on our way to making this a true gem (despite my whining here, I am loving the rest of the game).

This is one of at least a dozen AI problems that need to be fixed before we have a even a low grade gem like common quartz.