AI Economy collapsing (Known Issue)

[Lothos]

It is a known issue that several AI countries economies are collapsing in some (not all) games. From some initial analysis this appears to be more related to the trade AI making very bad decisions. We are going to see what we can do to fix this but more than likely we will have to wait till patch 1.3 comes out which hopefully will address these issues as they do exist in 1.2 (Japan)

 

[|AXiN|]

On a possibly related issue, I've played about 6 games to the mid 40s and in about half the USA has degenerated into massive revolts - any idea what's going on?

 

[Lothos]

It is all related

 

[unmerged(35036)]

Things to check out so we can improve this

I played a few games and came up with some ideas about this economy problem.

1) Most countries start with defined trade agreements, this trades were based on vanilla economy models, and ATM most countries can't satisfy it.
For example HOL used to have spare materials to give to most countries, and it start with a lot of trade agreements in exchange for goods.
The catch is that HOL don't have thouse materials anymore and even without trading what they don't have, they can't sustain for themselves in this new economy.
Somehow and just with this exception, HOL's Puppet feeds em up with all their needs, but this opened a question mark in my head, maybe most countries are still trading what they don't have, and usually unless a war starts, and they end having low efficiency in trade, they won't cancel it.

Suggestion: Reworking all the starting trade agreements might help all thouse countries affected.

2) Material base for most countries were severely reduced, you can see a lack of energy in the world were you had spare in vanilla, this things are hurting the Trading AI a bit, making it worst that its on vanilla.
As most countries have more IC than they can't mantain, and basing on what i found out in point 1 they also trade what they dont have, you have economy sucide in mass.

3) Reduction of IC in most countries are leaving countries almost dead, it might be better to erase em from existance?? well maybe the formula used differs a lot from vanilla, but whats more realistic? I think this is also hurting the world economy a lot.

Basically even when we all know the errors that vanilla already have, i think this things are adding more problems while we should be finding solutions.

 

[Lothos]

Luxor, CC this guy has a point

 

[Luxor]

The mod is still in beta. Until we don't put in the resource changes events, any argumentation about economy is pure speculation, since those events are changing a lot resources layout each year. We still don't know what will happen. This guy is basing his point of view on a 1936 layout, while you know very well what will happen each following year and how general economy will change. I'm not saying he's wrong, I'm saying it's too early to do such statements about economy. This issue will have to wait after 1.3.

The only point I can agree with is the first. We can remove starting trades from OOBs, but here Lothos you have to tell me if this is fine with AI or if this can cause problems.

 

[unmerged(35036)]

This is just pure speculation anyway, but if you change countries in something like 1938 for example, countries like HOL still have the starter Trades.

I was just giving ideas here, nothing more, i know The mod is in beta and you are waiting for 1.3, but i guess we can't sit there just waiting for it, if we can do something to improve it ATM.

Anyway the mod is doing great, im just giving my two cents like everybody else, sorry if i look so negative some times

 

[Lothos]

I wouldnt say remove all starting trades but verify they are still valid and good trades. Many of the HOL trades should probably be removed ands hifted over to NEI

 

[unmerged(11202)]

As was said earlier, even countries that used to have a lot of spare energy are now finding themselves in trouble. I noticed that the amount of IC for a lot of countries has been increased, while several have less IC. Though overall there are now a lot more ICs needing resources from the start of the campaign and add to that the increase by building IC and from events. Sofar I have played 2 campaigns with this mod as the USA and Japan and in both cases I found myself severely short on energy. Metals and rare materials could still be acquiered albeit with greater difficulty.
A possible solution would to either increase resources production at the start of the campaign or script events that increase resource output as well. Sofar I haven't seen events that give a higher resource production and it leads to the rather odd situation where resource output is still the same at the end of the game as in the beginning. Didn't the world see a great increase in the output of raw materials as well, in the years leading up to and during the War?

 

[Luxor]

As was said earlier, even countries that used to have a lot of spare energy are now finding themselves in trouble. I noticed that the amount of IC for a lot of countries has been increased, while several have less IC. Though overall there are now a lot more ICs needing resources from the start of the campaign and add to that the increase by building IC and from events. Sofar I have played 2 campaigns with this mod as the USA and Japan and in both cases I found myself severely short on energy. Metals and rare materials could still be acquiered albeit with greater difficulty.
A possible solution would to either increase resources production at the start of the campaign or script events that increase resource output as well. Sofar I haven't seen events that give a higher resource production and it leads to the rather odd situation where resource output is still the same at the end of the game as in the beginning. Didn't the world see a great increase in the output of raw materials as well, in the years leading up to and during the War?

We have already stated (several times) that resource mod will be added after Paradox 1.3. This change will modify world resource layout each year according to historical data.