Ahistorical starting scenarios

[fredgiblet]

I'd like to see some options for a scenario editor or built-in ahistorical starting scenarios, such as the US falling to fascism in '36 or '40, the Unholy Alliance on the USSR and Germany coming to pass and things of that nature. I'd even go as far as to say that I'd be willing to shell out a few bucks for a DLC with a set of interesting ahistorical starting scenarios since it's probably too late to add them into the base game in time for launch.

Anyone else think it would be cool to play through a bunch of ahistorical matchups? A Communist UK/Soviet bloc fighting off the fascist US/German pairing while democratic Japan seeks to free Asia of European influence?

 

[LoLLarN]

From my personal view upon it:
No, I play Paradox games to change history myself from where it starts all accurate and not play through already changed history scenarios.

We are all different and I hope to see others agree with you and keep bringing up more things as ideas no matter how "bad" they appear to me, they still can appear way more interesting to others.

 

[safe-keeper]

From what I understand, PDX is growing weary of making too many starting bookmarks because they take time to make and balance, but new ones still seem like a good DLC for further down the road when the starting dates are sorted out and balanced properly and all. Ahistorical ones would be interesting.

Cough, Kaiserreich, cough.

 

[The_Meme_Man]

I am also on the boat of wanting to start off historically and deviating from there. I like knowing the context behind the start. I feel like an "alternate start" would be better if we had a Victoria III to complete a proper playthrough from Crusader Kings II or EU4 into WWII through the Age of Industry where ideologies can naturally grow as opposed to artificially exist (there has to be a reason for the US to be fascist, and I want to know what that reason is, that reason being known from Victoria II or a hypothetical Victoria III).

 

[fredgiblet]

I see what you're saying, but on the other hand there's a lot of things that can't be done with the existing historical start setup. Mostly because the game doesn't give you the control needed to set up certain scenarios.

An option to import a Vicky 3 game would be cool though.

 

[Daddl]

A nation editor will certainly be available at one point, whether via DLC or for free, just like the one in HoI3, CK2s ruler designer or EU4s custom nation designer.

But what is much easier? Mods. There is little doubt HoI4 will be as mod friendly as other Paradox games, so I'm quite sure changing the ideology of a nation, mess around with some territories and bring them to pick specific desired National Focusses (or even create new ones) will be super easy.

 

[ssb]

I'd like to see some options for a scenario editor or built-in ahistorical starting scenarios, such as the US falling to fascism in '36 or '40, the Unholy Alliance on the USSR and Germany coming to pass and things of that nature. I'd even go as far as to say that I'd be willing to shell out a few bucks for a DLC with a set of interesting ahistorical starting scenarios since it's probably too late to add them into the base game in time for launch.

Anyone else think it would be cool to play through a bunch of ahistorical matchups? A Communist UK/Soviet bloc fighting off the fascist US/German pairing while democratic Japan seeks to free Asia of European influence?

I definitely agree. Maybe this could be built into something like the custom game mode that was introduced in HOI3 TFH.

 

[fredgiblet]

A nation editor will certainly be available at one point, whether via DLC or for free, just like the one in HoI3, CK2s ruler designer or EU4s custom nation designer.

But what is much easier? Mods. There is little doubt HoI4 will be as mod friendly as other Paradox games, so I'm quite sure changing the ideology of a nation, mess around with some territories and bring them to pick specific desired National Focusses (or even create new ones) will be super easy.

Sure, but for instance I tried to mod HoI3 to let me start as a fascist US, it didn't work so well. There's missing ministers and it requires a lot of practice to get the modding right. Paradox has that practice, plus presumably they have resources on hand for finding more ministers and the like, rather than hunting for them like we'd have to.

I'm not pushing for this to be a core feature, but I think it would be awesome if they could have somebody who knows what they're doing put it together and drop it in the scenarios folder or something like that.

 

[Sir Garnet]

Sometimes we just want the war. 1939 is a natural bookmark, but the early war took an unlikely course and Germany rolled high. A start in 1941 or so would allow a more balanced start, with arguments for 1942 and early 1943, After that it's a twilight struggle.

 

[safe-keeper]

I used to be an advocate of a whole series of starts, but I'm actually happy with just '36 and '39 only, with '41 added as a patch or DLC or something, provided that this means the starts we get are highly detailed and accurate. If the devs can only spend so much time making events and decisions, fleshing out minors, and getting history and balance just right, it does make for more interesting starts if they focus those efforts on just one or two bookmarks. So if we get far "deeper" bookmarks in HOI4 than in HOI3, I'm all for the game shipping with just one or two.

If they make "bookmark DLCs" somewhere down the road... I'm not sure what I would want, but a start right before the beginning of Operation Torch would be interesting -- I'd get to invade Africa, Italy, and of course Normandie, and try to beat the Russians to Berlin.

 

[fredgiblet]

Yeah, as far as the year goes I'm fine with just '36 and '39. Once you get past that the ability to alter the outcome drops rapidly.

 

[calebmarkle]

Alternate scenarios with some backstory would be cool, but I feel like it would make more sense as a mod. Something like the Kaiserreich mod would be fun to play in HOI4

 

[Axe99]

I used to be an advocate of a whole series of starts, but I'm actually happy with just '36 and '39 only, with '41 added as a patch or DLC or something, provided that this means the starts we get are highly detailed and accurate. If the devs can only spend so much time making events and decisions, fleshing out minors, and getting history and balance just right, it does make for more interesting starts if they focus those efforts on just one or two bookmarks. So if we get far "deeper" bookmarks in HOI4 than in HOI3, I'm all for the game shipping with just one or two.

If they make "bookmark DLCs" somewhere down the road... I'm not sure what I would want, but a start right before the beginning of Operation Torch would be interesting -- I'd get to invade Africa, Italy, and of course Normandie, and try to beat the Russians to Berlin.

This - I prefer a start that's fun to play and well put together, rather than 5 starts, most of which haven't had the time put into them they could, and are a bit of a mess (I'm thinking of some EU4 examples here, my memory's a bit rubbery on the HoI3 starts).

I also think ahistorical scenarios are best left to mods or a scenario-editor, as individual preferences for this kind of thing will be pretty broad, although a 'popular' ahistorical start (a Kaisereich-alike, say) bundled with a scenario editor as DLC could go well.

 

[wright1331]

I'd like to see some options for a scenario editor or built-in ahistorical starting scenarios, such as the US falling to fascism in '36 or '40, the Unholy Alliance on the USSR and Germany coming to pass and things of that nature. I'd even go as far as to say that I'd be willing to shell out a few bucks for a DLC with a set of interesting ahistorical starting scenarios since it's probably too late to add them into the base game in time for launch.

Anyone else think it would be cool to play through a bunch of ahistorical matchups? A Communist UK/Soviet bloc fighting off the fascist US/German pairing while democratic Japan seeks to free Asia of European influence?

There WILL be mods for this

 

[fredgiblet]

There WILL be mods for this

Is there one for 3? I couldn't find it if there is and I've asked before and go no answer.

 

[safe-keeper]

Is there one for 3? I couldn't find it if there is and I've asked before and go no answer.

Don't think so. There is a modern warfare one, and a WWI mod, but no alternate reality start ones that I can think of.

 

[hkrommel]

Yeah with how much must be changed for something like Kaiserreich it's almost another game. They'd have to do new portraits for all the fake/different leaders, totally rebalance everything, etc. I don't think they'll do that through DLC since their other DLCs have been focused on adding gameplay features and expanding cultures that were neglected upon release.

 

[Sir Garnet]

The problem with 1939 in Europe and December 941 in the Pacific is that a historical path is then unlikely due to the unlikely sequences of events even without hindsight at work. .But 1939 does let the Europeanss get right to fighting.

 

[Alliegorical]

Kaiserreich.

 

[Chat]

I was always a fan of the Armageddon and The Abyss scenarios for HoI2. Haven't played Kaiserreich, but it looks interesting.