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That is correct but becuase of how I play i have a tendency to face really numbers of enemies on regular basis. Its one of reasons why I keep on stating if AI's able to produce quality units faster and earlier than normal. Their production bonuses will have to be toned down greatly. Unless you feel great joy in deploying a bunch of unmodded t1s and t2s to square off eighteen laser tanks equipped with Plasma Disintegrator Module and Laser Precision modules equipped plus a random module at minimum. What would happen to human players? The human players will always get slaughtered every single time. No matter what. There's just no overcoming certain amount of technological advantage. My guess is that the devs is trying to nail down the teching speed balancing + resource gathering income speed. Planetfall ain't Civ5.I'm not sure that's mostly because of the mods, i haven't try any AI mods though, but being attacked by full 5-12 stacks (that is 30-72 units full of modded t1 and t2) by turn 22-30 happen regularly in my game without AI mods, the most extreme is if i'm surrounded by 4 AIs, they often attack with 14-20 full stacks from 4 directions, each with 1k-1,2k power, happens usually around turn 25-35. This is why i (and few other posters in this forum) often complain about late game AI instead of the early game one, this is also why for now my focus on my AI mod is improving their use of higher tier units then later for them to mod those units.
What i found out so far by tinkering with the modding tools, the AI plans after mid game are quite weird, they still use early game plans at a turn where said turn is defined as mid or late game, by default the game consider mid game at turn 30+, late game at 55+, by default the AI seems to have different perspective regarding this though. I suspect this is part of the reason why they only use tier 3 and tier 4 in quite high number after turn 150+ (i never saw it myself, but looking at Ericridge pictures), there are several other reasons like unit production, research and unit upgrades priorities and the shifting between plans is influenced by chance. Personally the level or depth of access for the game resources is less than i expected, but i still think it's possible to create a decent if not good AI, it's however quite tricky for now, that being said i experienced decent amount of success so far in regards of making the AI use t3 and t4 much earlier than default, but too extreme for now, so i'm still figuring the right values for the variables
Because I lost the science city to green kir'ko.Wait, why do you have just 289 research and 11 operation points? If you have completed all future techs, there should be 14 operation points. If you haven't completed research yet, why is it so low? Here is my game at turn 53 vs 4 times stronger AIs with never ending wars. You can see I have more operation points and more doctrines.
Well, now I am not sure why you play vs extreme AI (if you do) and then complain that it will be impossible to beat extreme AI if it gets stronger. 2-3 colonies is what I have before turn 10 and 5 colonies is my goal for turn 20, you play in a very suboptimal way. Why do you have a single science colony? It is not civ where you stack wonders in a single city. It is optimal to play in a way where you can lose any colony (including capital, yes) and still win. That means thousands of science/energy, hundreds of cosmite, dozens of influence, multiple armies. And not on 100+ turn, but around turn 50-60.Because I lost the science city to green kir'ko.
It was a choice between keeping the science city or keeping my capital city. I chose to let the science city go. And it was a wise decision, my leader got killed at least twice.
I didn't have that much choice in the matter. I was at 2-3 cities for most of the game. Around turn 30ish, I was shooting at 24+ oathbound dudes trying to take my capital. And I was fighting blue kir'ko to keep control of four energy sectors, and then I didn't have troops needed to retain control of the science city so I took what I had out of the crimson fastness city and moved them to bodifahl. Which was just two owls. And i lost control of bodifahl and regained it several times over the game.
Which naturally leads to the result of having low science income.
I just understood that I had to hang in there no matter what. Gradually I forced a opporunity to take out the oathbound who has been obessed with me for the whole game and took him out for once and all which gained me +4 cities instantly but in the process I lost control of my capital to green kir'ko who seized the moment to smash it I also lost Bodifahl at same time to the blue kir'ko. But with oathbound dead I was free to retake my capital and retake bodifahl and made the fronts much more stable.
I didn't know that losing my capital meant i had to rebuilt my influence/cosmite structures again. Now i Know. First time it happened to me.
My lands was a major battlefield for my enemies Almost every few turns I was fighting more than 30+ units from at least two opponents in total. So I could get home, and then get started and wage four major battles and it takes up several hours and then I have to log off for the day and I progress only 1-3 turns xD
It didn't help that the oathbound cities I took had terrible location for science tho. His cities was set up for energy/food. Even if I tore them down and set up science, they would've been lvl 2 at most. Much more easier to take the slow approach than to spend precious cosmite on colonizers. I wanted to set up a new science city but I needed the cosmite going into the units more.
Its yet another moment of ballooning colonizer costs royally fucking me over.
Not really. I killed first AI before turn 15. I lost a sector of capital to another AI while doing so. The trick for early game is to build roads between all your colonies even if it means attaching a bad sector. My games are harder when there are no adjacent opponents because then I cannot double my colonies by early conquest.Because anything below extreme would be too easy for me. Extreme is sufficiently tough yet beatable for me. I don't know about you but I strongly suspect if you were penned in by one super close AI neighbor with two AIs allied + keeping watch with their armies ready to move in the moment you move out you would be struggling too. The map I'm playing on at the moment is a galactic empire map. Difficulty is significantly higher than a normal RMG map.
The two kir'ko was in a alliance, they went oh we met you. Ok now you die!
I am sorry, but I believe adding new features to the game is a bad idea as long as AI does not use them or is bad overall. If you play aow3, you may know that AIs never use builders meaning no roads, no forts. Planetfall AI never replaces mods and does not mod tier 3-4 units until very late game. Using these abilities by human player feels like cheating.I find it a bit annoying that a potentially useful thread with an interesting topic is being ravished by some who are discussing way less interesting things.
1) can be partially achieved with the current mod tools. I mean there is currently two type of strategic buff towards stack, one is lasting until said stack enter combat, the other is duration based. The tools allows modification to the latter, for the former, it's probably possible but tricky. The only thing the tools can't replicate (as far as i know) the enchant system of AoW2 is it can't introduce strategic buff to single unit, however can still be achieved by the player by just making a stack has one unitWhy not also compare them with Shadow Magic? Some opinions (using all DLCs):
1)Mods vs Enchants : Enchants didn't have unit type restriction (very few did, like stone skin ban on flying units). Mods do give passive stats on top but I think most enchants could swing combat much more than the average. I doubt the devs are ever going back to the AoW2 Wizards so I don't think there is any chance of enchants returning though. AoW3 enchants don't count here because they were just tactical spells. AoW4 would be better with an enchant alternative than none at all.
2)There is way too few summon spells. So far it seems like factions can summon a tier 1 and maybe another tier 1 from their secret tech if it has one. This is way less strategic than using your resources to sneak a tier 3 into a fight in the last moment or fortifying a city with summons imo.
3)Free buildings: Buildings shouldn't be free. Why aren't higher tier buildings limited by Cosmite like higher tier units? This encourages spamming cities instead of having few strong cities spamming strong units in aow3.
4)Leaders\heroes are too similar to each other now without casting points. You can't take a goblin sorcerer with you and hope he manages to get off a lightning strike cast to turn the battle. Instead you get whatever and jam him into a tank to never see him again. or use him as a tank healer.. Everyone get to the laser tank it is our only healer!
5)RNG hit system.. You either love this or really hate it\tolerate it.
Finally I hope if they are re-introducing sectors that they either reduce the number of sector upgrades or give them their own production queue independent of units \ structures. Introduce sectors that don't give anything at all sector upgrade wise to make it harder to decide which areas give the best cities. If it is too much then allow forts \camps to mine whatever replaces energy \ research like AoW3.
Things I really want to be gone in next game: buildings that let you get Prime units without ever stepping foot into a battle. Units I used a lot in combat don't matter because a fresh recruit is going to be the same power.. if not even stronger than they are with higher tier mods on top. This was also in AoW3 and it wasn't great there either. Please limit new unit training to bronze\silver unless you manage to get a strategic building to get levels in AoW4!
Another surprising thing i found is there is a possibility that the size of a sector can be changed, like to total area (in hexes) it have, potentially making the map larger, haven't checked whether it clash with RMG resources properties though, if there isn't then yes the map can be made bigger. And even a weirder map templates can be made
I am not sure we disagree here, at least after you realize that there is no challenge if AI cannot win and even does not try to. I think everyone is fine with AI cheating at hardest levels, that's the point of levels.All of these posts about the AI, and I feel that I am in the minority in that I believe that the AI should be thought of being part of the PvE game, instead of being a fake player in a PvP environment.
To clarify what I mean: I want the AI to be focused in giving the player an interesting challenge, and not in trying to winning the game per se.
Obviously, an AI is not meant to be mere NPC going through very static motions, but an opponent who can react to the various strategies a player can employ:
Beside that, I would be perfectly happy with AIs which cheats if they use those cheats to provide interesting challenges to the players instead of trying to run them down.
- If being raided, the AI should try to fight off the raiders. If it cannot, it should get weaker.
- Taking cities from the AI should make it weaker. But taking the last city should be the hardest of them all, not the easiest.
- When a big army is being set up at its border, it should try to concentrate its forces too.
- Stealthy armies should be mostly ignored, but against a player with stealthy armies, it should have more defender and patrols to find them.
- And some more that I am missing.
My ideal AI setup would be one where each AI had a role, which came with both cheats, and specific behaviors which made it uses less than its full cheating force against the player, such as to get fun things to do for the player.
As examples (in the context of Planetfall):
Cheat: Extra unit production and energy
Behavior: Always try to be at war with a single target. Select a single city from the target, build an army and send it against the target. Attacks even if the target is sufficiently defended, and scales the size of the army before sending it based on how long the game is. Keep all others armies in its territory or close by to defeat neutral forces or raiders.
How to fight: Either try to spot the target city and defend it with a lot of force, or try to kill the troops before the army is set up by raiding. Do diplomacy to get them in others wars to reduce attacks frequency.
Cheat: Starts with mid-game technology from the start, but has a big research speed penalty
Behavior: Try to bully everyone else by extorting resources from them. Happy to let them live if they give resources or border sectors to the AI. When angered, perfectly happy to do a truce after having conquered a single city or two.
How to fight: Bide your time. Give up to the extortion at first, before attacking the AI with full force after having teched-up.
Wait, why do you
Well, now I am not sure why you play vs extreme AI (if you do) and then complain that it will be impossible to beat extreme AI if it gets stronger. 2-3 colonies is what I have before turn 10 and 5 colonies is my goal for turn 20, you play in a very suboptimal way. Why do you have a single science colony? It is not civ where you stack wonders in a single city. It is optimal to play in a way where you can lose any colony (including capital, yes) and still win. That means thousands of science/energy, hundreds of cosmite, dozens of influence, multiple armies. And not on 100+ turn, but around turn 50-60.
My current game is hilarious, I haven't built any non-secret tech units yet which are researchable and just look at the armies and income at turn 60. 4 times extreme AI still does not have any mods on tier 3 units and I have seen just 1 tier 4 unit. AI definitely needs an improvement.
This is a typical game for me, I like to play largest maps with 12 players where everyone has adjacent neighbors. There are no camps/teleports and my bronzemark was food which I annexed at size 12 i.e. quite late (science sector first, residential sector next). Amazons don't need food early due to racial bonus. Yes, having more difficulty levels than current 5 would be a perfect solution indeed. With the mod I use there are 9 levels with 4 new levels above existing extreme. This game is rather easy because of animals and ascended teachers, I lost my previous game at this level. AIs have colonies everywhere and huge armies everywhere too.Seems like you had a very lucky start that's all. I started a new game on RMG and I got put deep into middle of no where rather far away from each AI. So I had to do a bunch of settling and grow the cities for economy. But in the same vein, the AIs left me alone so far except for one dvar who went on a vassalizing spree, he vassalized two AIs before it was even turn 20 lol. I had just enough military to discourage him from escalating the war and limited it to just skirmishing and stare off contests as I colonize the lands around me. I'll be nice and post what I have on turn 62 even when it puts me in a bad light but to be fair, please understand, I lost 12 units in the war. xD Highly armored units is tough enough for troopers to grind down without casualties. I also lost like 6 npc units. Maintained the status quo.
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Do you reroll maps until you get very near AI neighbor and then murder that AI. Or do you reroll starts until you get a bronze science landmark? Or at minimum a city ruin so that you can have level 3 science sectors? From what I can see, most of your units is composed of NPC faction units + some T3 units from a landmark + animal recruitments. You're kinda playing like what I would do as a sorcerer in AOW3. lol Playing as a sorcerer can certainly screw the AI very hard because you're basically materializing powerful unit son the spot while the AI has to produce them first. See how you have very few produced units.
From what I'm guessing, you're probably putting all the influence into NPC unit recruitment and likely isn't purchasing any of the settlements or cosmite sites. You're gaming the game extremely hard. Devs should just create a new difficulty tier of the AI for guys like you and leave me in peace against extreme AI. I'm having plenty of fun vs Extreme AI. Its one of reasons why I do not want Extreme AI nerfed or made harder because the difficulties below is way too easy for me. So, let's say, a new AI difficulty above Extreme AI should be named as... Gamer AI? And they'll do same tricks as you do.
You need to understand that sometimes once in a blue moon you will get a start that royally fraks over the player no matter what and makes for a long game.