Age of Nationalism: Turkey

[unmerged(7310)]

the Hedjaz was Turkish until the end of the WWI, it was the Wahhabists from central Arabia who had attacked the Turks (and even defeated them in a few battles)

when Greece declares independence u should activate sumthin where the Europeans and Russians attack the Ottoman Empire in with Greece.

 

[Styrbiorn]

There is an event about that. However as the Russians will drag in Austria and Prussia in the war against the Ottomans, they'll only get a CB.

 

[Damocles]

Egypt had gained roughly vassal status since Napoleon. In fact, they were very independent at times and even came to open blows with the Ottomans who were somewhat outclassed by the Egyptian troops who were trained after an European model.

It got so bad that the British had to step in and quell them because it affected British interests in the region and beyond.

Except...The Ottoman sultan was so diplomatically retarded, he rejected all attempts by the British to make the occupation joint and legal, resulting in the British virtually annexing Egypt to themselves.

But yes. Egypt was a very independent entity for a good couple of generations.

 

[Styrbiorn]

Yep, Egypt is now an Ottoman vassal.

 

[Damocles]

Ideas for Turkish Events:

1. Greek independence! Various events dealing with Turkish-Austrian relations in the Balkans, as well as with the Bulgarians and Serbs.

2. Various events which simulate the unrest in the Empire at the time with the provincial pashas and such rebelling either openly against the Sultan or being recaltriant. Just general stuff that lowers stability, raise revolt risk for a bit. Will more or less be enough to hamper even a player's attempt to expand, but not be so harsh as to precipate a downfall.

3. Military and Goverment reforms under Mahmud II. Some minor, +infra,+land +naval, +1 stability.


4. Tanzimat.

Not sure how to do this. It was a continuous effort, good for more then one event I believe. After wrestling with this for a bit, I decided to just include the blurb from the Encyclopedia and see what events people can derive from it. I expect it will drastically raise centralization at least.

============================================
(Turkish: “Reorganization”), series of reforms promulgated in the Ottoman Empire between 1839 and 1876 under the reigns of the sultans Abdülmecid I and Abdülaziz. These reforms, heavily influenced by European ideas, were intended to effectuate a fundamental change of the empire from the old system based on theocratic principles to that of a modern state.

Many of the key provisions of the Tanzimat reforms were set forth in the Hatt-i Serif of Gülhane (1839; “Noble Edict of the Rose Chamber”). This document called for the establishment of new institutions that would guarantee security of life, property, and honour to all subjects of the empire regardless of their religion or race. It also authorized the development of a standardized system of taxation to eliminate abuses and established fairer methods of military conscription and training. The promises of equality for non-Muslims (mainly Christians and Jews) living in the empire were not always carried out, but the balance of the changes provided for in the Noble Edict, along with other reform measures, were implemented principally under the leadership of Mustafa Resid Pasa, who served six terms as grand vizier. The reforms included the development of a new secular school system, the reorganization of the army based on the Prussian conscript system, the creation of provincial representative assemblies, and the introduction of new codes of commercial and criminal law, which were largely modeled after those of France. These laws, moreover, were administered by newly established state courts independent of the ‘ulama’, the Islamic religious council.

The Tanzimat reform movement came to a halt by the mid-1870s during the last years of Abdülaziz's reign. Under the Tanzimat effort to centralize administration, all legal authority became concentrated in the hands of the sultan. As a result, little could be done when Abdülaziz began abusing his power and adopted revisionary policies. This fact notwithstanding, the Tanzimat reforms succeeded in laying the groundwork for the gradual modernization of the Ottoman state.

============================================

5. The 1876 constitution. (The first of any Islamic nation)

6. Treaty of San Stefano if certain conditions are met.

7. Young Turks revolt in 1908.

8. Balkan wars of 1912-1913.

This is just a foundation. I have an excellent (and thick, 1000 pages plus) volume of the Ottoman Empire's history, alot of it dealing with the last 150 years. I've read through it, but my memory isn't exactly photographic. When I have access to it at home, I'll leaf through it and flesh out some events.

Anyone else have anything to contribute for now? Such as events dealing with Egypt and the Greeks in regards to Crete?

 

[Styrbiorn]

Good ideas, in fact every event but the Balkan Wars and the Young Turks rebellion have been made. The Balkan Wars will be handled as a special event of some kind, but if you like, please script these two events.

Except the listed there are events about Muhammad Ali, the destruction of the Jannisaries, events about Midhat Pasha and a set of revolt events.

After 1880 there are very few events made, so if you want to make them, go ahead.

Do you have the template, BTW?

 

[Damocles]

No template as of yet, I'll wait a bit before requesting one, as I can't provide much more assistance then events.
As I understand it, most of the major work being done on the mod won't be complete until the 1.05 scenario editor is out. I got two more weeks of classes and then I'm going home. Once there, I'd be more then happy to script some events for the Ottoman Empire post 1880. I'd do it now but there are no good Ottoman books in my campus library (I looked) and I mistrust most internet sources.

If I may ask...What else has there not been any events made for yet? Depending on the resources that I can access, I can write them up. Also, I can do monarchs and leaders for the Ottoman Empire if no one has done it yet. (I once took something of a rabid interest in anything Ottoman, so have alot of material at home to work with.)

Anyhow, the library here is actually great...Thousands of ancient books dealing with just about anything. Yet nothing super on the Ottomans. They have just about every Byzantine book ever published tho.

 

[Styrbiorn]

The monarchs have been made, but not the leaders.

And there are tons of nations that don't have events written for them. What are you most interested in? Middle East, the Orient, Africa or Europe (most European events are on the way and the American events are also on the way, afaik)?

Persia, Vietnam, Siam, Kongo, Johor, Khiva are examples of nations not made yet. If you want, I can try to fix a list.

 

[Vulture]

If you can do Kongo, pls do so... I will only make one or two Kongo events that have to do with the Belgian annexation of the land.

 

[Styrbiorn]

Ah, sorry, I forgot you doing Kongo

 

[Vulture]

Well, not DOING, just altering

 

[Damocles]

Events must be coming along pretty nicely to only have small nations such as those still need events. Seeing as how they got at most, 1 or 2 for even 400 years of EU2.

I'll come up with some stuff up about Persia if no one has done it yet. Most of my knowledge is middle european/middle eastern and regarding the history of China.

Are there events written up for Bulgaria, Serbia, Greece, Romania...?

 

[Vulture]

By all means, help us... Thank you in advance.
Only nation you mentioned that HAS events is Greece... All others are free to do... Give it a go

 

[Styrbiorn]

Yes, and Greek events are being porduced afaik.

I've created a few revolt events concerning Bulgaria and Romania under Ottoman rule, but nothing really over-thought. Do you have any suggestions about how Romania shall be created (iirc Moldova and Transylvania was unified to Romania).

 

[Vulture]

Btw, for easier creation: ROMANIA will use SIE tag, MOLDAVIA has MOL

 

[Damocles]

When it comes to nations breaking away from the 'mother country', I feel it is best handled with severe events. Rather then make the AI deal with an increased revolt risk, give them the opportunity to allow the historical development (this should happen 85% of the time). If say, the Ottomans refuse to recognize independence, all hell should break lose. Since in AoN, all of the rebel units should be made equal (or perhaps only slightly less then equal) to the regular troops, this should work good. Can you set domestic sliders for REB?

Anyhow, massive revolts, especially in the case of Balkan nationalism, which was in every sense of the word, inevitable, should be the order of the day. Every province should have be a core province of another, so that it will form another nation instead of defecting and then the other nations it should belong to will defect to it instead of others. The Ottoman Empire really didn't stand a chance against the Balkan nationalists who were of a significant higher quality. Events should handle this stuff cleanly.

Will there be separate culture for Bulgaria?

I'll see about writing up some events for Bulgaria and Romania and the Ottoman Empire/Persia. May take some time, since all my books are at home, but they'll be done before the scenario editor is available anyhow.

 

[Vulture]

Ok seems cool to me

Which culture do you propose for Bulgaria? Just bulgarian?
Easy enough fix

 

[Styrbiorn]

Can you set domestic sliders for REB?

Fully possible. We can higher there land tech too.

These are the created events for nationalists within the Ottoman empire. Feel free to replace and add more.

event = { 
	id = 17026
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		NOT = {	exists = BUL}
		owned = { province = 356 data = -1}
	} 
	date = { year = 1835 }
	offset = 200
	deathdate = { year = 1935 }
	name = "Bulgarian Revolt!"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17026"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "Ok"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 356 value = 12 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 17027
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		NOT = {	exists = BUL}
		owned = { province = 356 data = -1}
	} 
	date = { year = 1841 }
	offset = 200
	deathdate = { year = 1935 }
	name = "Bulgarian Revolt!"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17027"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "Ok"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 356 value = 17 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 356 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 17028
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		NOT = {	exists = BUL }
		owned = { province = 356 data = -1}
	} 
	date = { year = 1875 }
	offset = 200
	deathdate = { year = 1935 }
	name = "Bulgarian Revolt!"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17028"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "Grant independence"
			command = { type = independence which = BUL }
			command = { type = breakvassal which = BUL }
	}
	action_b = {
			name = "Crush them!"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 356 value = 15 }
			command = { type = revoltrisk which = 12 value = 5 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 17029
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		owned = { province = 480 data = -1}
	} 
	date = { year = 1831 }
	offset = 200
	deathdate = { year = 1935 }
	name = "Crete Revolts!"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17029"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "Crush them!"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 480 value = 8 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 480 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 480 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 480 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 480 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 17038
	random = no
	country = TUR	
	trigger = {
		OR = {
			owned = { province = 358 data = -1}
			owned = { province = 359 data = -1}
			owned = { province = 360 data = -1}			
		}
	} 
	date = { year = 1831 }
	offset = 200
	deathdate = { year = 1935 }
	name = "The Greek are revolting!"
	desc = "Nationalistic sentiments are growing stronger in our Greek provinces, and their demand for independence is heared louder and louder."
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "Crush them!"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 358 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 359 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 360 value = 20 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 359 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 359 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 359 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 358 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 358 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 360 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 360 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 360 }
	}		
}

event = { 
	id = 17039
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		NOT = { exists = SER }
		owned = { province = 355 data = -1 }	
	}
	date = { day = 3 month = may year = 1876 }
	name = "Balkan Revolts"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17039"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "We use our imagination and.... CRUSH THEM"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 362 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 363 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 364 value = 20 }
			command = { type = independence which = SER }
			command = { type = breakvassal which = SER }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = trigger which = 15702 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 17040 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 19160 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 17040
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		exists = SER
		OR = {
			owned = { province = 363 data = -1 }
			owned = { province = 364 data = -1 }
			owned = { province = 362 data = -1 }
		}
	}
	date = { day = 3 month = may year = 1876 }
	name = "Balkan Revolts"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17039"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "We use our imagination and.... CRUSH THEM"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 362 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 363 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 364 value = 20 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = trigger which = 15702 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 17039 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 19160 }
	}		
}
event = { 
	id = 19160
	random = no
	country = TUR
	trigger = {
		NOT = { 
			exists = SER 
			owned = { province = 355 data = -1 }
		}	
		OR = {
			owned = { province = 363 data = -1 }
			owned = { province = 364 data = -1 }
			owned = { province = 362 data = -1 }
		}		
	}
	date = { day = 3 month = may year = 1876 }
	name = "Balkan Revolts"
	desc = "EVENTHIST17039"
	style = 1
	action_a = {
			name = "We use our imagination and.... CRUSH THEM"
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 362 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 363 value = 20 }
			command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 364 value = 20 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 364 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 363 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = revolt which = 362 }
			command = { type = trigger which = 18313 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 17039 }
			command = { type = sleepevent which = 17040 }
	}		
}

 

[Vulture]

Ok I raised land tech for rebels somewhat in 1820_reb.inc and altered their sliders in country.csv to more offensive, land & quality

 

[Damocles]

Hopefully, they are at max free subjects as well, and only one tier lower on the combat level. As it is in EUII, revoltees are pathetically weak. In 1819-1914, they were a serious threat, often demolishing state armies and carving out their own states, so strong was nationalism. The people would not be resisted, except by overwhelming force which few nations were strong enough to exercise. Even the Civil War in America can really be seen as just one big revolt...Given that it takes 3 years for a province to proclaim independence, it can be used to state that if a rebel province does declare, then the Union would have lost. Can rebels be given leaders like Pirates supposedly can that can show up with certain events?

BTW, this website is invaluable... http://www.1uptravel.com/worldmaps/balkans.html

Rumelia should be Bulgarian culture. Bulgaria should perhaps start with slavonic as well. All the Balkans should have overlapping CB shields. Such as with both Bulgaria and Serbia CB shields on Kosovo and Bulgarian CB shields on Dobrujda and Macedonia. The EU map of the balkans is woefully inadequate however...I wish they'd broken Thrace/Macedonia up at least once more.

Also, Wallachia, Dobrujda and Moldova would consist of Romania with CB shields on Bujah and Jedisan/Transylvania (which was still controlled by Austria-Hungary, at least in the maps I'm looking at).

As for the events proposed...I would make an A option that simply allowed the Turks concession of those states which is more historical (to a point) and then a B choice of engaging in open bloody war with the rebels which the Turks should not be able to manage without receiving a royal beating.

Is there events for the unfortunate Armenian incidents? Nothing fancy, just drastic souring of the Turco-Europe relations and reducing Armenia's population by half.