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Comments on the Model, improvements

Perhaps a 4th option should be given to the major powers initially, during the claiment events, where FRA and HAB can choose to support a rival claiment. e.g. FRA supports Savoy claim? While HAB could support a strictly Bavarian claim?

The relational manipulations will need to be screened, I'm positive there are errors in the assignments.

Presumably, with the potential for the major rival claiments to renounce their claims, there is the possibility that one of the remaining major power would get an easy pickings. I would suggest a massive badboy increase, large relational penalties and one massive Euro-gang-bang directed against the major claiment that annexes Spain, with the ultimate goal of restoring the balance in Europe. Player skill being the major combatting force against these 're-balancing' measures.

The throne manipulations shall also need some clever scripting, as Spain *might* be jostling rival claiments as they did historically during the war.

the alliance forming events which are briefly touched upon int he model will need careful scripting. I may be mistaken, but I have a suspicion there is a specific way to 'build' diplo-alliances which would have to be monitored.
 
I'm not sure where you're going with the flags, but it looks to me as though there will be a ridiculously large number of combination of outcomes. I'll wait and see, but won't it be tricky to ensure that all contingencies are covered?
 
Treaty of Partitions of Spanish Empire

Jan. 19, 1668: On the death of Charles II of Spain, Leopold was to have Spain, the West Indies, Milan, and the Tuscan ports; Louis was to receive Naples and Sicily, the Low Countries and Franche Comte, Navarre and Rosas, the Eastern Philippines, and the Spanish possessions in Africa.

Oct. 11, 1698: The Electoral Prince (the son of the Electoral of Bavaria), was to have Spain, the Spanish Netherlands, and the Spanish possessions in the New World; the Archduke Charles would receive Milan; and the Duke of Anjou (the Dauphin) the two Sicilies, the Tuscan Ports (Porto Ercole, Porto San Stephano, Orbitello, Piombino, Telamonte, Porto Longone in Elba), Finale, and Guipuscoa.

May 1700: The Duke of Anjou secured the Two Sicilies, the Tuscan ports, Guipuscoa, and Milan (but Milan would be exchanged for Lorraine); the Archduke Charles was to receive Spain, the Spanish Netherlands, and the Spanish possessions in America.
 
most of the flags aren't scripted for and they represent parallelling alternate outcomes like you envision. They can be trimmed off if you want, I use them b/c they're tidy. Also, i think it can be very challenging to the player when he/she doesn't necessarily know what the outcome is going to be and is not directly shown what subsequent events his/her choices generate. The variations may seem like too many but it should be possible to balance the variables. I've tried to incorporate everyone's input, thus far. The only input that's missing is your knowledge of Savoy. Mine is obviously weak. If you can follow what I've scripted so far, you'll see I still need Savoy's position, and after Savoy, then England's positions will probably take precedence.

Again, the initial claims merely allow the player/AI variety, you can choose to back off from the situation, you can choose the historical route, or you can go for the money shot.

EDIT: thanks Philip, I was thinking this might have to go back to Devolution times, perhaps even with King Louis XIV marriage
 
Re: Treaty of Partitions of Spanish Empire

Originally posted by Phillip V
Oct. 11, 1698: The Electoral Prince (the son of the Electoral of Bavaria), was to have Spain, the Spanish Netherlands, and the Spanish possessions in the New World; the Archduke Charles would receive Milan; and the Duke of Anjou (the Dauphin) the two Sicilies, the Tuscan Ports (Porto Ercole, Porto San Stephano, Orbitello, Piombino, Telamonte, Porto Longone in Elba), Finale, and Guipuscoa.

May 1700: The Duke of Anjou secured the Two Sicilies, the Tuscan ports, Guipuscoa, and Milan (but Milan would be exchanged for Lorraine); the Archduke Charles was to receive Spain, the Spanish Netherlands, and the Spanish possessions in America.
For these Partition Treaties, should we merely explain to the player what he/she will be recieving (if the treaty holds) via the event description? Thereby holding off core allocation until a war breaks out or if the Treaty is successful?

Or do you think core allocation within the Partition Treaty events would be best?

The core allocation might be a little tricky, though I am willing to attempt it. If we are to use cores, my suggestion would be to wait until either the 2nd Partition Treaty is acted on, or until war breaks out. The alternative might be to minimize core allocation, and simply cede provinces away if the Treaty works out.

Perhaps a good compromise might be cores if the player owns the provinces already, and a simple annexation of the provinces if they are not owned by the player?
 
I don't think there is any need to take Savoy seriously. I only suggested them because it would allow a justifiable interesting outcome, and if someone wanted to find an alternate compromise candidate (in order that Spain be vassalized to neither France nor Austria) Savoy is a good choice.

I'd skip the first paritition treaty. It was an important diplomatic event, but if Carlos is going to live until 1700 anyway I don't see the point. Could be mentioned in the 1698 text, but I don't see that it's needed beyond that. Certainly no-one should be getting cores until Carlos dies.
 
IMO you just justified Savoy's inclusion. You said it yourself: justifiable intersting outcome. That's good enough for me. This on top of what you've already said about them.

I would like to know what you want from them. To what level are they to be included?

I included a 4th option in France's claiment event where France can support Savoy's claim. Perhaps a Savoy claim event once France lends their support for them? The rationale being that Savoy is pushed into the spotlight, where she is forced to decide to either press or relax her viable claim. Or should they simply receive a claiment event independent of other countries' wishes/desires/choices?

Again: Savoy - dependent vs independent claim event?

If dependent, what conditions would you want to see in place?

Btw, I agree that the First Partition Teaty event should be dropped. It was rendered useless when Ferdinand died. And so far no one's disagreed with our inclinations to leave death dates alone (tinkering with Ferdinands death date being the only reason why the First Partition Treaty should be an issue).
 
In my opinion it would have to be like the Electoral prince. Savoy may well be agitating to make claims, but only gets them if some combination of the principals (HOL, ENG, HAB, and FRA) decide to accept a compromise candidate to avoid a war. This is a realistic way for them to have received the Spanish throne. Anything else is much less realistic.

Or unless Savoy is very big, but that opens up all sorts of other issues that ought to be handled
 
Two options come to mind then. Both assume Savoy isn't big.

We could go with a round of 'Partition Treaty II' events where the main principles will choose either to abide by the treaty, nominate a neutral candidate, or refuse to sign it. Effectively, we assume the negotiations have already taken place, and nomination of an entirely new neutral candidate (such as Savoy's Victor) is a last minute revelation, that prompts FRA and HAB to consider it, whereupon they would either reject it or agree it.

The second option is to introduce a kind of 'Partition Treaty Negotiations' sub-series. This takes place after FRA and HAB have established their claims, and after the Electoral Prince's unexpected early demise. It also (obviously) assumes FRA and HAB have made their historical claims. The initial events for this serise would be analogous to FRA and HAB initial claiments events. Here, ENG and HOL would choose a claiment to side with or choose to compromise with neutral candidates, or choose to stay neutral altogether. Savoy's claiment (Victor) could be represented in that choice.

EDIT: can we define global flags? If so, can countries trigger them in events?
 
Last edited:
Originally posted by ribbon22

EDIT: can we define global flags? If so, can countries trigger them in events?

No. All flags are country specific. Any triggers must be on flags stored for that country.
 
This war of Spanish succession thread is a clear example of AGCEEP trying to do too much and ending in nothing. I think is too ambitious and lacks a fundamental point of view. It reflects the Wittelbach, the Habsburg, the Bourbon, the Dutch and the English participation, but lacks the Spanish. All the partition treaties were diplomatic games signed to be broken.

I propose to start in a much simpler way with the death of Carlos II and the main historic events after that. I will discuss it over also at the Spanish forum. My initial ideas are:

  • the choosing of dynasty, as it is, is unacceptable. They fought for the throne and they should fight for it. The player represents someone behind curtains that can influence the outcome, but not the one that decides who reigns.
  • After Carlos II, Felipe V becomes king uncontested in 1700 and is crowned in 1701 by all the parliaments of Spain. Spain becomes a vassal of France.
  • A French event represents the decission of Louis XIV of not respecting the division of crowns between France and Spain. This should trigger the war of succession event in the rest of the countries, assigning cores and casus belli to them and changes of relationships.
  • In 1705 the Archduke Carlos becomes king of part of Spain, represented by a new country (CAT) at war with Spain. Rebellions in both sides and low stability represent a civil war between partidaries of both kings in both countries.
  • In 1713 the new country is reabsorbed by Spain. If the new country is above a certain size by then, the habsburg dynasty gets instaurated instead of the Bourbon. Province specific events restitute peninsular provinces lost to other nations during the war like in the Bohemian hussite crusade. The european cores of Spain and the Italian culture get lost at this point. A treaty of Utrecht event represents the international end of the war of succession.
  • A final event breaks the vassalage of Spain to France in 1715, when Spain and France fought for Santo Domingo.

Additional layers can be added later on to give it as much complexity as people wants, but I plan on focusing on the bare bones to get a funtional scenario ASAP. In principle it should work like the wars of religion in France: a bad period followed by a return to the initial situation. Other countries can jump at the chance of taking European possessions of Spain, that will be an easier prey, but in my experience EU2 Spain doesn't usually have much of them left by 1700, except the South of Italy and Sardinia and Sicily. Spain must have the chance of defending them, as she did.

Note: This has been moved from the Iberian thread so more people can participate. After the kit is done and agreed I will deposit it also over the Iberian thread, as this thread will sink again.
 
From the start it is impossible to have France defending Spain as it happened, so I will not even attempt to create an alliance between them as this could throw the game equilibrium through the window unless you force the creation of both alliances, which I don't think is a good idea. Most probably Spain will not have possessions in Flanders and Brabant, as it is a very rare occurrence.

By following action_a:

First step: Felipe V becomes king of Spain. SPA is made a vassal of France with good relations to her. That makes her a better prey to the others. Austria gets cores on Spanish Netherlands and Milan, and casus belli against FRA and SPA.

second step: France gets cores on Spanish Flanders. This triggers the choice for ENG, HOL, DEN. They all get casus belli on FRA and SPA. BAV gets casus belli on HAB. A war becomes more likely, but probably it won't happen.

third step: POR and SAV get casus belli (on FRA and SPA) and in the second case core on Sardinia.

four step: In 1705 civil war erupts in SPA. CAT is created and receives provinces. It has cores on all of SPA. It becomes a vassal of HAB and is forced to declare war on SPA. SPA becomes an even better prey, so some nations might decide to jump in.

fifth step: between 1705 and 1711 CAT has a very small chance of winning the war if it can become size ten or bigger. A player with SPA that wants to change the dynasty will have to "lose" the war and make sure CAT becomes size ten or bigger. In that case CAT is reabsorved and the dynasty changed. A foreign nation should not care who rules SPA as long as it is not annexed to FRA or HAB, and that will not happen.

sixth step: In 1711 Charles becomes HRE. Multiple events restore relations, and casus belli expire. FRA loses cores on Spanish Netherlands

seventh step: 1713 Utrecht. Spanish peninsular territories in the hands of FRA, ENG, POR, HOL, SAV or HAB are returned to SPA. The rest are kept by whoever gained them. Charles abandons CAT. SPA loses Italian culture

eigth step: 1715 CAT is reabsorved. Decrees of New Plan end medioeval priviledges in the former crown of Aragon territories (Bourbon centralization). Break of vassalization to FRA

While I am more aware of the Spanish issues, some Northern European issues I don't know well and perhaps should also be included. My general idea is that if a province did not change hands for a long period, then nothing should be done about it. For example Naples became Austrian for a short period, so going from the hands of Spain to those of Austria to again those of Spain is not worth being represented. Same for Sicily.

Regarding Gibraltar or Menorca, those were small bases basically with zero manpower, zero taxes and zero population, so they cannot be represented by the entire Spanish provinces that include most of Cadiz and Malaga and the Balearic islands. It would be equivalent as giving an Italian province to Spain because she had a Presidio, or given her a North African province because she owned a coastal city.
 
First phase. The European war 1700-1705

Code:
########################## THE WAR OF SPANISH SUCCESSION ##########################

# IDs 285210-285230


# The will of Carlos II #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285210
	trigger = {
		exists = FRA
		exists = HAB
		NOT = { vassal = { country = SPA country = FRA } }
	}
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285210"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285210"
	style = 1 
	date = { day = 2 month = november year = 1700 }
      
	action_a = { # OK
		name = "ACTIONAME285121A"
		command = { type = dynastic which = FRA }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 200 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 179080 } # HAB the will of Carlos II
		command = { type = trigger which = 170052 } # FRA the will of Carlos II
	}
}

EVENTNAME285210;The will of Carlos II;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285210;For years Europe has been preparing for the death of childless Carlos II of Spain. He was related to several royal families in Europe, but after the death of the designated heir, Joseph Ferdinand Wittelbach of Bavaria, at the age of six, the royal houses of Austria and France had a similar claim, although according to the Spanish laws of succession the right of the French Dauphin preceded that of the Habsburg. But both nations were too powerful, and the addition of the Spanish empire would make any of them unstopable, and so candidates not destined to their thrones, Philip of Anjou and Charles Habsburg, were discussed as heirs to Carlos, and several partition agreements were negotiated. That is precisely what everybody wanted to prevent in Spain. Despite the bigger influence from the Austracist party leaded by the mother of Carlos, there was an undisputable fact: France had 300,000 soldiers next to Spain and the Spanish Netherlands, and so represented the only opportunity, albeit small, to keep the empire together. A will was redacted and the agonizing Carlos signed it. It leaves the kingdom to Philip Anjou, but it contains two crucial clauses, the condition that the crowns of France and Spain should never be hold by the same person, and the condition that if any partition takes place, then the crown of Spain should go to Charles Habsburg. Austria, of course, rejected it, starting the war in Italy, but the rest of Europe seemed to agree, as the equilibrium was not broken. But, could Louis XIV resist the temptation?;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285210A;We accept his will;;;;;;;;;;


# The will of Carlos II (Austrian version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by SPA 285210
	id = 179080
	random = no     
	country = HAB
	name = "EVENTNAME285210"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285210"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Reject
		name = "ACTIONAME179080A"
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -100 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 377 } # Luxembourg
		command = { type = addcore which = 378 } # Brabant
		command = { type = addcore which = 380 } # Flandern
		command = { type = addcore which = 389 } # Lombardia
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 120 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 120 }
	}
}

ACTIONAME179080A;We reject his will;;;;;;;;;;

# The will of Carlos II (French version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by SPA 285210
	id = 170052
	random = no     
	country = FRA
	name = "EVENTNAME285210"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285210"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Great
		name = "ACTIONAME285210A"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 100 }
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = DIP which = 2 value = 12 }
		command = { type = vassal which = SPA }
	}
}


# Louis XIV threatens the balance and claims Flandern #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 170053
	trigger = { 
		event = 285210 
	}
	random = no     
	country = FRA
	name = "EVENTNAME170053"
	desc = "EVENTHIST170053"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 7 month = september year = 1701 }
      
	action_a = { # State our claims
		name = "ACTIONAME170053A"
		command = { type = addcore which = 377 } # Luxembourg
		command = { type = addcore which = 378 } # Brabant
		command = { type = addcore which = 380 } # Flandern
		command = { type = trigger which = 186050 } # HOL Grand alliance
		command = { type = trigger which = 164015 } # ENG Grand alliance
		command = { type = trigger which = 125030 } # BAY Grand alliance
		command = { type = badboy value = 2 }
	}
	action_b = { # Respect the treaties
		name = "ACTIONAME17053B"
		command = { type = vp value = 5 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME170053;Louis XIV threatens the balance and claims Flandern;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST170053;Louis missjudged the uneasyness that the rest of Europe displayed for the French expansionism, and made several mistakes after the Spanish succession. He closed the Spanish-American commerce  to English and Dutch, he recognized James III Stuart as king of England, and he occupied the fortresses in Spanish Netherlands with French troops. In February, the French States had ratified the right of Philip of Anjou to the crown of France, violating the will of Carlos II. The maritime powers had the motive and the excuse, and Austria discovered that now she had allies for the war of Spanish succession.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME170053B;Respect the treaties;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME170053A;State our claims;;;;;;;;;;


# The Grand alliance (Spanish war of succession Netherlands version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by FRA 170053
	id = 186050
	random = no     
	country = HOL
	name = "EVENTNAME186050"
	desc = "EVENTHIST186050"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Sign pact
		name = "ACTIONAME186050A"
		command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 120 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 120 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 75 }
	}
	action_b ={ # Not our business
		name = "ACTIONNAME186050B"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = -25 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME186050;The Grand alliance;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST186050;For years Europe has been preparing for the death of childless Carlos II of Spain. He was related to several royal families in Europe, but after the death of the designated heir, Joseph Ferdinand Wittelbach of Bavaria, at the age of six, the royal houses of Austria and France had a similar claim. But both were too powerful, and the addition of the Spanish empire would make any of them unstopable, and so candidates not destined to their thrones, Philip of Anjou and Charles Habsburg, were discussed as heirs to Carlos, and several partition agreements were negotiated. That is precisely what everybody wanted to prevent in Spain. Despite the bigger influence from the Austracist party leaded by the mother of Carlos, there was an undisputable fact: France had 300,000 soldiers next to Spain and the Spanish Netherlands, and so represented the only opportunity, albeit small, to keep the empire together. A will was redacted and the agonizing Carlos signed it. It left the kingdom to Philip Anjou, but it contained two crucial clauses, the condition that the crowns of France and Spain should never be hold by the same person and that the Spanish possessions could not be divided. Austria, of course, rejected it, but the rest of Europe seemed to agree, as the equilibrium was not broken. But Louis missjudged the uneasyness that the rest of Europe displayed for the French expansionism, and made several mistakes after the Spanish succession. He closed the Spanish-American commerce to English and Dutch, he recognized James III Stuart as king of England, and he occupied the fortresses in Spanish Netherlands with French troops. In February, the French States had ratified the right of Philip of Anjou to the crown of France, violating the will of Carlos II. The maritime powers had the motive and the excuse, and Austria discovered that now she had allies for the war of Spanish succession.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME186050B;We don't care who inherits Spain;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME186050A;Support Habsburg succession to the Spanish throne;;;;;;;;;;


# The Grand alliance (Spanish war of succession English version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by FRA 170053
	id = 164015
	random = no     
	country = ENG
	name = "EVENTNAME164015"
	desc = "EVENTHIST164015"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Sign pact
		name = "ACTIONAME164015A"
		command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 120 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 120 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 75 }
	}
	action_b ={ # Not our business
		name = "ACTIONNAME164015B"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -25 }
	}
}


# The Grand alliance (Spanish war of succession Bavarian version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by FRA 170053
	id = 125030
	random = no     
	country = BAY
	name = "EVENTNAME125030"
	desc = "EVENTHIST125030"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Reject pact
		name = "ACTIONAME125030A"
		command = { type = casusbelli which = HAB value = 120 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 75 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -50 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = -25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -25 }
	}
	action_b ={ # Not our business
		name = "ACTIONNAME125030B"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -25 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 75 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 25 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME125030;The Grand alliance;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST125030;For years Europe has been preparing for the death of childless Carlos II of Spain. He was related to several royal families in Europe, but after the death of the designated heir, Joseph Ferdinand Wittelbach of Bavaria, at the age of six, the royal houses of Austria and France had a similar claim. But both were too powerful, and the addition of the Spanish empire would make any of them unstopable, and so candidates not destined to their thrones, Philip of Anjou and Charles Habsburg, were discussed as heirs to Carlos, and several partition agreements were negotiated. That is precisely what everybody wanted to prevent in Spain. A will was redacted and the agonizing Carlos signed it. It left the kingdom to Philip Anjou, but it contained two crucial clauses, the condition that the crowns of France and Spain should never be hold by the same person and that the Spanish possessions could not be divided. Austria, of course, rejected it, but the rest of Europe seemed to agree, as the equilibrium was not broken. But Louis missjudged the uneasyness that the rest of Europe displayed for the French expansionism, and made several mistakes after the Spanish succession. He closed the Spanish-American commerce to English and Dutch, he recognized James III Stuart as king of England, and he occupied the fortresses in Spanish Netherlands with French troops. In February, the French States had ratified the right of Philip of Anjou to the crown of France, violating the will of Carlos II. The maritime powers had the motive and the excuse, and Austria discovered that now she had allies for the war of Spanish succession. The only allies of France were the Wittelsbach: the electors of Bavaria, Cologne and Trier, and the Duke of Savoy. Maximilian II of Bavaria had been named governor of the Spanish Netherlands. The Bavarian participation in the war lasted until the battle of Blenheim in 1704, when she was knocked out of the war by a crushing defeat.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME125030B;We don't care who inherits Spain.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME125030A;Support Bourbon succession to the Spanish throne;;;;;;;;;;


# Charles proclaimed king of Spain in Viena #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 179081
	trigger = { 
		OR = { 
			event = 186050 # HOL Grand alliance
			event = 164015 # ENG Grand alliance
		}
	}
	random = no     
	country = HAB
	name = "EVENTNAME179081"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179081"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 13 month = september year = 1703 }
      
	action_a = { # OK
		name = "ACTIONAME179081A"
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -75 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME179081;Charles proclaimed king of Spain in Viena;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST179081;The formation of the Grand alliance and the start of the war made it possible for Charles Habsburg to push his bid for the Spanish crown. Although initially the Grand alliance did not seek to replace Felipe Bourbon as king of Spain, by 1703 England and the United Provinces (Netherlands) had decided that their commercial interests would be better protected by Habsburg rule. The issue was also important to win another ally, as Portugal was hesitant to enter a war unless on the side of the future king of Spain, her future neighbour. The Austrians on their part, were convinced that the invassion of Spain could only be achieved with the concurrence of English and Portuguese troops. Once the support of their allies was secured, Charles was proclaimed king of Spain by the imperial court in Viena in September 1703. This proclamation was important also for the supporters that Charles had in Spain, that could raise in arms in the hope of being on the winning side.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME179081A;State our claims;;;;;;;;;;


# Portugal joins Grand alliance (Spanish war of succession Portuguese version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 260031
	trigger = { 
		event = 186050 # HOL Grand alliance
		event = 164015 # ENG Grand alliance
	}
	random = no     
	country = POR
	name = "EVENTNAME260031"
	desc = "EVENTHIST260031"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 27 month = december year = 1703 }
      
	action_a = { # Sign pact
		name = "ACTIONAME260031A"
		command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 120 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 120 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 75 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 75 }
	}
	action_b ={ # Not our business
		name = "ACTIONNAME260031B"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -25 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = -25 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME260031;Portugal joins Grand alliance;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST260031;When Carlos II of Spain died childless, he tested in favour of Philip of Anjou, grandson of Louis XIV of France. Emperor Leopold I of Austria contested this will, but found little support. However, two years later, Louis expansionism had convinced England and the Netherlands to enter an alliance against France and Spain. Portugal had initial agreements with France, but in 1703, due to commercial interests and the possibility of expanding the borders of Brazil, and seeing the course of war turning in favor of the Grand alliance, Portugal signed the treaties of Methuen, entering the war on their side. Her participation was deemed very important, as it allowed the opening of the Western front in Spain to the invasion by Anglo-Portuguese troops.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME260031B;We don't care who inherits Spain;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME260031A;Support Habsburg succession to the Spanish throne;;;;;;;;;;


# Savoy joins Grand alliance (Spanish war of succession Savoyard version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 275020
	trigger = { 
		event = 186050 # HOL Grand alliance
		event = 164015 # ENG Grand alliance
	}
	random = no     
	country = SAV
	name = "EVENTNAME275020"
	desc = "EVENTHIST275020"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 1 month = february year = 1703 }
      
	action_a = { # Sign pact
		name = "ACTIONAME275020A"
		command = { type = addcore which = 397 } # Sardinia
		command = { type = casusbelli which = FRA value = 120 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 120 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 75 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 75 }
	}
	action_b ={ # Not our business
		name = "ACTIONNAME275020B"
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -75 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -25 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = -25 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME275020;Savoy joins Grand alliance;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST275020;When Carlos II of Spain died childless, he tested in favour of Philip of Anjou, grandson of Louis XIV of France. Emperor Leopold I of Austria contested this will, but found little support. However, two years later, Louis expansionism had convinced England and the Netherlands to enter an alliance against France and Spain. Savoy had initial agreements with France, but in 1703 the Grand Duke of Savoy decided to join the Grand alliance, and have a go at the Spanish possessions in Italy in hopes of securing a slice of Milan.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME275020B;We don't care who inherits Spain;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME275020A;Support Habsburg succession to the Spanish throne;;;;;;;;;;

Second phase: The Spanish civil war 1705-1711

Code:
# Charles conquers Catalonia #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285211
	trigger = { 
		event = 179081 # HAB Charles crowned king of Spain in Viena
		NOT = { exists = CAT }
		owned = { province = 429 data = -1 } # Catalonia	
	}
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285211"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285211"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 9 month = october year = 1705 }
      
	action_a = { # Damm
		name = "ACTIONAME285211A"
		command = { type = stability value = -1 }
		command = { type = independence which = CAT }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = CAT value = 108 }
		command = { type = revoltrisk which = 108 value = 4 }
		command = { type = desertion which = 429 value = 20000 } # Catalonia
		command = { type = desertion which = 427 value = 20000 } # Gerona
		command = { type = trigger which = 143000 } # CAT war of Spanish succession
	}
}

EVENTNAME285211;Charles conquers Catalonia;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285211;Felipe V was well accepted in all of Spain, and recognized as king by all the parliaments. However with the start of the war and the arrival of the French troops, and with the proclamation of Charles Habsburg as king in Viena, his supporters (Austracists), were ready to change sides. Although there were supporters for both monarchs in all regions of Spain, the disenchantment with the Habsburg rule and the admiration for the French centralized model was higher in the former kingdom of Castile, while in Catalonia, besides the opposite sentiment, there was a profound hatred for the French after the loss of the Rousillon and the bombardment of Barcelona by the French fleet a few years before. After the conquest of Barcelona by the English troops, and with the Archduke Charles in the city, most of Catalonia declared her support for him as king of Spain, and the parliament named him king of Spain on November 7, 1705. The European war of Spanish succession had just become a civil war.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285211A;Damm;;;;;;;;;;


# The parliament of Barcelona declares Charles king #
# by Fodoron
event = { 				# triggered by SPA 285211
	id = 143000
	random = no     
	country = CAT
	name = "EVENTNAME143000"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285211"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # A new king
		name = "ACTIONAME143000A"
		command = { type = breakvassal which = SPA }
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04198 } # Carles III
		command = { type = dynastic which = HAB }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 200 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -250 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 428 } # Navarra
		command = { type = addcore which = 430 } # Aragon
		command = { type = addcore which = 431 } # Cantabria
		command = { type = addcore which = 432 } # Asturias
		command = { type = addcore which = 433 } # Galicia
		command = { type = addcore which = 435 } # Leon
		command = { type = addcore which = 436 } # Castilla
		command = { type = addcore which = 437 } # Valencia
		command = { type = addcore which = 438 } # Murcia
		command = { type = addcore which = 439 } # Toledo
		command = { type = addcore which = 440 } # Estramadura
		command = { type = addcore which = 443 } # Andalusia
		command = { type = addcore which = 444 } # Granada
		command = { type = addcore which = 445 } # Gibraltar
		command = { type = addcore which = 817 } # Canarias
		command = { type = addcore which = 821 } # Baleares
		command = { type = war which = SPA }
		command = { type = stability value = -1 }
		command = { type = revoltrisk which = 108 value = 4 }
		command = { type = INF which = 429 value = 11000 } # Catalonia
		command = { type = CAV which = 429 value = 4000 } # Catalonia
		command = { type = INF which = 427 value = 11000 } # Gerona
		command = { type = CAV which = 427 value = 4000 } # Gerona
		command = { type = treasury value = 200 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 179084 } # HAB Charles declared king in Catalonia
		command = { type = trigger which = 285219 } # SPA Charles declared king in Valencia
	}
}

EVENTNAME143000;The parliament of Barcelona declares Charles king;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME143000A;A new king;;;;;;;;;;

# Charles declared king of Spain in Catalonia #
# by Fodoron
event = { 			# triggered by CAT 143000
	id = 179084
	random = no     
	country = HAB
	name = "EVENTNAME179084"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179084"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # ok
		name = "ACTIONAME179084A"
		command = { type = vassal which = CAT }
	}
}

EVENTNAME179084;Charles declared king of Spain in Catalonia;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST179084;Felipe V was well accepted in all of Spain, and recognized as king by all the parliaments. However with the start of the war and the arrival of the French troops, and with the proclamation of Charles Habsburg as king in Viena, his supporters (Austracists), were ready to change sides. Although there were supporters for both monarchs in all regions of Spain, the disenchantment with the Habsburg rule and the admiration for the French centralized model was higher in the former kingdom of Castile, while in Catalonia, besides the opposite sentiment, there was a profound hatred for the French after the loss of the Rousillon and the bombardment of Barcelona by the French fleet a few years before. After the conquest of Barcelona by the English troops, and with the Archduke Charles in the city, most of Catalonia declared her support for him as king of Spain, and the parliament named him king of Spain on November 7, 1705. The European war of Spanish succession had just become a civil war.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME179084A;Great;;;;;;;;;;



# The parliament of Valencia declares Charles king #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285219
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285211"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285211"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Damm
		name = "ACTIONAME285211A"
		command = { type = stability value = -1 }
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = CAT value = 437 } # Valencia
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = CAT value = 426 } # Roussillon if owned by Spain
	}
}

EVENTNAME285211;The parliament of Valencia declares Charles king;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285211;Charles had already obtained the support of many cities in Valencia on his trip towards Barcelona. Soon after, the parliament of Valencia declared him also the king.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285211A;Damm;;;;;;;;;;



# The loss of Aragon and Baleares #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285212
	trigger = { 
		event = 143000 # Catalonian war of Spanish succession
		OR = { 
			owned = { province = 430 data = -1 } # Aragon	
			owned = { province = 821 data = -1 } # Baleares	
		}
	}
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285212"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285212"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 29 month = june year = 1706 }
      
	action_a = { # Damm
		name = "ACTIONAME285212A"
		command = { type = desertion which = 821 value = 20000 } # Baleares
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = CAT value = 430 } # Aragon
		command = { type = secedeprovince which = CAT value = 821 } # Baleares
	}
}

EVENTNAME285212;The loss of Aragon and Baleares;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285212;The counterattack by Felipe on Barcelona had to be suspended when he run the risk of being caught between two fronts with the invasion of Extremadura by an Anglo-Portuguese expedition. Charles proceed from Barcelona with an Austro-English army reaching Madrid. At that point it seemed that he was going to win the war, and the parliaments of Aragon and Baleares declared him also king of Spain on June 29, 1706. However the support for Felipe was still strong in Castilla, Extremadura and Andalucia.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285212A;Damm;;;;;;;;;;


# Austracist victory in war of Spanish succession #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 143001
	trigger = { 
		event = 143000 # Catalonian war of Spanish succession
		countrysize = 10
	}
	random = no     
	country = CAT
	name = "EVENTNAME143001"
	desc = "EVENTHIST143001"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 9 month = october year = 1706 }
	offset = 100
	deathdate = { day = 17 month = april year = 1711 }

	action_a = { # Carles is king of Spain
		name = "ACTIONAME143001A"
		command = { type = stability value = 2 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 285213 } # SPA Habsburg triumph
	}
}

EVENTNAME143001;Austracist victory in war of Spanish succession;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST143001;A victory has been achieved by the Austracist party. Charles Habsburg has been accepted as king of Spain as Carlos III.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME143001A;We won the civil war;;;;;;;;;;


# Bourbonist defeat #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285213
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285213"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285213"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # A new dynasty
		name = "ACTIONAME285213A"
		command = { type = inherit which = CAT }
		command = { type = badboy value = -2 }
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 400 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = -100 }
		command = { type = breakvassal which = FRA }
		command = { type = dynastic which = HAB }
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04151 } # Carlos III
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04152 } # María Teresa
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04153 } # José I
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04154 } # Leopoldo I
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 04155 } # Fernando VI
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 04147 } # Fernando VI
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 04148 } # Carlos III
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 04149 } # Carlos IV
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 04150 } # Fernando VII
	}
}

EVENTNAME285213;Bourbonist defeat in war of Spanish succession;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285213;A victory has been achieved by the Austracist party. Charles Habsburg has been accepted as king of Spain as Carlos III. The Habsburgs will continue ruling Spain. Philippe de Anjou has left the kingdom and gone back to France, where he has been named Dauphin of France.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285213A;The Habsburg dynasty will continue ruling our country;;;;;;;;;;

Third phase: Towards a peace 1711-1713

Code:
# Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans (HAB version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 179082
	random = no     
	country = HAB
	name = "EVENTNAME179082"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179082"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 17 month = april year = 1711 }

	action_a = { # Mixed blessing
		name = "ACTIONAME179082A"
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = DIP which = -2 value = 24 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 285214 } # SPA Charles elected HRE
		command = { type = trigger which = 164016 } # ENG Charles elected HRE
		command = { type = trigger which = 186051 } # HOL Charles elected HRE
		command = { type = trigger which = 170054 } # FRA Charles elected HRE
	}
}

EVENTNAME179082;Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST179082;The war of Spanish succession seemed about to be won by the Grand alliance in 1709, with France completely defeated in all fronts. Only the war in Spain seemed favorable to the Bourbons, but Louis XIV was ready to abandon his grandson in exchange for peace. But the allies were frustrated by their inability to impose the Archduke on the Spaniards, and surprised by their stern resistance, and went too far in their conditions demanding that Louis should remove his own grandson from the throne of Spain by force. This was a humiliation too big to endure, and Louis understood that he was negotiating from a position of weakness and decided to break the negotiations and renew the fight. Time will prove him right, as dissensions were already dividing the allies as the French threat receded. The Dutch and the Austrians were already at odds over the Spanish Netherlands, and the Austrians were seeing as not doing their part, occupied with the Hungarian revolt. The turning point was the unexpected death of emperor Joseph I, at 33 years of age in April 1711. While Charles left Spain and went to Vienna to be elected emperor, the allies were not ready to reconstruct the empire of Charles V, and England immediately started peace negotiations with France without informing the Dutch or Austria.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME179082A;Our allies will abandon us;;;;;;;;;;


# Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans (SPA version) #
# by Fodoron
event = {  			# triggered by HAB 179082
	id = 285214
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME179082"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179082"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Great
		name = "ACTIONAME285214A"
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = DIP which = 2 value = 24 }
	}
}

ACTIONAME285214A;Our chance to win the war;;;;;;;;;;

# Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans (FRA version) #
# by Fodoron
event = {  			# triggered by HAB 179082
	id = 170054
	random = no     
	country = FRA
	name = "EVENTNAME179082"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179082"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Great
		name = "ACTIONAME170054A"
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = DIP which = 2 value = 24 }
	}
}

ACTIONAME170054A;Our chance for peace;;;;;;;;;;


# Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans (ENG version) #
# by Fodoron
event = {  			# triggered by HAB 179082
	id = 164016
	random = no     
	country = ENG
	name = "EVENTNAME179082"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179082"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Wait a moment
		name = "ACTIONAME164016A"
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -50 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 100 }
	}
}

ACTIONAME164016A;Let's look for a way out of this mess;;;;;;;;;;

# Charles VI elected Emperor of the Romans (HOL version) #
# by Fodoron
event = {  			# triggered by HAB 179082
	id = 186051
	random = no     
	country = HOL
	name = "EVENTNAME179082"
	desc = "EVENTHIST179082"
	style = 1 
      
	action_a = { # Wait a moment
		name = "ACTIONAME186051A"
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = -50 }
		command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 150 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = 100 }
	}
}

ACTIONAME186051A;Let's look for a way out of this mess;;;;;;;;;;


# The peace of Utrecht (SPA version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 285215
	random = no     
	country = SPA
	name = "EVENTNAME285215"
	desc = "EVENTHIST285215"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 13 month = july year = 1713 }

	action_a = { # Bummer
		name = "ACTIONAME285215A"
                command = { type = remove_countryculture which = italian }
		command = { type = removecore which = 377 } # Luxembourg
		command = { type = removecore which = 378 } # Brabant
		command = { type = removecore which = 380 } # Flandern
		command = { type = removecore which = 389 } # Lombardia
		command = { type = removecore which = 397 } # Sardinia
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = POR value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = SAV value = 25 }
		command = { type = stability value = 4 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME285215;The peace of Utrecht;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST285215;The Spanish war of succession was also slow to end. Since Spain and Austria had not settled the issue and it was impossible to reach an agreement between all participants, it was decided that separate peace treaties between the parties will end the war. This decision was very damaging to Spain, that was left with very little negotiating power once France left the war, and that was left at the hands of a foreign king whose main interest was to win the crown of Spain and had little interest in maintaining the Spanish possessions. The series of treaties receive the name of peace of Utrecht. Spain signed a treaty with England on July 13, ceding Gibraltar and Minorca, and a monopoly on slave trade for the next 30 years. The treaty with Savoy on August 13 ceded the island of Sicily, later exchanged by Sardinia with Austria, in exchange for the renounciation of Victor Amadeus II to any right to the crown of Spain. The peace treaty with the United provinces had to wait until June 26, 1714, and that with Portugal to February 1715, but both had little consequence. However the war against Austria, now favorable to Spain, continued with the reconquest of Sardinia in 1717 and an attack on Sicily in 1718, until a quadruple alliance was formed by France, England, Netherlands and Austria forcing Spain to accept the loss of Naples, Sicily, Sardinia and Parma at the treaty of the Hague on February 17, 1720 sealing the peace between Austria and Spain. At the peace of Utrecht, Felipe renounced as king of Spain to the crown of France, and Charles renounced to the crown of Spain. During the war of Polish succession, Felipe will finally be able to recover Naples and Sicily from Austria.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME285215A;The sun has set on the Spanish empire;;;;;;;;;;

# The peace of Utrecht (FRA version) #
# by Fodoron
event = { 
	id = 170055
	random = no     
	country = FRA
	name = "EVENTNAME170055"
	desc = "EVENTHIST170055"
	style = 1 
      
	date = { day = 11 month = april year = 1713 }

	action_a = { # Bummer
		name = "ACTIONAME170055A"
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = removecore which = 377 } # Luxembourg
		command = { type = removecore which = 378 } # Brabant
		command = { type = removecore which = 380 } # Flandern
		command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = ENG value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = POR value = 25 }
		command = { type = relation which = SAV value = 25 }
		command = { type = badboy value = -2 }
	}
}

EVENTNAME170055;The peace of Utrecht;;;;;;;;;;
EVENTHIST170055;The Spanish war of succession was also slow to end. Since Spain and Austria had not settled the issue and it was impossible to reach an agreement between all participants, it was decided that separate peace treaties between the parties will end the war. This decision, arranged between France and England, was favourable to France, who avoided the worst consequences of a lost war. By the treaty with England on April 11, 1713, Louis recognized the Hanover rule in England and confirmed the renunciation of Felipe’s claims to the French throne. Hudson Bay territory, Acadia, St. Kitts and Newfoundland were ceded, and the demolition the fortress of Dunkirk agreed. The same day France agreed that the United Provinces should annex part of Geldre, and will keep the Spanish Netherlands in deposit for Charles VI Habsburg. He also recognized the king of Prussia, and aknowledged the right of the Duke of Savoy to the kingdom of Sicily and to Nice. To Portugal, a small part of the Guiana was ceded. The peace with Charles VI will have to wait to the treaties of Rastatt (March 6, 1714) and Baden (September 7, 1714), aknowledging his right to the Spanish Netherlands, Milan, Naples and Sardinia, and restoring the right bank of the Rhine to the Empire. In Utrecht, France lost the hegemony of Europe, which passed to a system of equilibriums arbitered by England.;;;;;;;;;;
ACTIONAME170055A;A lost war;;;;;;;;;;

Fourth phase: End of Spanish civil war 1713-1715

Code:
This one doesn't fit I will post it a few posts below
 
Last edited:
In "Catalonian war of Spanish succession" there's a breakvassal directly followed by a vassal command. It's a good idea to test that this works. It dosn't work to have a an event with the vassal command triggered from the event with the breakvassal command. It takes some time for this to be registered. There are reasons to suspect that it will not work in the same event.
What if HOL, ENG and BAV are in totally different alliances than they were historically? Would they have acted in the same way, if they are allies to the opposite side. Also, we have to remember that if we manage to get FRA and HAB into war, they will drag their alliances with them, in addition to the historical alliances.
The events above can cause that ENG, due to lowered relations and CB attacks SPA on it's own, even if there is no HAB-FRA war. HAB and France are primus motors here and the participance of the other states came from their conflict, right? Their events could trigger first if there is a war between HAB and FRA. The relation hits for HAB with FRA and SPA could be more severe, to make a war even more likely. A tailored AI file, -200 and cores is probably needed to have any chance for armed conflict for this short period. Perhaps a breakalliance by HAB if they are allied to FRA or SPA?
 
Would it be a big difference if we made FRA170052 triggered directly from the first SPA event? The French player wont get any notification of his new vassal from the first event. I think FRA deservs some BB from this, the effect on it's neighbours are exactly the one you get from BB.
 
Norrefeldt said:
In "Catalonian war of Spanish succession" there's a breakvassal directly followed by a vassal command. It's a good idea to test that this works. It dosn't work to have a an event with the vassal command triggered from the event with the breakvassal command. It takes some time for this to be registered. There are reasons to suspect that it will not work in the same event.
Thanks Norrefeldt. I will look into it. A solution is that SPA breaks the vassalage in the same event where it creates CAT.

Norrefeldt said:
What if HOL, ENG and BAV are in totally different alliances than they were historically? Would they have acted in the same way, if they are allies to the opposite side. Also, we have to remember that if we manage to get FRA and HAB into war, they will drag their alliances with them, in addition to the historical alliances.
I am not very fond of speculating on what if's because I am bad at that. I am not too concerned if we only touch relations and cores. The danger was that the Spanish empire could be incorporated by any of the rising empires, FRA or HAB. FRA neighbors were prepared to fight FRA and HAB neighbors were prepared to fight HAB for survival reasons, but they were not willing to let the scales fall the opposite way. A partition of SPA was an acceptable solution, but a total independence of SPA (the 1700 solution) was even better. If we only touch relations and cores, each game alliance will check its chances and decide, and I am fine with that. I would predict that an AI war because of these events will rarely take place. On the other hand we will give a human played HAB a very good reason to start a war, and a human played FRA a not so good reason to start a war. This is very accurate historically. Given that there is no chance that SPA will be annexed, ENG and HOL have not a very good reason to start a war, but if human played it will be a good chance to pick at the Spanish empire with a casus belli and while SPA is distracted, although by 1700 what human player needs help?

Norrefeldt said:
The events above can cause that ENG, due to lowered relations and CB attacks SPA on it's own, even if there is no HAB-FRA war.
Good for her. Everybody wanted a piece of the Spanish empire. Why not? She will have to run a risk for that though a small one since SPA has been left without allies. After all Spain lost a lot at Utrecht. Spanish peninsular provinces will be returned by the AI in most cases.

Norrefeldt said:
HAB and France are primus motors here and the participance of the other states came from their conflict, right? Their events could trigger first if there is a war between HAB and FRA. The relation hits for HAB with FRA and SPA could be more severe, to make a war even more likely. A tailored AI file, -200 and cores is probably needed to have any chance for armed conflict for this short period. Perhaps a breakalliance by HAB if they are allied to FRA or SPA?
Trying to model wars is tricky business. I am fine with nations behaving in civilized ways and letting the AI run the show at its own pace. I don't mind a push, but I don't like to shovel. If FRA didn't loose much in the SWofS then I believe it is better if she doesn't fight at all, as the chances are she will take something from a neighbor. HAB won provinces from SPA so that would be a more desirable war for the mod. A breakalliance of HAB and SPA is a good idea, but it is my understanding that it will take place when SPA becomes a vassal of FRA. Regarding relations, I still have to add them from all events. Huge drops or boosts of relations are very upsetting for the game, as they can disrupt equilibriums of alliances that took the AI decades to reach. Due to dishonoring, only alliances with good relations become stable.
 
Norrefeldt said:
Would it be a big difference if we made FRA170052 triggered directly from the first SPA event? The French player wont get any notification of his new vassal from the first event. I think FRA deservs some BB from this, the effect on it's neighbours are exactly the one you get from BB.

I rather add a FRA event acknowledging the crowning of Felipe V, because everybody was fine and dandy for an entire year before Louis XIV started to play with his stick and the hornet's nest. Leopold was not ready to fight France and Spain without help.

No problem with adding some bb's to FRA for claiming Flanders, but the human player is not going to like it, and already the reasons for war are pretty weak for FRA (temporary cores). The possibility of annexing the Spanish empire was a good enough reason but we must rule that out. It was not one of Louis XIV brightest ideas.
 
Fodoron said:
I am not very fond of speculating on what if's because I am bad at that. I am not too concerned if we only touch relations and cores. The danger was that the Spanish empire could be incorporated by any of the rising empires, FRA or HAB. FRA neighbors were prepared to fight FRA and HAB neighbors were prepared to fight HAB for survival reasons, but they were not willing to let the scales fall the opposite way. A partition of SPA was an acceptable solution, but a total independence of SPA (the 1700 solution) was even better. If we only touch relations and cores, each game alliance will check its chances and decide, and I am fine with that.
OK, that's acceptable. I wasn't trying to explore the what-if's to much, rather removing all the events for the group of third party events, since in any given EU2 game they might be different ones, depending on the alliances. Added BB to France would then do the job of hurting them. But I understand now that all of those had so good reasons to fear the situation that they deserve their own events.

Fodoron said:
I would predict that an AI war because of these events will rarely take place. On the other hand we will give a human played HAB a very good reason to start a war, and a human played FRA a not so good reason to start a war. This is very accurate historically. Given that there is no chance that SPA will be annexed, ENG and HOL have not a very good reason to start a war, but if human played it will be a good chance to pick at the Spanish empire with a casus belli and while SPA is distracted, although by 1700 what human player needs help?
I think we should make a HAB-FRA war a real possibility, without disrupting the game too much. The only thing needed besides what you have done is an Habsburg AI file. Then it's up to the game engine to decide whether HAB wants to start a war. We should leave the ultimate decision to the game.

Fodoron said:
A breakalliance of HAB and SPA is a good idea, but it is my understanding that it will take place when SPA becomes a vassal of FRA.
True. I forgot that.

Fodoron said:
Regarding relations, I still have to add them from all events. Huge drops or boosts of relations are very upsetting for the game, as they can disrupt equilibriums of alliances that took the AI decades to reach. Due to dishonoring, only alliances with good relations become stable.
OK, and that's fine tuning anyhow. As long as there are two options in the events for HOL/SAV/ENG/BAV I only think those events should change relations with FRA/HAB/SPA. The chances that anyone of the other took option_b isn't negliable, and then the relation change ought to be the opposite.

Fodoron said:
I rather add a FRA event acknowledging the crowning of Felipe V, because everybody was fine and dandy for an entire year before Louis XIV started to play with his stick and the hornet's nest. Leopold was not ready to fight France and Spain without help.

No problem with adding some bb's to FRA for claiming Flanders, but the human player is not going to like it, and already the reasons for war are pretty weak for FRA (temporary cores). The possibility of annexing the Spanish empire was a good enough reason but we must rule that out. It was not one of Louis XIV brightest ideas.
OK, I just wanted to keep the number of events down (perhaps by an event in betwen), but it's of secondary importance. Considering the low chance for conflict, I don't think it would be upsetting if a conflict actually started half a year too early.
BB could be removed by end of the war, if France have backed down. Also fine tuning.

The Wikipedia suggests that tensions were mounting rather fast, even if they became really bad after William II died.
The new King, Philip V, was declared ruler of the entire Spanish empire, contrary to the provisions of the Second Partition Treaty. William III of England, however, could not declare war against France, since he did not have the support of the elites who determined policy in both England and the United Provinces. He reluctantly recognised Philip as King in April 1701.

Louis, however, took too aggressive a path in his attempt to secure French hegemony in Europe. He cut off England and the Netherlands from Spanish trade, thereby seriously threatening the commercial interests of those two countries. William III secured the support of his subjects and negotiated the Treaty of the Hague with the United Provinces and Austria. The agreement, reached in September 1701, recognised Philip V as King of Spain, but allotted Austria that which it desired most: the Spanish territories in Italy, forcing it to accept as well the Spanish Netherlands, thus protecting that crucial region from French control. England and the Netherlands, meanwhile, were to retain their commercial rights in Spain.
A few days after the signing of the treaty, the former King of England, James II (who had been deposed by William III in 1688) died in France. Although Louis had treated William as King of England since the Treaty of Ryswick, he now recognized James II's son, James Francis Edward Stuart (the "Old Pretender"), as the rightful monarch. Louis's action alienated the English public even further, and gave William grounds for war.
 
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Norrefeldt said:
As long as there are two options in the events for HOL/SAV/ENG/BAV I only think those events should change relations with FRA/HAB/SPA. The chances that anyone of the other took option_b isn't negliable, and then the relation change ought to be the opposite.

I can tweak the amounts so if ENG choses A, and HOL choses B, the final result is a small drop of relations, as if one is being friendly and the other is not. It is sort of nice to see by the effects of the event who are your friends and who your enemies. However then we assume that the possibility of both choosing B and suffering a big fall while on the same side is small enough to be ignored (0.25%).

EDIT: Regarding the wikipedia article, it is written from an english perspective, but it is very correct. Louis XIV was overconfident that he had won and started to act as the ruler of both kingdoms. In Spanish history books the issue of the English king is hardly mentioned, and the occupation of the Spanish fortresses in the Spanish Netherlands by French troops made the Dutch real nervous and triggered the war. Each country had their own issues but they all played down to the same thing. The absortion of the Spanish Empire by France was unacceptable, and given that it was forbidden explicitly in Carlos II will, it invalidated the succession, so England and Netherlands supported the Habsburg candidated who was then crowned in Viena in 1703.
 
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Fodoron said:
I can tweak the amounts so if ENG choses A, and HOL choses B, the final result is a small drop of relations, as if one is being friendly and the other is not. It is sort of nice to see by the effects of the event who are your friends and who your enemies. However then we assume that the possibility of both choosing B and suffering a big fall while on the same side is small enough to be ignored (0.25%).
That sounds fine. The small remaning risk can be ignored, even if it might turn out strange in MP.

In the first page there's a lot of support for including alternative history. One way to open up to ahistorical paths would be to let the start be fixed, as you have suggested, but let Savoy, Austria and Bavaria have victory events of some sorts. The chances that they would trigger are nil unless player controlled of course. Their different claims could be presented in their first events.

Also, if France should win the war, or there is no war, I don't think we should break the vassalisation of SPA to FRA by event, by some later conflict that might never occur in-game. Overlapping cores (and BB if France get them and doesn't lose them) ought to make sure it's hard to keep SPA as vassal. If we set a fixed end for the vassalage, we remove the historical incentive for France to try to fight for it's claims.
 
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