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unmerged(40707)

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This is what I had in mind, but I wasn't sure. But vassal status is only a problem with the name of the events and actionname of TUR event. All commands could apply. Couldn't we try to break the most plausible vasselages instead?

Name of the events could be "Protection of the Grand Sultan over Al-Djazaïr" and it will cover remaining possible vasselage.

INF command in TUR event can only happen if OE owns the province.

At least trigger of ALD_3651 should be changed to:
Code:
	trigger = {
		exists = TUR
		[COLOR=Yellow]NOT = {
			vassal = { country = ALD country = TUR }
		}[/COLOR]
	}
I never saw it but we never know...
 

unmerged(40707)

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I understand Turkish pirate kills the Pasha before asking protection. Can't we say it is a rebellion against the current overlord if not OE but usual suspect? And if Algiers is already vassal of OE, the sequence ends in back to previous political situation with Barbarossa just succeeding in taking power in Algiers.

But I agree it is easier to avoid the whole sequence if Algiers is the vassal of the usual suspects. In some very unusual situations, vassalization command will not work anyway (player involved?). Better enhance texts and use Protection instead of Vassalization for such situations.
 

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Garbon said:
Second part.
Reworked event:
Code:
#(1525-1554) The Ottoman [COLOR=Red]Vassalization[/COLOR][COLOR=Yellow]protection[/COLOR] of Al-Djazaïr
event = {
	id = 3651
	trigger = {
		exists = TUR
		[COLOR=Yellow]NOT = {
			vassal = { country = XHO country = ALD }
			vassal = { country = TUN country = ALD }
			vassal = { country = MOR country = ALD }
		}
		NOT = {
			vassal = { country = ALD country = TUR }
		}[/COLOR]
	}
	random = no
	country = ALD
	name = "EVENTNAME3651" #The Ottoman [COLOR=Red]Vassalization[/COLOR][COLOR=Yellow]protection[/COLOR] of Al-Djazaïr
	desc = "EVENTHIST3651"
	#-#

	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1525 }
	offset = 30
	deathdate = { day = 29 month = december year = 1554 }

	action_a = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3651A" #Accept the protection of the Grand Sultan
		command = { type = trigger which = 3372 } #TUR: The Ottoman [COLOR=Red]Vassalization[/COLOR][COLOR=Yellow]protection[/COLOR] of Al-Djazaïr
		command = { type = dynastic which = TUR }
		command = { type = treasury value = 200 }
		command = { type = relation which = TUR value = 100 }
		command = { type = relation which = XHO value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = TUN value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = SPA value = -100 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = TUN value = 24 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = XHO value = 24 }
		command = { type = casusbelli which = SPA value = 24 }
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3651B" #Decline the Sultan's offer
		command = { type = relation which = TUR value = -100 }
		command = { type = galleys which = -1 value = 15 }
		command = { type = transports which = -1 value = 5 }
		command = { type = stability value = -2 }
	}
}
#-#A Turkish pirate of name Aruj, took over Al-Djazaîr in 1516 when he defeated the Spaniards. He then killed the local pasha and proclaimed himself pasha. He was known as Baba Aruj, or father Aruj. This was translated by the Spaniards as Barbarroja (Barbarossa in Italian, or Red beard). He was driven out of Tlemcen by the Spaniards and killed in 1518. However his brother, Khayr ad-Din Barbarossa, succeeded him. He sought protection from the Ottoman Empire and was appointed beylerbey. Driven out in 1520 by the Hafsids, he returned in 1525, massacring Arabs and Kabyles who resisted him. Under his rule Al-Djazaîr accepted the overlordship of the Ottoman Empire and continued the fight against the Spaniards, the Hafsids of Tunis and the Zayyanids of Tlemcen.
 

Garbon

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Mats_SX said:
Perhaps you should add Spain/Castile and/or Portugal also...?

I don't know. In those cases, I can see calling on the Ottomans for protection as after all, any such vassalages will have been force vassalages (or granted independence) and I can't really see Algiers being happy with Christian overlords.
 

Toio

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I think its time to look at the ottomans alliances from 1419 as we did for france and the HYW

on reading, the late medieval balkans by john Fine., i noticed that the TUR had many alliances, these alliances where vassals. So in the eyes of TUR, they where in alliance with
WAL
SER
BOS
ALB
KAR
TEK
CAN

the TUR mentality being if you are my vassal then you must support me with your troops.

In our game, I have tested the following setup
alliance (TUR WAL BOS ALB SER KAR)
(TEK CAN )
by 1427, the alliance is only (TUR ALB KAR )

this seems the best setup

On KAR, i do not know why it is a vassal of MAM, when MAM kept invading konya and destroying property .... I feel the KAR vassal should be with TUR

Note: I only briefly know the area , so if a modder has better advice , let us know.
 

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i do not understand karaman national provinces

here is what they have at present
# The Karaman Empire #

country = {
tag = KAR
ai = "SmallTrade0.ai"
colonialattempts = 0
colonialnation = no
major = no
colonists = 0
cancelledloans = 0
extendedloans = 0
treasury = 100
inflation = 0
merchants = 0.083333
religion = { type = sunni }
culture = {
type = turkish
xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
}
ownedprovinces = {
482 1611
}
controlledprovinces = {
482 1611
}
nationalprovinces = {
476 477 482 1611 1610
}


form what I read , they should have only


}
nationalprovinces = {
476 477 482 1611 1610 483
}
 
Last edited:

Toio

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Garbon said:
Karaman gets cores on Anatolia per claims as descendants from the Seljuk Turks. They weren't particularly successful at expansion in our period, but I think the cores do make sense. In the past, they'd been a strong rival to the Ottomans.

hmm, literature has them as different races, friendly until 1261...

should adana be a national core for KAR as well as at start of GC a vassal of TUR and not a vassal of MAM ?
 

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Toio said:
should adana be a national core for KAR as well as at start of GC a vassal of TUR and not a vassal of MAM ?

No, if Karaman has a core on Adana, it makes a beeline to take out Ramazan, first thing. With regards to vassalage as far as I know, right before game start the Mamluks successfully vassalized Karaman. That vassalage is actually a fairly recent change (a few version back or so).
 

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Garbon said:
Karaman gets cores on Anatolia per claims as descendants from the Seljuk Turks. They weren't particularly successful at expansion in our period, but I think the cores do make sense. In the past, they'd been a strong rival to the Ottomans.
I understand now why there is a difference for Karaman as a revolter:
Code:
KAR = { #Karaman
	no = TUR
	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1419 }
	expirydate = { day = 29 month = december year = 1550 }
	minimum = { 1611 482 }
	extra = { }
	capital = 1611
	group = muslim
	culture = turkish
	ai = "SmallTrade0.ai"
}
Garbon said:
No, if Karaman has a core on Adana, it makes a beeline to take out Ramazan, first thing. With regards to vassalage as far as I know, right before game start the Mamluks successfully vassalized Karaman. That vassalage is actually a fairly recent change (a few version back or so).
I don't remember exactly but I don't think it is so recent.

I agree, Adana as core for Karaman could end with unwanted conquest of Ramazan.
 
Last edited:

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Garbon said:
No, if Karaman has a core on Adana, it makes a beeline to take out Ramazan, first thing. With regards to vassalage as far as I know, right before game start the Mamluks successfully vassalized Karaman. That vassalage is actually a fairly recent change (a few version back or so).

and what about the alliance setup for TUR?

they are usually left with either nobody or only ALB by the time they take to do anything after the ghazi acquisitions

I think CAN should go with TEK

and KAR with TUR with a better relation improvemnent
 

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Toio said:
and what about the alliance setup for TUR?

they are usually left with either nobody or only ALB by the time they take to do anything after the ghazi acquisitions

I think CAN should go with TEK

and KAR with TUR with a better relation improvemnent

I don't think so. Karaman's history in the 15th century is a history of fighting the Ottomans.
 

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I'll post Crimea stuff here, as I fail to find a better thread.

Code:
#(1466-1700) Crimean Khanate seeks Ottoman support
event = {
	id = 152060
	trigger = {
		OR = {
			AND = {
				neighbour = RUS
				exists = TUR
			}
			AND = {
				neighbour = TUR
				OR = {
					exists = RUS
					exists = MOS
				}
			}
		}
		NOT = { countrysize = 5 }
		NOT = { vassal = { country = TUR country = CRI } }
		NOT = { vassal = { country = CRI country = TUR } }
                [COLOR=Yellow]NOT = { war = { country = CRI country = TUR } }[/COLOR]
	}
	random = no
	country = CRI
	name = "EVENTNAME152060" #Crimean Khanate seeks Ottoman support
	desc = "EVENTHIST152060"
#-#While Russia managed to overtake the other Khanates of the European steppe in the 16th century, the Khanate of Crimea lasted well into the 1700s. A major reason for this longevity was the support of the Ottoman Empire.

Code:
date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1466 }
	offset = 500
	deathdate = { day = 1 month = january year = 1700 }

	action_a = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME152060A" #Offer our vassalage to the Ottomans
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = diplomats value = -1 }
		command = { type = relation which = TUR value = 50 }
		command = { type = trigger which = 301050 } #TUR: Crimean Khanate seeks Ottoman support
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME152060B" #We can stand on our own
		command = { type = stability value = -1 }
	}
}

Seems odd when Crimea becomes Ottoman vassal, in the middle of a fierce war between the both.