• Victoria 3 - Sign up now!

    The journey begins, sign up now and get a special in-game item when the game is released.


  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning
  • Crusader Kings II Expansion Subscription

    Subscribe to the CK II Expansion and enjoy unlimited access to 13 major expansions and more!


Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Well, heck, if we'll make an event out of it, shall we add a condition where it depends on whether or not the Kara Koyunlu still exist? I doubt the Qubt Shahs would have migrated to the Bahmanid Empire if they could still hold the same amount of power back home. That's not something I'd push for without further careful reading, but it's certainly the impression I got.

I will push ever so slightly on the Hyderbad turning Telugu though. I haven't come across anything to suggest it has been connected with Marathi culture as of yet, but plenty which suggests that it was one of the heartlands of Telugu culture. :D

So, yeah, add the event, change the province culture, change the nation's culture and we should be a step closer to making a better situation for the Deccan. Too bad we still have a long way to go! :)
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.748
188
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
ThanatosHelen said:
Well, heck, if we'll make an event out of it, shall we add a condition where it depends on whether or not the Kara Koyunlu still exist? I doubt the Qubt Shahs would have migrated to the Bahmanid Empire if they could still hold the same amount of power back home. That's not something I'd push for without further careful reading, but it's certainly the impression I got.

I'd opt not to have this change. After all, we can always just say that Quli Qutb Shah was exiled from the Kara Koyunlu.

Oh and to the rest, sounds good. Although just to further clarify, the province was probably Marathi as it includes Bidar which was more important early on and had a marathi population (/used marathi as one of its languages when it became a breakaway state).
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Sound all well and good to me.

I'll have to take your word on the cultural status of Bidar, but if that is indeed the case, isn't it possible to just have Maharashtra (marathi province) include Bidar, rather than Hyderbad, given that currently it's on the far eastern border of the latter? It may be a little over-simplifying for history's sake, but it sounds like a reasonable approach to adopt until the new map comes out (which I see has Golconda and Bidar as separate). :)
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.748
188
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
Oh, I mean, I think we can still switch the culture to Telugu. I was just pointing out the likely reasoning. And no, we can't move Bidar as then that would move the Bahmani capital (Bidar in 1425) which would mess with subsequent events as Ahmadnagar in Maharashtra should break away from the Bahmanid Empire before the empire collapses. (currently the Bahmanid Empire transitions into Golconda, one of the later successor states).
 

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
ThanatosHelen said:
I know India often comes out to be an awful mess no matter what, but to edge it slightly towards a more historical path - Golconda should be Shi'ite, whether it's revolting or if it's coming out of the Bahmanid Empire by event.

Why does it feel like I'm always asking for things to become Shi'ite? :)

Don't know what you guys think we should do with their culture though. The rulers were Turkish, but spoke Telugu and Urdu. My suggestion would be to give them Telugu and Hindi culture, and not Marathi. Also, from what I've read, Hyderabad should be a Telugu province, not Marathi.

Besides... Though the dynasty might be a Turkish one, the general upper class wasn't neccessarily (I think).
About submission #1086, event is not made yet. How can you submit it? ;)
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
YodaMaster said:
About submission #1086, event is not made yet. How can you submit it? ;)
:eek:o

Well, at least I can submit the culture changes to the province and revolter! :)

As for the event mishap, I'll see if I can fix that up right now. If history is followed, and Golconda emerges from the Bahmani Sultanate, then Golconda should be Shi'ite. So my proposal is that we just ammend the Bahmanid event which makes them Golconda. The event already takes care of the culture change, but even revolters should have Telugu and not Mahrathi cultures.

Also, I think I found a bug anyway... There should be no reason that having less than 30 provinces will prevent the Golconda Sultanate from attaining meaningful independence.

Also, made a couple of historical description corrections, and changed the date to 1518. The exact date as to when the Bahmanid Sultanate became completely insignificant can be debated, so I chose the earlier date (1518) which I found from my sources.

Code:
#(15[COLOR=Yellow]18[/COLOR][COLOR=Red]26[/COLOR]) The End of the Bahmanid Empire
event = {
	id = 30346
	trigger = {
		NOT = { exists = HYD }
		[COLOR=Red]countrysize = 30[/COLOR]
	}
	random = no
	country = THE
	name = "EVENTNAME30346" #Death of the last ruler
	desc = "EVENTHIST30346"
	#-#
	
	date = { day = 1 month = december year = 15[COLOR=Yellow]18[/COLOR][COLOR=Red]26[/COLOR] }
	offset = 10
	deathdate = { day = 29 month = december year = 15[COLOR=Yellow]18[/COLOR][COLOR=Red]26[/COLOR] }

	action_a = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME30346A" #Rule from Golconda
		command = { type = flagname which = "" }
		command = { type = country which = HYD }
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = centralization value = 1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = land value = 1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = quality value = 1 }
		command = { type = infra value = 250 }
		command = { type = remove_countryculture which = marathi }
		[COLOR=Yellow]command = { type = religion which = shiite }[/COLOR]
	}
}
#-#After the death of Shams ud-Din Muhammad, Bahmani Sultanate quickly fell into chaos and disintegrated into 3 smaller states. The last 3 sultans were kept in prison, and their Kwajas ruled for them. After Kalim ul-Lah went in exile and died disaffected, and his son disappeared on his way to Mekkah, the Bahmani dynasty came to an end.
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.748
188
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
Actually that isn't a bug (the size condition). If the Bahmanid Empire is large enough, it makes no sense having an event that declares the end of the empire. Golconda would be but an insignificant speck in such a condition. Basically that condition is to prevent a successful player (as the AI will rarely manage 30 provinces) from being told that his empire is collapsing.
 

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
ThanatosHelen said:
Well, at least I can submit the culture changes to the province and revolter! :)
Better wait for the event and I agree with Garbon: countrysize condition is needed.

About the date, we could keep 1526 as deathdate. Only problem now is there is no ruler for Golconda between 1518 and 1526 in monarchs.hyd. Or should Quli Qutb Shah's startdate be moved from 1526 to 1518? Does it make sense?

EDIT: and does it make sense for Golconda to be able to revolt before (date is 1419 in revolt.txt)?
 
Last edited:

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Garbon said:
Actually that isn't a bug (the size condition). If the Bahmanid Empire is large enough, it makes no sense having an event that declares the end of the empire. Golconda would be but an insignificant speck in such a condition. Basically that condition is to prevent a successful player (as the AI will rarely manage 30 provinces) from being told that his empire is collapsing.

Actually, that's exactly what I figured you were doing and thus it is a bug, guys. You'd want that to be NOT over 30 provinces for Golconda to secede. :D

Anyhow, the problem with that train of thought (and this, again, is separate from the submission made) is that so would the other two sultanates - if a player reach such a size... Forcing secession in some cases and not others is a bit... well... gamey.
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
YodaMaster said:
Better wait for the event and I agree with Garbon: countrysize condition is needed.

About the date, we could keep 1526 as deathdate. Only problem now is there is no ruler for Golconda between 1518 and 1526 in monarchs.hyd. Or should Quli Qutb Shah's startdate be moved from 1526 to 1518? Does it make sense?

EDIT: and does it make sense for Golconda to be able to revolt before (date is 1419 in revolt.txt)?
Yes, Quli Qubt Shah's startdate should absolutely be moved, and it makes perfect sense - given that 1518 is when he gained control of Golconda in the first place.

As for Golconda being able to revolt before... er... Yes, but I can't see the Qubt Shah's ever becoming monarchs if Golconda emerged an independent power before the disintegration of the sultanate. This sort of creates continuity issues. For simplicity's sake, I'd say give the Golconda revolters the same start date as Ahmadnagar (1488) to roughly correspond with the Bahmanids decline. Maybe we could come up with something more intricate later on. Also, we should probably to the same to Bijapur.
 

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
ThanatosHelen said:
Actually, that's exactly what I figured you were doing and thus it is a bug, guys. You'd want that to be NOT over 30 provinces for Golconda to secede. :D
Yes. There is a bug but removing the condition was not the solution.
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Ah, no sense of play...

Still, I do think the corrected trigger should be removed for the reason I stated. Or we could add the same trigger to the other two states...
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.748
188
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
ThanatosHelen said:
Anyhow, the problem with that train of thought (and this, again, is separate from the submission made) is that so would the other two sultanates - if a player reach such a size... Forcing secession in some cases and not others is a bit... well... gamey.

The difference is location and timing. Golconda is in the same province as the Bahmani capital.

Also, I'm not sure why the date should be moved to 1518, just because that is what you found in your sources.

Good catch on the trigger even if you didn't actually fix the bug. :p
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
Garbon said:
Good catch on the trigger even if you didn't actually fix the bug. :p
Oi! :p

Okay, as for the other stuff - this is a problem with the vanilla map's representation of the Deccan. You can't really say: Golconda is "closer" to the capital of the Bahmanids, and that is the reason why Golconda can't possibly secede while the other two can. The event actually rewards players for the most part... 30 provinces is a huge number for the Indian states. By the same logic, the other two shouldn't be able to secede either. My suggestion for the breakup of the Bahmani state is that we first assume history follows the right course, and then in future add more thoughtful conditions should the game/player achieve something other than what happened, based on what we and other testers experience and observe.

As for why the date should be moved "just because" I found that date in my sources, I'm not sure why that notion is confusing... :confused:

The advantage is that you wouldn't have an indepedent but weakened Bahmanid state act aggressively when it shouldn't, or be conquered by Vijayangar even though a more important power (Golconda) now exists in that region.

Hope that explains... something.
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.748
188
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • Crusader Kings III
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
Actually the logic makes total sense. Golconda's capital is the same province as the Bahmanid capital. The other two states can try to break away without really effecting the Bahmanid player (just re-annex). Golconda is a different story as that forces a tag change. This won't be necessary on the new map, but we aren't there ye.
 

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
Let's summarize:
bugfix for countrysize in THE_30346 + shiite command
Hyderabad: Telugu province, not Marathi.
Golconda (HYD): Telugu culture, and not Marathi.

Not settled:
1518 for THE_30346 (and deathdate still in 1526)
date of Golconda as revolter: 1488? Anyway, no recorded monarch before 1518/1526...
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
YodaMaster said:
Let's summarize:
bugfix for countrysize in THE_30346 + shiite command
Hyderabad: Telugu province, not Marathi.
Golconda (HYD): Telugu culture, and not Marathi.
Perfect!

For the other stuff... It's logical in terms of the game, but not in terms of history. You're right that this won't be a problem when the new map comes out, but that just might not be for a very long time so we should do what we can now. That's why I think we should do away with that trigger altogether. It'd just be the Qubt Shahs seizing power from an increasingly unpopular dynasty, a dynastic shift. That trigger really will only affect players, and not having it will reward them anyway.

As for there being no ruler of Golconda for 1518, we do: here.
 

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
What I read is:
He conquered Golconda and became the Governor of Telangana region in 1518, after the disintegration of the Bahmani Kingdom into the five Deccan sultanates. Soon after, he declared independence from the Bahmani Sultanate, took the title Qutub Shah, and thus established Qutb Shahi dynasty of Golconda.

How many years do "soon after" represent?

But if you follow the link for the Deccan sultanates, Golconda appears in 1512. :confused:
 

Saldunz

First Lieutenant
63 Badges
Apr 15, 2007
202
0
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Tyranny: Archon Edition
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Pillars of Eternity
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Knights of Honor
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Surviving Mars
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Age of Wonders III
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Stellaris: Necroids
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Cities: Skylines
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Mount & Blade: With Fire and Sword
It's totally messed up, I agree. So I suggested 1518, because that is the date that the first of the Qutb Shahs obtains any kind of power in Golconda (i.e. the earliest it can be independent). I say 1518 is better than 1512 (I've found non-wiki sources that have both dates for some reason too) because from what I've read, Mahmud Shah was a half-able ruler, as opposed to those who succeeded him who weren't even that.

And really, what purpose does a prolonged Bahmanid state serve? After the death of Mahmud Shah (in 1518), every Bahmani sultan ends up being caught up in very internal affairs. The state is so decentralized at this point due to court affairs that it shouldn't even be capable of doing anything at all in game-terms.

I guess I just don't consider Ahmad Shah IV and his descendents that important on a worldwide stage, whereas those who came before him were, as were the Qutb Shahs and the other breakaways. If you end up getting a different impression from your readings, let me know.
 
Last edited:

unmerged(40707)

Just call me Yoda in private!
Mar 1, 2005
20.187
2
Garbon said:
Also, I'm not sure why the date should be moved to 1518, just because that is what you found in your sources.
What about the date then, 1518 or 1526?