• Crusader Kings II Expansion Subscription

    Subscribe to the CK II Expansion and enjoy unlimited access to 13 major expansions and more!


  • Paradox Space Exploration Sale has arrived! Up to 75% off

    How's the space on your hard drive? Paradox wants to challenge your galaxy brain with a great selection of space exploration games - and they're all on sale for some very down-to-earth prices! The sale runs from May 4th until May 10th at 17:00 CEST / 08:00 PDT.


    May 4th - May 10th
  • Crusader Kings III Available Now!

    The realm rejoices as Paradox Interactive announces the launch of Crusader Kings III, the latest entry in the publisher’s grand strategy role-playing game franchise. Advisors may now jockey for positions of influence and adversaries should save their schemes for another day, because on this day Crusader Kings III can be purchased on Steam, the Paradox Store, and other major online retailers.


    Real Strategy Requires Cunning

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Just checking Granadas events... there is an event which triggers if Granada is at war with Castile before 1510, which gives them a whole bunch of Iberian cores... does this really make any sense? As it is now a player should try to provoke war with Castile as soon as possible to get those cores, and that hardly makes any sense...

There should be an option for becoming a new Caliphate of Cordoba and gaining cores on the old muslem possestions, but there should be some additional triggers so that they only get them once they have managed to make their position a bit more secure. Unless something unhistorical happens (like the Player...) they should be far to busy just trying to stay alive to bother with reclaiming Iberia. Maybe they have to own Toledo, Andalusia and/or just be of a certain size?
 

unmerged(6159)

Field Marshal
Oct 23, 2001
9.458
0
Visit site
They used to start with those cores, which meant that they had a CB on Castille which caused relations to be bad, which caused them to get annexed long before 1492.

When do you think they should get those cores?
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
OK, how about this, the original EEP event from eep_gra.txt, with some new triggers and basic effects (no flavour text yet, though):

Code:
event = { 
	id = 176000
	trigger = {
		owned   = { province = 439 data = -1 }
		owned   = { province = 444 data = -1 }
		owned   = { province = 445 data = -1 }
		OR = {
			AND = {
			owned   = { province = 443 data = -1 }
			owned   = { province = 440 data = -1 }
			}
			AND = {
			owned   = { province = 438 data = -1 }
			owned   = { province = 437 data = -1 }
			}
			AND = {
			owned   = { province = 443 data = -1 }
			owned   = { province = 438 data = -1 }
			}
		}
	}	
	random = no 
	country = GRA 
	name = "The Caliphate of Cordoba is Reborn!"
	desc = "Hum, a new text is needed."
	style = 1 
	date = { day = 1 month = january year = 1419 } 
	deathdate = { day = 1 month = january year = 1510 }
	action_a = { 
		name = "The caliphate is reborn!"
		command = { type = capital which = 439 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 437 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 438 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 439 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 440 }
		command = { type = addcore which = 443 }
		} 
	action_b = { 
		name = "No, let us remain Granada"

		} 
}

Well, this is the raw bones of my idea of a "Caliphate reborn" type event. Granada has to own its two starting provinces (Gibraltar and Granada), and Toledo (I put Cordoba in Toledo. Maybe it should be in Andalusia instead?) and then either Andalusia and Estramudera, or Murcia and Valenica, or Andalusia and Murcia. In any case they would be a five-province nation with a powerbase against the christians and could start thinking about reasserting their ancient claims.

Of course, many additional things could be added for flavour. The Caliphate of Cordoba could start a very religiously coloured movement to reconquer and re-muslimify Iberia, with province conversions, religions revolts by the christians, and some events for Castile, Portugal and Aragon to unite and fight back the resurgent muslim threat, etcetera... Much possible fantasy fun.

The second route would represent a less religious path, were Granada would try to seek long term reconsiliation with the christians, or at least not seek to reconquer and convert them all. Perhaps even a possible conversion to catholic, coupled with gaining Iberian culture (which I doubt they should start with...) and maybe losing arabic?

There are many possibilities for future Granadan fantasy events, but even if we limit it to just one, I think the above triggers make more sense. But feel free to comment!
 

Archaalen

Colonel
37 Badges
Mar 19, 2003
1.135
0
Visit site
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Sengoku
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Victoria 2
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Rome Gold
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Ancient Space
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
Excellent, anti-strunt. I love it. Personally, I think the capital should be in Andalusia. Especially with a CoT, that becomes the most valuable province the Caliphate could have in Iberia, especially since it's already Muslim.
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Originally posted by Archaalen
Excellent, anti-strunt. I love it. Personally, I think the capital should be in Andalusia. Especially with a CoT, that becomes the most valuable province the Caliphate could have in Iberia, especially since it's already Muslim.

Yeah, maybe Andalusia should house Cordoba, mainly because of its religion. Remember that the Andalusia CoT is created by Spanish colonialism, and if the muslims were to rise again, I don't think Spain (or Castile) would bother to start colonial ventures until the reconquista was complete.

On that note, Castile, and later Spain should have a non-colonial AI, and would only get their colonial AI by event after completing the reconquista and crushing Granada. Of course, a player could exploit this and invade and protect Granada to stop the Spanish AI from claiming the Spanish areas of the new world, so they should change AI anyway at some point.
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.744
176
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
I have to say, that I don't think its realistic for Granada to be reclaiming the Caliphate, an entity that faded out of existence four centuries prior to the start of the game. They were barely even related to the same dynstay of people who had ran the Caliphate and so it seems a bit far fetched. I mean sure Granada can be reascendent, but I think that we should stay away from that particular name as its connections to Granada are so weak to the point of almost insignificance.
 

Garbon

Sultan d'Afrique
72 Badges
Feb 1, 2002
9.744
176
www.crystalempiregames.com
  • Imperator: Rome
  • For The Glory
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Knight (pre-order)
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: Monks and Mystics
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Crusader Kings II: Jade Dragon
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Crusader Kings II: Holy Fury
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Deus Vult
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Pre-order
  • Europa Universalis IV: Call to arms event
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Golden Century
  • Europa Universalis IV: Dharma
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III: Chronicles
  • Divine Wind
  • Hearts of Iron IV Sign-up
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
Originally posted by anti_strunt
Just checking Granadas events... there is an event which triggers if Granada is at war with Castile before 1510, which gives them a whole bunch of Iberian cores... does this really make any sense? As it is now a player should try to provoke war with Castile as soon as possible to get those cores, and that hardly makes any sense...

The whole point of this, was to keep relations from deteriorating along with the fact, that I didn't want Granada to have any reason to attack first (reason being a cb and thus less bb). I figured that once the battle between Castile and Granada is on, then its justified in having its cores back, because the reasons for the change are no longer valid once relations have deterioated to that extent. If the player wishes to attack Castile to gain its cores, which not all players will know if they don't read the event file :rolleyes: , then I think thats great, since the player will still suffer the BB bit for DoW without a cb. So in short, the fix was really to solve an AI problem, without consideration to what the player will do, as the player will always do what he wants anyways.
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Originally posted by Garbon
The whole point of this, was to keep relations from deteriorating along with the fact, that I didn't want Granada to have any reason to attack first (reason being a cb and thus less bb). I figured that once the battle between Castile and Granada is on, then its justified in having its cores back, because the reasons for the change are no longer valid once relations have deterioated to that extent. If the player wishes to attack Castile to gain its cores, which not all players will know if they don't read the event file :rolleyes: , then I think thats great, since the player will still suffer the BB bit for DoW without a cb. So in short, the fix was really to solve an AI problem, without consideration to what the player will do, as the player will always do what he wants anyways.

I can understand the deteriorating relations thingy. But what do you think of my suggested event, if all references to the old Caliphate were to be removed? Could it still be used in some way, shape or form?
 

Mad King James

Buzzkill Extraordinaire
61 Badges
Jan 18, 2002
7.148
300
40
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
Originally posted by Garbon
I have to say, that I don't think its realistic for Granada to be reclaiming the Caliphate, an entity that faded out of existence four centuries prior to the start of the game. They were barely even related to the same dynstay of people who had ran the Caliphate and so it seems a bit far fetched. I mean sure Granada can be reascendent, but I think that we should stay away from that particular name as its connections to Granada are so weak to the point of almost insignificance.

When have weak or even nonexistant connections to long dead entities ever stopped people from making grandiose claims? I point to the 19th century Bulgarian king who carried full Byzantine imperial regalia with him at all times just in case his troops somehow captured Constantinople ;)

However, they wouldn't change their name, but they would certainly claim the title of Caliph of Al-Andalus if they conquered back up to their historical territories. They would also most likely move back to Cordoba, since it is a much better located place of governance, and has the historical seat of the caliphate. They would remain, technically 'Grenada' however. :)
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Originally posted by Mad King James
When have weak or even nonexistant connections to long dead entities ever stopped people from making grandiose claims? I point to the 19th century Bulgarian king who carried full Byzantine imperial regalia with him at all times just in case his troops somehow captured Constantinople ;)

However, they wouldn't change their name, but they would certainly claim the title of Caliph of Al-Andalus if they conquered back up to their historical territories. They would also most likely move back to Cordoba, since it is a much better located place of governance, and has the historical seat of the caliphate. They would remain, technically 'Grenada' however. :)

I take it you approve of my event modifications, then? Any ideas for other effects of the claim, like christian revolts, stab, rr etc?
 

Mad King James

Buzzkill Extraordinaire
61 Badges
Jan 18, 2002
7.148
300
40
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
Most likely nothing. No benefits or drawbacks, pretty much just saying "Well, I guess you'd better start calling us the Caliphate of Grenada", and moving to the more optimal, while less secure, Cordoba location.

The people don't give a rat's ass, they've been watching the reconquista roll along for the last 200 years, and they'll watch the re-reconquista with just as much disinterest. The nutjobs in the knightly orders will of course think along different lines, and fight a guerilla war, but the people in general will neither embrace nor abhor you, you're just more of the same.

The aristocracy though, like I said, will consider you evil friggin incarnate. Expect Iberia to abandon all conflicts with each other and unite in coalition in an effort to destroy you.

By the way, if southern Spain fell to an advancing Muslim horde, Castille would likely move to 'old Castille' in Leon, with the security of the traditional heartland that the Muslims never penetrated.

Claiming to be Al-Andalus isn't the same as claiming the title of the Ayyubid Caliphate of North Africa and Al-Andalus, since the north African part of the claim is rather tightly held by Morocco already, the de-facto heir of the Ayyubids.
 

Archaalen

Colonel
37 Badges
Mar 19, 2003
1.135
0
Visit site
  • Knights of Pen and Paper 2
  • Sengoku
  • Teleglitch: Die More Edition
  • Victoria 2
  • War of the Roses
  • 500k Club
  • Europa Universalis III: Collection
  • Humble Paradox Bundle
  • Magicka 2
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Rome Gold
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic
  • Age of Wonders
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Shadowrun Returns
  • Shadowrun: Dragonfall
  • Shadowrun: Hong Kong
  • Europa Universalis IV
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sunset Invasion
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Ancient Space
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Knights of Pen and Paper +1 Edition
  • Magicka
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria: Revolutions
It would have helped the Ottomans to have no Spain glaring at them across the Mediterranean, and had their co-religionists surivied, they might have had a very mutually useful friendship (As they do in my current game as Granada). Just as a side note, anti-strunt, please stop calling it "Grenada". A small island in the Pacific that the US invaded in the '80s has nothing to do with the Caliphate of Cordoba :D
 

unmerged(2456)

Pure Evil Genius
Mar 29, 2001
11.211
0
www.hero6.com
I think though, atleast for the time being, they would have been content with recapturing Spain rather than pushing further inward. I think they'd want to make sure they didn't have a second successful reconquista on their hands.

Also then such a thing should obviously sleep the treaty of Versai (sp), but who would likely be the first to explore the americas?
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Originally posted by Jinnai
I think though, atleast for the time being, they would have been content with recapturing Spain rather than pushing further inward. I think they'd want to make sure they didn't have a second successful reconquista on their hands.

Onwards To Madrid!

Also then such a thing should obviously sleep the treaty of Versai (sp),

So no WWI, then? :D

but who would likely be the first to explore the americas?

Well, I'd hate to simply have Granada take Spains place as a coloniser, that sounds far to simplistic to me. "Spain is beaten, so the beater automatically takes its place and does everything Spain would have done" doesn't ring true. But sooner or later some Portugese would probably discover that there was more to those Brazilian lands, and then there would be Cabbots and soon the race would be on, and with no Spain there would be far more space for the Brits, French and Netherlanders to compete in, hell, maybe even Sweden or something like that would have a chance to grab some territory...
 

unmerged(2456)

Pure Evil Genius
Mar 29, 2001
11.211
0
www.hero6.com
Originally posted by anti_strunt
So no WWI, then? :D
Yep. Muslim invasions would have stopped WWI :rofl:

This is what happens when you post while very hungry.
Well, I'd hate to simply have Granada take Spains place as a coloniser, that sounds far to simplistic to me. "Spain is beaten, so the beater automatically takes its place and does everything Spain would have done" doesn't ring true. But sooner or later some Portugese would probably discover that there was more to those Brazilian lands, and then there would be Cabbots and soon the race would be on, and with no Spain there would be far more space for the Brits, French and Netherlanders to compete in, hell, maybe even Sweden or something like that would have a chance to grab some territory...
I mean if all of Iberia is under Granada (as it was before the reconquista).
 

unmerged(12680)

I'm Lazy.
Dec 12, 2002
2.818
1
Visit site
Originally posted by Jinnai
I mean if all of Iberia is under Granada (as it was before the reconquista).

I see. Hm. One issue is of course, if Portugal has established overseas colonies before the Granadans can conquer them (very likely), so what would then happen? Would the Granadans take a crash course in sailing to grab those distant areas, or perhaps let the Portugese keep Lisabon (and colonies) as a sort of Free (Trading) City within the empire, a bit like Ragusa towards the OE... perhaps?

Just a thought...
 

Mad King James

Buzzkill Extraordinaire
61 Badges
Jan 18, 2002
7.148
300
40
  • Stellaris: Leviathans Story Pack
  • Crusader Kings II: Way of Life
  • Europa Universalis IV: Common Sense
  • Crusader Kings II: Horse Lords
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cossacks
  • Crusader Kings II: Conclave
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mare Nostrum
  • Stellaris
  • Stellaris: Galaxy Edition
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Cadet
  • Crusader Kings II: Reapers Due
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rights of Man
  • Stellaris: Digital Anniversary Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: El Dorado
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Together for Victory
  • Stellaris - Path to Destruction bundle
  • Europa Universalis IV: Mandate of Heaven
  • Europa Universalis IV: Third Rome
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Death or Dishonor
  • Stellaris: Synthetic Dawn
  • Europa Universalis IV: Cradle of Civilization
  • Hearts of Iron IV: Expansion Pass
  • Stellaris: Humanoids Species Pack
  • Stellaris: Apocalypse
  • Europa Universalis IV: Rule Britannia
  • Crusader Kings III: Royal Edition
  • Europa Universalis IV: Art of War
  • Crusader Kings II
  • Crusader Kings II: Charlemagne
  • Crusader Kings II: Legacy of Rome
  • Crusader Kings II: The Old Gods
  • Crusader Kings II: Rajas of India
  • Crusader Kings II: The Republic
  • Crusader Kings II: Sons of Abraham
  • Crusader Kings II: Sword of Islam
  • Deus Vult
  • Europa Universalis III
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Divine Wind
  • Europa Universalis IV: Conquest of Paradise
  • Europa Universalis IV: Wealth of Nations
  • Heir to the Throne
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis III Complete
  • Europa Universalis IV: Res Publica
  • Victoria 2
  • Victoria 2: A House Divided
  • Victoria 2: Heart of Darkness
  • 500k Club
ALL of Iberia was never under even the Caliphate. Leon, Asturias and Galicia, as well as the city of Oporto, never fell into the hands of Al-Andalus, and the Basque country fell into French hands upon the fall of the Visigothic kingdom.

In fact the three main branches of Iberian culture stem from the seperation of their cultures. The Portugese languised under Caliphate domination, and thus have many aspects of their culture, the Castillians are basically Asturian/Leonese culture, maintaining many Visigothic cultural aspects, and the Catalan were under Frankish and later French control, and thus are basically Provencal.

This is pretty much the maximum extent of the Caliphate:
sw1000.jpg
 

unmerged(2456)

Pure Evil Genius
Mar 29, 2001
11.211
0
www.hero6.com
Originally posted by Mad King James
ALL of Iberia was never under even the Caliphate. Leon, Asturias and Galicia, as well as the city of Oporto, never fell into the hands of Al-Andalus, and the Basque country fell into French hands upon the fall of the Visigothic kingdom.

In fact the three main branches of Iberian culture stem from the seperation of their cultures. The Portugese languised under Caliphate domination, and thus have many aspects of their culture, the Castillians are basically Asturian/Leonese culture, maintaining many Visigothic cultural aspects, and the Catalan were under Frankish and later French control, and thus are basically Provencal.

This is pretty much the maximum extent of the Caliphate:
Oh i knew they never controlled all of the Iberian penensula, but they did control basically (province-wise) all of portugal. I don't think they'd ignore them and let them be now though being catholic. I don't think they'd pursue them overseas, but i don't think they'd let them keep Lisbon.

As for as the territory of Leon, While they may not have any CB shields there, i do not think they'd leave any of the 3 major iberian nations left if they could, especially Castile who was the most ardent in drving the muslims out.
 
Last edited: