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    Real Strategy Requires Cunning

Third Angel

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YodaMaster said:
I tend to agree with this reasoning.

Be aware we added level 1 fortresses in Scandinavian "colony" provinces only for gameplay purpose. Result is not perfect but better than it was before, without fortress.
So you do see an overperforming ENG?

Also, I'd like to remind everyone that Orléans' basetax has been lowered to represent the apanaged lands there, so the supply limit is lower than should be and ENG suffers from it more heavily with a level 2 fort.

I saw current big English army can be stopped after the siege of Picardie and heavy attrition. I'd like to see this split and its consequences.
Let's try it in the next beta.
 
Jan 9, 2005
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Third Angel said:
Also, I'd like to remind everyone that Orléans' basetax has been lowered to represent the apanaged lands there, so the supply limit is lower than should be and ENG suffers from it more heavily with a level 2 fort.
Precisely. ;)
 

Toio

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Third Angel said:
So you do see an overperforming ENG?

Also, I'd like to remind everyone that Orléans' basetax has been lowered to represent the apanaged lands there, so the supply limit is lower than should be and ENG suffers from it more heavily with a level 2 fort.

Let's try it in the next beta.

agree
 

unmerged(40707)

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Third Angel said:
So it's my site against yours, except that mine is a historical one while yours is about genealogy.
Also, I own a couple of books about XIV-XVth century France and none of them has Jean II sans Peur, or Jean le Bon as Jean Ier de Bourgogne. :confused:
Yes, i'm not sure what to do but I already said I had doubts and it is certainly the best option to revert to "Jean Ier sans Peur" or even "Jean Sans Peur" only.
 
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YodaMaster said:
Yes, i'm not sure what to do but I already said I had doubts and it is certainly the best option to revert to "Jean Ier sans Peur" or even "Jean Sans Peur" only.
The latest beta has nicknames in the remark section, so (if they're kept that way) he can simply be called "Jean"
 

Toio

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in regards to splitting the english army in northern france at start of 1419GC.

we need to test and decide on these 2 provinces.

WHat I did was remove 10000 from the army already there and placed it initally in same province as where it was split.............result the army was united into 1 :(

other tests, I place the 10000 in normandy province..........results where favorable and BRI had difficulty in helping the DAU . this was due to the 10000 invading BRI.

other tests was placing the 10000 in calais province, this sometimes had access to help and got involved in the war on "old" FRA and sometimes (if ENG cancelled MA with BUR) this army only helped in later ENG v BUR wars.

I prefer the normandy placing, but modders need to test themselves and give their own comments
 
Jan 9, 2005
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I always immediately split the army and besiege Picardie & Ile-de-France with 15k each. I'll try your suggestion, Toio.
 

unmerged(40707)

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AI prefers focusing on Picardy "only".

EDIT: anyway, I will propose the Normandy 10,000 men split in next beta.
 
Last edited:
Jan 9, 2005
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I know, I know. :)

Will finish it all, promise. :D

@ Yoda, remember to keep Jane Grey/Mary sequence in betas only until I've got it how I want it... it should be based on sliders & religion as Garbon proposed, and I'll submit it when we've agreed on it being finished.

(this does not affect action_C in Bear of Warwick, Edward can rule as normal until Mary succeeds him AFAIK, and normal succession thereafter...)

EDIT: Also @ Yoda, I see Charles VII & Louis XI have been altered, but you should also change Charles VIII & François Ier as per Toio's earlier suggestions (from the same post, IIRC?):


Code:
historicalmonarch = {
	id = { type = 6 id = 049504 }
	startdate = {
		year = 1492
	}
	deathdate = {
		day = 8
		month = april
		year = 1498
	}
	name = "Charles VIII"
	DIP = 5
	ADM = [COLOR=Red]7[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]5[/COLOR]
	MIL = 9
	dormant = no
}
Code:
historicalmonarch = {
	id = { type = 6 id = 049506 }
	startdate = {
		day = 1
		month = january
		year = 1515
	}
	deathdate = {
		day = 29 #31th in RL
		month = march
		year = 1547
	}
	name = "François Ier"
	DIP = 5
	ADM = 8
	MIL = [COLOR=Red]9[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]8[/COLOR]
	dormant = no
	remark = "Le Père et restaurateur des Lettres"
}

Unless there's opposition to these? I certainly agree...
 
Last edited:
Jan 9, 2005
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YodaMaster said:
My mistake, I simply forgot them...
No problem, just a reminder. ;)

...and whilst I remember, the first two Valois-Bourgogne monarchs have the same stats as they do in monarchs.BUR, which suggests Louis should as well...


Code:
historicalmonarch = {
	id = { type = 6 id = 049537 }
	startdate = {
		day = 5
		month = january
		year = 1477
	}
	deathdate = {
		day = 29
		month = august
		year = 1483
	}
	name = "Louis XI"
	DIP = [COLOR=Red]5[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]9[/COLOR]
	ADM = [COLOR=Red]6[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]8[/COLOR]
	MIL = 5
	dormant = yes
	remark = "L'Universelle aragne (The spider King)"
}

I realise why Louis' stats were nerfed originally, but I don't see why Philippe's and Charles' should remain the same and only Louis' should not...
 

CatKnight

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I'm not sure if this is a bug or WAD. Thought I'd report it.


As Aragon in the 1450s, I've been beating the heck out of France. Recently I took Auvergne and Cervennes.

Two events fired adding I believe manpower and tax to those provinces. The flavor text indicated this was because they went to the estate of Charles II, and seemed to be intended to help France consolidate its position.

Should it have only fired once (when France took 'em)? Or is it supposed to go whenever someone takes 'em?
__________________
 

Third Angel

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This is WAD. The event is supposed to fire for FRA at the historical date (1527) or for any other country as soon as the provinces are taken, the description may be misleading though. Also, we do have a Bugs thread. :)
 

Toio

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coincidence ?? or is something discovered.?

I would really like help in a test I did. It involves latest beta, involves ENG army split in northern France.

I viewed 6 games and 100% the scenario went as follows:
army A normandy stayed put while army B caux (with Henry) moved to picardie and retook it, then army A moved to picardie, and the armies A and B joined, when Henry had 25000 troops he marched on ile de france. then marched on niversais and then on champagne.


hmm, whats going on, why did the armies unite?


I then tested the same scenario, but lowered Henry's rank to #3 .
In 5 games, 100% of these games went as follows,
army A stayed in normandy, and army B with Henry went to retake picardie.
when picardie was retaken, army A moved to picardie, BUT did not unite with army B. both armies moved on ile de france (defended by 10000 french), and once taken, army B went for niversais and army A went for champagne simultaneously.

puzzled, i thought does rank level have something to do on why some armies with high ranking officers remain stationary . will armies stay and wait until a certain number of men "fit" the rank of the commander?

I continued tests and also made Bedford rank 3. upon, DOW with DAU he immediately advanced on guyenne with 12000 men, . normally at rank 0 he will stay put or avoid battle and march to normandy.

I need other modders to run some tests as well.

It just seems too odd that the AI engine would use armies based on officers rank in this mode.

OR
did I have 11 weird games, :D


EDIT: 18 games tested , score 15-3
50% of games France forms from DAU in 1422, the seiges seems slower when rank is lowered. Another info, the games when Henry wins, he flees with all his army to england. :(

my opinion-------I detest the lowering on rank from what we already have because the games a more "weird".
But , the question I ask still stands.
Does rank of the officer give a measure of the number of troops needed to go on the offensive.
 
Last edited:

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Third Angel said:
This is WAD. The event is supposed to fire for FRA at the historical date (1527) or for any other country as soon as the provinces are taken, the description may be misleading though. Also, we do have a Bugs thread. :)

:grumble: I DID look for that bugs thread. Twice. Of course it'd be stickied and therefore invisible :D Thanks Angel :)
 
Jan 9, 2005
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If the Royalists win the English Civil War...

I thought these could use a little polishing:

Code:
#(1649) King Charles and the New Monarchy
#Edited by Johnny Canuck [COLOR=Lime]& mandead[/COLOR]
event = {
	id = 3771
	trigger = {
		event = 3025 #ENG: The English Civil War
	}
	random = no
	country = ENG
	name = "EVENTNAME3771" #King Charles and the New Monarchy
	desc = "EVENTHIST3771"

	date = { day = 0 month = february year = 1649 }

	action_[COLOR=Yellow]a[/COLOR] = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3771[COLOR=Yellow]A[/COLOR]" #[COLOR=Yellow]Be Vengeful[/COLOR]
		command = { type = inherit which = PUR }
		command = { type = religion which = catholic }
		command = { type = provincereligion which = 244 value = catholic } #Midlands
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 248 value = -5 } #Kent
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 249 value = -5 } #Wessex
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 245 value = -5 } #Lincoln
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 244 value = -5 } #Midlands
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 232 value = -5 } #Ulster
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 242 value = -5 } #Lancashire
		command = { type = domestic which = CENTRALIZATION value = 3 }
		command = { type = domestic which = ARISTOCRACY value = 4 }
		command = { type = domestic which = INNOVATIVE value = -1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = LAND value = 1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = OFFENSIVE value = -2 }
		[COLOR=Lime]command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 200 }
		command = { type = relation which = SCO value = 200 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -200 }
		command = { type = relation which = SWE value = -200 }
		command = { type = stability value = -2 }[/COLOR]
	}
	action_[COLOR=Yellow]b[/COLOR] = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3771[COLOR=Yellow]B[/COLOR]" #[COLOR=Yellow]Be Merciful[/COLOR]
		command = { type = inherit which = PUR }
		command = { type = religion which = protestant }
		command = { type = provincereligion which = 244 value = catholic } #Midlands
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 248 value = -5 } #Kent
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 249 value = -5 } #Wessex
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 245 value = -5 } #Lincoln
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 244 value = -5 } #Midlands
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 232 value = -5 } #Ulster
		command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 242 value = -5 } #Lancashire
		command = { type = domestic which = CENTRALIZATION value = 1 }
		command = { type = domestic which = ARISTOCRACY value = 2 }
		command = { type = domestic which = OFFENSIVE value = -2 }
		[COLOR=Lime]command = { type = relation which = FRA value = 50 }
		command = { type = relation which = SCO value = 100 }
		command = { type = relation which = HOL value = -100 }
		command = { type = relation which = SWE value = -50 }[/COLOR]
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
	}
}

#-#During the reign of Charles I England's loyalties waswere divided between Parliament and the King. The Parliament wanted more pluralism and a Protestant rulesupremacy, whilst the King wanted more royal power and supreme catholic rule, spurred on by the influence of his French Queen, wished to revert to the supremacy of Rome and the Divine Right of Kings, or at the very least, religious freedom for all. Parliament won the English Civil War, but what if they had not? So In 1645, the New Royal Army formed by Fairfax won two important victories, at Naseby and at Langport, destroying all of the Parliaments' armies. In 1646, Charles had little choice but to spread his remaining forces into 'hunt-and-destroy' parties seeking out fleeing Puritan leaders. Oxford pressed the newly formed 'New Model Army' of Oliver Cromwell, forcing them to seek refuge with the Scots, bringing the first war to a close. Charles used the time to negotiate with Parliament, whilst he spending many good vast sums of the Exchequer money bribing moderate Parliamentarians. In the mean time, Cromwell's army began to feel their feeble relation with the Scots deteriorate. Eventually the Puritan army tried to kidnap King Charles, however, Charles escaped and used this 'vile and contemptuous habit' to his advantage. Then, the Cromwell's army marched to south (Aug 1647) and debated proposals of their own with the refugees of the Parliament at York. Charles took advantage of this shift of emphasis away from him to negotiate a new agreement with the Scots, again promising church reform. This agreement leads to a series of Puritan rebellions and an ambitious offensive by Cromwell's Army (Jul 1648) took place. However, all were checked by the now far more powerful Royal Army under Fairfax. This new betrayal parliament forced Charles to negotiate with those who still supported Charles' place on the throne. The Cromwellian armyNew Model Army, angry that half the the majority of Parliament were still considered Charles as a rulerKing, marched on Parliament and conducted Pride's Purge (named such since the commanding officer of the operation was Sir Thomas Pride). 45 MP's were arrested, 146 were kept out of Parliament, and only 75 were allowed in, and then only to do the Army's bidding. This Rump Parliament was ordered to set up a high court of justice in order to try Charles I for treason in the name of the people of England. Charles took action and surrounded the Cromwellian army, smashing it to dust, freeing Parliament and enforcing his will upon it. At the Great Trial of Treason (Jan 1649) hundreds of Puritan leaders were found guilty, and they were all beheaded. Oliver Cromwell then lead the minuscule remnants of his New Model Army to Hull where it was picked up by a Swedish navy on the orders of the Swedish chancellor Axel Oxenstierna he was arrested by the Sheriff of York, but escaped to Sweden after offering the City of York his baggage train in exchange for his life.. Cromwell later fought with distinction in the Swedish-Polish War, but diedwas fatally wounded at Warsaw in 1656. Charles I was thenonce again Sovereign King of England, Scotland and Ireland. His promise to the Scots was never fulfilled and in March the Church of England was set on par with the Catholic Church... formally returned to the Church of Rome.

Code:
#(1688) [COLOR=Yellow]The Absolution[/COLOR]
#Edited by Johnny Canuck [COLOR=Lime]& mandead[/COLOR]
event = {
	id = 3032
	trigger = {
		event = 3771 #ENG: King Charles and the New Monarchy
	}
	random = no
	country = ENG
	name = "EVENTNAME3032" #[COLOR=Yellow]The Absolution[/COLOR]
	desc = "EVENTHIST3032"

	date = { day = [COLOR=Yellow]10[/COLOR] month = [COLOR=Yellow]december[/COLOR] year = 1688 }

	action_a = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3032A" #Absolute Monarchy
		command = { type = inherit which = PUR }
		command = { type = domestic which = CENTRALIZATION value = 5 }
		command = { type = domestic which = ARISTOCRACY value = 5 }
		command = { type = domestic which = INNOVATIVE value = -2 }
		command = { type = domestic which = SERFDOM value = 3 }
		command = { type = stability value = 3 }
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046018 } #Charles III °
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046019 } #Henry IX °
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046020 } #Mary III *
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046026 } #George I
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046027 } #George II
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046028 } #George III
		[COLOR=Red]command = { type = sleepevent which = 3040 } #ENG: Sir Robert Walpole
		command = { type = sleepevent which = 3044 } #ENG: William Pitt the Elder
		command = { type = sleepevent which = 3050 } #ENG: William Pitt the Younger
		command = { type = sleepevent which = 21006 } #ENG: Pitt the Younger or Charles James Fox as Prime Minister
		command = { type = sleepevent which = 21018 } #ENG: Pitt the Younger Continues as Prime Minister[/COLOR]
	}
	action_b = {
		name = "ACTIONNAME3032B" #[COLOR=Yellow]Constitutional Monarchy[/COLOR]
		command = { type = inherit which = PUR }
		command = { type = domestic which = CENTRALIZATION value = [COLOR=Red]5[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]-3[/COLOR] }
		command = { type = domestic which = ARISTOCRACY value = [COLOR=Red]5[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]-4[/COLOR] }
		[COLOR=Lime]command = { type = domestic which = INNOVATIVE value = 3 }[/COLOR]
		command = { type = domestic which = SERFDOM value = [COLOR=Red]1[/COLOR] [COLOR=Yellow]-2[/COLOR] }
		command = { type = stability value = 1 }
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046018 } #Charles III [COLOR=Lime]°[/COLOR]
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046019 } #Henry IX °
		command = { type = wakemonarch which = 046020 } #Mary III *
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046026 } #George I
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046027 } #George II
		command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 046028 } #George III
	}
}

#-#WhenAfter Charles I had won the English Civil War he set out persecuting the Puritans, many of whichwhom moved to the American colonies. He also closed Parliament and ruled by decree which created dissent among most groups in the English society. His son Charles II, however, though fully understood that the moderate Protestants were the key group and he needed them badly. By introducing religious freedom, disqualifying religion as an issue when attaining a governmental post, and creating an ideology of the Monarch as standing above all religious issues, he managed to create a feeble truce among Englishmen. As a consequence Charles revived Parliament, but greatly diminished its powers. HoweverFurthermore, Charles set high standards ensuring fair and regular elections and that every one was equal under law. His brother James was a staunch Catholic and not particularly found of the opposition that had deified a lot of his ambitions. James, influenced by the Duke of Tyrconnell and the Earl of Sunderland, had the Tory leader, Earl Danby propose in Parliament that the royal suspension power was to be abolished if Parliament passed a Declaration of Rights. In a masterly executed scheme the Whig leader, Earl Shaftsbury, made the proposal fall. King James was outraged and held a speech in Parliament informing the GentlemenCommons that either he would govern as the appointee of God or they pass a redrafted Declaration of Rights. The choice was theirs, and theirs alone. Finally after days of negotiation the Parliament accepted what would be called the Bill of Rights, creating a division of powers between Parliament, an independent Star Chamber and the King. Parliament would create and pass laws, and control certain taxes as tax of income and wealth, while the King would approve laws and direct the foreign policy, execute wars and control the majority of taxation. Thus the venerable series of events called 'The Glorious revolution'known unto history as 'The Absolution' came to be. By the early 1690s, James II enjoyed the same level of power and influence as his cousin, Louis XIV of France, and never again would Parliament be in a position to flex its muscles at the House of Stuart...

The stuff in red has been removed as those events will only fire if the Hanoverian monarchs are active, so there's no need to sleep them...
 

unmerged(49888)

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Oct 29, 2005
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I propose that revolt.txt be altered to allow ULS to revolt till 1820, to allow for it to be released as a vassal in the event I proposed a while back.
 
Jan 9, 2005
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4
Andrelious said:
I propose that revolt.txt be altered to allow ULS to revolt till 1820, to allow for it to be released as a vassal in the event I proposed a while back.
No, I disagree with this. Ulster (after the province is absorbed into England) represents the English plantations - the province is Protestant & Loyalist/Unionist, it wouldn't break away from the English government.

With how rebels work (and succeed) in EU2, we would see ULS revolt far too often...

You can still have ULS released by event (which is what you propose), but having it in revolt.txt until end-game will only make life hard for ENG in Ireland.
 

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mandead said:
You can still have ULS released by event (which is what you propose), but having it in revolt.txt until end-game will only make life hard for ENG in Ireland.

I don't think so. Unless the event in question turns a nation into ULS, you can't release a nation by event that isn't in the revolt.txt. How would eu2 know where to release the nation, as that information is defined in the revolt.txt.

mandead said:

With how rebels work (and succeed) in EU2, we would see ULS revolt far too often...
Really? I'd say rebellions really often do horribly in eu2. That's why we have to give so much revoltrisk for the Dutch, the Marathas, America, etc.