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Makes a lot of sense to lump these two together due to their common history. Hope Caliga doesn't mind me borrowing his cool structure:
red: issues being debated
yellow: debate closed, conclusion not yet implemented
green: debate closed, conclusion implemented into mod
white: miscellaneous notes

Right now I'm just collecting the issues for discussion I can think of, either brought up in discussions or implemented in AGC or EEP.

Country setup:

  • Should Transylvania exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary? It should be part of Hungary in 1419
  • When should Transylvania become independent?It should usually emerge in 1541, however it is revoltable already before and there are/should be opportunities for it to become independent as result of ahistorical event choices
    [*]Should Croatia exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary?It is part of Hungary, but revoltable
    [*]Should Silesia or Moravia be independent countries?No, they don't deserve to be in
    [*]Should the initial war between Venice and Hungary-Croatia be removed? If it stays, should the initial position be tweaked to provide for a more historical outcome?It stayed in and now makes some sense
    [*]DPs of both Hungary and Bohemia should be revised done for Bohemia, still on the agenda for Hungary


Culture issues

  • Should slovak culture be separate or merged with czech or magyar?The culture should stay as it is
  • If the culture stays, does Bohemia really deserve slovak culture, considering it has no and is not supposed to get any slovak provinces?Bohemia should loose the culture
  • Should Hungary get German culture?No. Odenburg was made Magyar instead
  • Should Hungary get slavonic culture either at start or in some event?
  • Should the province of Transylvania be Romanian?
  • Should the province of Odenburg be magyar?It is Magyar
  • Should Banat turn slavonic by some event for the resettlement of Serbian fugitives?Implemented
  • Should Austria get Magyar culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Slovak culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Czech culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Slavonic culture? If yes, when?

Province setup

  • What language should be used for city names?As a general rule, city names are in the language of the province culture.
    [*]Should Carpathia and / or Transylvania (probably better Carpathia) produce gold?Transsylvania produces gold
    [*] Should the Maros province that is covered mostly by the Alföld be a plain province (I doubt there's controversy on this)?Yes, should be plain
    [*] Should the Bohemian provinces be made substantially richer, considering that Bohemia was one of the richest countries of Europe and in 1419 had a higher royal income than e.g. Hungary or Poland? was done
    [*]Manpower, tax value and produced goods in both countries should be revised and balanced better. Done for Bohemia, still on the agenda for Hungary


Events:

  • Should the Serbia province represent Belgrade and thus be ceded to Hungary by an event in 1427?no
  • Should, during the time between the death of Albrecht of Hapsburg and the election of Matthias Corvinus, when there was permanent struggle among the magnates and Ulrich von Cilli, a supporter of Ladislaus V and enemy of the regent Janos Hunyadi, refused Hunyadi and the Diet control over his estates, Croatia become independent representing Cilli?
  • Would, if there is a tag available, it make sense to create a Slovakia revolter? This would help represent the Hussite mercenary Jan Jizkra who held a huge part of Upper Hungary for 20 years and resisted Hungary's attempts to recover the territories until he agreed to a peaceful settlement with Matthias Corvinus
 
Last edited:

Arilou

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What language should be used for city names? Should, as general rule, city names be in the language of the province culture (i.e. Czech names for Czech provinces, German names for German provinces, Slovak names for Slovak provinces etc.)? Should all Bohemian provinces have Czech and all Hungarian Hungarian names? Should all city names be in German (many cities in East Europe were inhabited mainly by Germans and known mostly by their German names) or in English?

Personally I think the "official" names of the cities should be used: IE what the people who passed decrees and levied taxes called them.
 

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Where to start...
Maybe from the beginning...
and only if I have some idea...

Croatia may go as a independent country but remians as a revolter.

I don't think that Moravia and Silesia deserve tags.

Yes, I would earse the initial war between Venice and Hungary. It usually ends with strange results. Venice is crashed or expands too much.

I would keep separate Slovak culture. Hungary should have it but why it was given to Bohemia is beyond me. Remove it.

I don't see enough reasons to give German to Hungary.

Odenburg may start Magyar and turn German if owned by Austria.

I prefer to keep Magyar culture in Transylvania but it is disputable I have to admit.

Those Hungarian silver mines are crying for some attention paid but I don't think that creating another gold province is a good solution.

Turning Banat slavonic at some point seems reasonable for me.

I'm a bit uncertain about making Bohemia richer but I admit that there are some inconsistences (very rich Prague, rich Silesia and Moravia, poor Sudeten). Maybe some balance and only slight changes?
 

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Originally posted by vilkouak

I prefer to keep Magyar culture in Transylvania but it is disputable I have to admit.


I would like Transylvania to have magyar as well. How about an event that changes it to romanian/vlach if the Turks have conquered the area (the landowners need peasants to work the lands after Turkish invasion)?

I would prefer for the city names to be in local tongue (Polish cities with Polish names, Magyar cities with Magyar names). Of course there are always problem areas- Danzig, Galicia, Ödenburg etc.

The recent EEP Southeastern Europe thread has a lot of good ideas.

I like changing the city in Maros to
Debrecen or Nagyvárad and making it plains.

Make the city in Magyar be the capital Buda (wrong side of the Danube, however).
Make the city in Pest be Pécs
OR
Make the city in Pest the capital Buda.
Make the city in Magyar Esztergom.

Banat should be Bánát with capital Temesvár.

Transylvania with capital Kolozsvár.

Presburg is a tricky case- Magyar nobility, German merchants, Slovak peasants. Since Hungary has Slovak culture, keep it Slovak with Bratislava name.

Carpathia province should have capital of Košice (Slovak name for Kassa, Kaschau).

I'm not sure about Ödenburg yet. Could make it Burgenland with capital Ödenburg, or Sopron/Sopron.




Other ideas from the thread:
Terrain

Maros is plains
Magyar is forest
Banat is marsh
Odenburg is mountain

Religion
Transylvania should be reformed
Since historically about half of the Slovaks became Protestant, one of the two Slovak provinces (preferably Carpathia) could be Protestant

Goods
Transylvania produces copper or gold
Carpathia produces copper or gold
Hungary should probably have one province producing gold, either Carpathia or Transylvania. It was Europe's largest producer of gold in the 15th and 16th century and gold inflation was one of the reasons for its decline. If there's no gold province in Hungary, there should be none in Styria or Toledo, either, because these two produced only a friction of the amount in Hungary. Later, sometime in the late 16th century, there should be an event for the gradual exhaustion of Hungarian gold ressources.
 

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Should Transylvania exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary? If it starts as part of Hungary, when should it become independent?

It should be part of Hungary at the beginning, but I'm not sure when it could be declared completely independent.

Should Croatia exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary?

Should be part of Hungary, but be a revolter.

Should Silesia or Moravia be independent countries?

No (although they would have neat flag/shield sets).

Should slovak culture be separate or merged with czech or magyar?

Slovak should remain and should be a state culture of Hungary but not Bohemia.

Should Hungary get German culture?

No.

Should Hungary get slavonic culture?

Would give them greater control over Croatia, but also would make it easier to go after Serbia and Bulgaria...

Should the province of Transylvania be romanian?

Prefer magyar with possibility of romanian depending on how the GC unfolds.

Should the province of Odenburg be magyar?

Undecided.

Should Banat turn slavonic by some event for the resettlement of Serbian fugitives?

Maybe only if the Ottomans have occupied the area (and caused it to become a battleground).

I'm not sure about the events and setup for Bohemia yet. Losing german-culture during the Hussite rebellion is good, but should the Czechs get german back afterwards? I have never read anything about the Germans in the mountains being difficult to govern until the age of nationalism, but Bohemia was governed by the German Habsburgs for most of the game....
 

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Re: Re: AGC & EEP: Bohemia and Hungary

Should Transylvania exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary? If it starts as part of Hungary, when should it become independent?

A part of Hungary but with the ability to become a revolter.

Should Croatia exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary?

Definitely a part of Hungary. In 1419 the King of Hungary was also the King of Croatia, and was crowned twice - once for each kingdom. The Croations had no problem with this arrangement until the Austrians took over. So if Austria inherits Croatia, Croatia shouldn't go independent (it didn't historically) but could become a revolter (their king no longer sits on the throne).

Should Silesia or Moravia be independent countries?

Nope

Should slovak culture be separate or merged with czech or magyar?

Make slovak a culture of Hungary but not Bohemia. There's no historical reason for why the Bohemians should have slovakian culture.

However, if the Austrians inherit Hungary then don't allow them to get slovak.

Should Hungary get German culture?

No. Although there were many Germans in various areas of Hungary, they were almost always a minority.

Should Hungary get slavonic culture?

Yes. Until the Austrian inheritance Hungary was ruled by Hungarians and Croatians in relative unity. As mentioned before the king was crowned twice, once as King of Hungary and once as King of Croatia. This combined kingdom was perhaps the only one in history that managed to rule the area in relative peace.

Should the province of Transylvania be romanian?

Nope. Transylvania wasn't really Romanian until long after the start of the game, and the composition of its peoples depended greatly on the outcome of various events. E.g., if there is no Turkish invasion then large chunks of the population wouldn't have fled, including the sizable minority German population.

Should the province of Odenburg be magyar?

Odenburg became German over time, primarily because of Austrian influence. Without the Austrians, who knows? Perhaps make it magyar, then swap cultures if the Austrians inherit.

Should Bohemia loose German culture when the Hussites seize power?

I don't see why it should.

Should Carpathia and / or Transylvania (probably better Carpathia) produce gold?

Definitely. I made the gold-producing province Carpathia in my game (since Transylvania can revolt away) and it seems to work just fine. However, I also took my own suggestion above and don't give the Austrians slovak culture if they inherit, to balance the mine.

Should the Bohemian provinces be made substantially richer, considering that Bohemia was one of the richest countries of Europe and in 1419 had a higher royal income than e.g. Hungary or Poland?

It would certainly help Bohemia out. However, if the Austrians inherit they're going to be pretty overpowered if they get all those Bohemian riches.

Max
 

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Re: Re: Re: AGC & EEP: Bohemia and Hungary

First of all, I was not explicitly suggesting any of these things, just throwing in thoughts and things that had been put up in discussions (no matter if I agree).

Originally posted by maxpublic
Should Transylvania exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary? If it starts as part of Hungary, when should it become independent?

A part of Hungary but with the ability to become a revolter.

Should Croatia exist in 1419 or be part of Hungary?

Definitely a part of Hungary. In 1419 the King of Hungary was also the King of Croatia, and was crowned twice - once for each kingdom. The Croations had no problem with this arrangement until the Austrians took over. So if Austria inherits Croatia, Croatia shouldn't go independent (it didn't historically) but could become a revolter (their king no longer sits on the throne).
I think there's reasonable consensus on these two. Will put both as closed (we need to get forward). If somebody disagrees strongly, scream loudly.
Should Silesia or Moravia be independent countries?

Nope
Nobody (including me) seriously seems to want this. Will put it as closed.
Should slovak culture be separate or merged with czech or magyar?
Make slovak a culture of Hungary but not Bohemia. There's no historical reason for why the Bohemians should have slovakian culture.

However, if the Austrians inherit Hungary then don't allow them to get slovak.
I agree on keeping slovak culture, removing it from Bohemia and not giving it to Austria. Anybody against?

Should Hungary get slavonic culture?

Yes. Until the Austrian inheritance Hungary was ruled by Hungarians and Croatians in relative unity. As mentioned before the king was crowned twice, once as King of Hungary and once as King of Croatia. This combined kingdom was perhaps the only one in history that managed to rule the area in relative peace.
It's probably subject to testing though. If it would cause Hungary to go on an annexation spree on the Balkan, we should refrain from it, otherwise it makes a lot of sense.
Should the province of Transylvania be romanian?

Nope. Transylvania wasn't really Romanian until long after the start of the game, and the composition of its peoples depended greatly on the outcome of various events. E.g., if there is no Turkish invasion then large chunks of the population wouldn't have fled, including the sizable minority German population.
Wasn't the majority of the peasantry always Vlachs?
Should the province of Odenburg be magyar?

Odenburg became German over time, primarily because of Austrian influence. Without the Austrians, who knows? Perhaps make it magyar, then swap cultures if the Austrians inherit.
The issues of giving German to Hungary and the province culture of Odenburg are connected. Hungary should get full income from Odenburg, therefore if the province stays German, Hungary should have German culture.
Should Bohemia loose German culture when the Hussites seize power?

I don't see why it should.
Because the Hussite revolt was violently anti-German. One of the main reasons for it was dissent against the growing German influence. Hussite fanatics persecuted, expelled and killed every German they could find. Bohemia would get the culture back after the end of the revolt.
Should Carpathia and / or Transylvania (probably better Carpathia) produce gold?

Definitely. I made the gold-producing province Carpathia in my game (since Transylvania can revolt away) and it seems to work just fine. However, I also took my own suggestion above and don't give the Austrians slovak culture if they inherit, to balance the mine.
The fact that the largest gold producer of Europe has no gold mine while Styria, Toledo and Armenia do always seemed ridiculous to me. If Hungary gets no gold-producing province, these three provinces should loose their mines as well.
Should the Bohemian provinces be made substantially richer, considering that Bohemia was one of the richest countries of Europe and in 1419 had a higher royal income than e.g. Hungary or Poland?

It would certainly help Bohemia out. However, if the Austrians inherit they're going to be pretty overpowered if they get all those Bohemian riches.
Maybe let Austria not get Czech culture until very late in the game?
 

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Added a few items:
  • Should Austria get Magyar culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Slovak culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Czech culture? If yes, when?
  • Should Austria get Slavonic culture? If yes, when?
  • Should, during the time between the death of Albrecht of Hapsburg and the election of Matthias Corvinus, when there was permanent struggle among the magnates and Ulrich von Cilli, a supporter of Ladislaus V and enemy of the regent Janos Hunyadi, refused Hunyadi and the Diet control over his estates, Croatia become independent representing Cilli?
  • Would, if there is a tag available, it make sense to create a Slovakia revolter? This would help represent the Hussite mercenary Jan Jizkra who held a huge part of Upper Hungary for 20 years and resisted Hungary's attempts to recover the territories until he agreed to a peaceful settlement with Matthias Corvinus
 

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Could there be some way to more accurately mod the inheritance of Bohemia and Hungary? Maybe include some events that transfer (or not, if the Polish player decides to keep the claims) them to the Hapsburg crown, and more accurately model the collapse of Hungary? In a number of games, I've seen Hungary do extremely well, hold off the Ottomans and even absorb most of the Balkans, only to get eaten by that event, which needless to say the Austrian player doesn't have to do squat to earn.
 

unmerged(6881)

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I think Austria should have the opportunity to get all three cultures an Italian in addition.
It depends on the course of the game. If Austria inherits Hungary then both Slovak and Magyar are justified. The same with Czech if Bohemia is inherited. Even after sloughterhouse of 30 Year's War, Habsburgs did not have serious problems in ruling Bohemia, so I see no valid reason to take the culture away.

Italian culture may be added if Austria owns good bunch of Italian provinces. Some connection between losing Magyar to get Italian comes to mind.

It seems that Austria would not have Slavonic culture.

Jiskra may be simulated by revoltrisk and few rebellions. His actions were the only nes until 19th cen in Slovakia.
 

Twoflower

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I know that using a tag for Jiskra is a bit much, but the problem (which is similar to the reason why the suggested idea with simulating the Hussite movement by revolts will not work out) is that the province will defect to Poland or Bohemia which is about the worst thing I can think of. Also I tend to think it was more than just a rebellion. Jiskra controlled the city of Kosice during all that time (between 1440 and 1462), he made his own money there, managed to raise troops from the populace that supported him and regarded him as liberator and distracted Hungary's attention from other matters for a long time.
At least I cannot see why countries like Croatia, Bulgaria, Greece, Armenia, Sicily or Corsica deserve tags and Slovakia not. Under Jiskra it was independent for a longer time than all these (and generally it is a real revolter "nation" for which it makes sense to be released or revolt in times of instability, unlike e.g. Gotland).
 

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Slovakia doesn't have a tradition of independency before Jiskra. No ruling family, no crown, or even duchy status. Jiskra just was born in good times for him as the whole area was in a mess in 15th cen. Few rebels doesn't hurt Hungary too much cause Hungary is very strong and only very rare is losing before events in 16th cen.
 

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A new question:
Should Bohemia be made independent with the defenestration of Prague, just seceding Moravia and Silesia to the Hapsburgs

Bohemia should be made richer, after all it was extremely wealthy and fairly powerful.

Transylvania creates another problem, in it there were three groups:
The Saxons(really just a mix of Germans) living in villages with fortified churches.
The Romanian peasants
and The Hungarians who lived in a more urban environment and were the nobles

So what culture should it be?
I recommend Magyar at the start, but shifting to Romanian at some point during Hapsburg rule
 

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Bohemia should become independent either by the Royal Letter of Bohemia event (in 1609) where its privilegues are confirmed or by the defenestration, yes.
Silesia and Moravia ought to be ceded around quite a bit:
- to Hungary in the beginning of the Hussite rebellion (that covered only Bohemia)
- back to Bohemia when Sigismund is accepted as Bohemian King
- to Hungary in 1477
- back to Bohemia when Wladislas of Bohemia is elected King of Hungary in 1490
- to Hapsburg in 1526
 

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Although unhistorical, I have added "nation-states" like Slovakia and Estonia as possible revolters in my GC. If there is a tag free, I wouldn't mind seeing a revolter for Ziska.
 

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These are some events for Hungary between the death of Sigismund and the ascension of Corvinus that I
posted recently in the EEP Southeastern Europe thread. Please let me know your qualified opinon (and tell me
about any mistakes and errors).

Hungarian events:
Code:
[COLOR=white]
#Election of Albrecht of Austria (1437)
event = { 
      id = 188100
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "Election of Albrecht of Austria"
      desc = "Sigismund, King of Germany, Hungary and Bohemia, died without male issue. Having faced this for some 
time, Sigismund had chosen his longtime ally and friend Albrecht of Austria, who had proven to be a capable soldier 
during the Hussite Wars, as his successor in all three Kingdoms and married him to his sole daughter Elizabeth. The last 
years of his reign were almost exclusively dedicated to ensuring the succession, and the Hungarian Diet was successfully convinced that the Hapsburg would be exactly the right man to protect the country from the Turks. Following Sigismund's 
wish and what seemed best for Hungary, Albrecht was elected King of Hungary and crowned in Székesfehérvehár (Stuhlweißenburg) on January 1st 1438. Since he however also inherited Bohemia and the crown of the Holy Roman 
Empire, he was unable to fully concentrate on ruling Hungary. Thus he relied heavily on the Parliament to rule in his 
absence and in his short reign conceded numerous privilegues to them."
      style = 1

      date = { day = 9 month december year = 1437 }
      
      action_a = {
               name = "Respect Sigismund's wish and elect Albrecht"
               command = { type = trigger which = 179100 } #HAB: Albrecht of Austria elected King of Hungary
               command = { type = domestic which = centralization value = -2 }
               command = { type = domestic which = aristocracy value = 1 }
                 }
} 
#Succession of Albrecht (1440)
event = {
      id = 188101
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "The vacant throne" 
      desc = "In 1439 Albrecht of Hapsburg, King of Hungary, fell ill, probably of cholera, while campaigning against the 
Ottomans. Within one month he died, leaving two minor daughters and his pregnant wife Elizabeth. For the case of the unborn 
child being male, Albrecht declared that his son would be his successor in all his fiefs just before his death. Based on this
will, Elizabeth attempted to get the Parliament to appoint her Queen Regent for her unborn baby. Still feeling menaced by the 
Ottomans, a majority of the Diet consisting mostly of the middle and lower nobility however did not want to trust the 
country's fortune upon a woman and an unborn child and, led by the Transylvanian noble Janos Hunyadi, desired an adult 
King with a decent powerbase instead. It was Hunyadi who proposed the most obvious choice, Wladislaw of Jagiello, King of 
the other big christian Kingdom in East Europe, Poland. Initially with the consent of Elizabeth, deputies of the Diet 
approached the nineteen-year-old Wladislaw in Krakow and offered him the Hungarian crown. Meanwhile, Elizabeth gave birth 
to a son, the male heir Albrecht and she had hoped for, and called him Ladislaus. Since then, she was determined to secure 
the throne for her child and thus withdrew her approval of the offer to the Polish King. But instructed by Hunyadi and other 
magnates, negotiations continued. When Wladislaw eventually accepted the proferred throne on March 8th 1440 and everything 
seemed ready for his coronation and the union of the two Kingdoms, Elizabeth fled Hungary to Austria with her son and the 
stolen Holy crown of Hungary. She had Ladislaus crowned King in Székesfehérvár on May 1st, more than two months before 
Wladislaw's coronation on July 17th. The scene was set for a civil war between the supporters of Elizabeth and Ladislaus, 
called 'Loyalists' who were strongest in Western Hungary and Slovakia and championed by Ulrich of Cilli on the one side and 
the supporters of Wladislaw, the 'Nationalists', based largely in the East and Transylvania and led by Janos Hunyadi, on the
other."
       style = 1
      
       date =  { day = 8 month = march year = 1440 }
       
       action_a = {
                name = "Ignore Elizabeth and make Wladislaw of Poland King"
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = 06262 } #Ulászló I
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = 06282 } #Interregnum
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = 06283 } #General-Captains of Hungary
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = 06299 } #Janos Hunyadi
                command = { type = wakeleader which = XXXXX } #Ulászlo I
                command = { type = breakvassal which = HAB }
                command = { type = breakdynastic which = HAB }
                command = { type = stability value = 1 }
                command = { type = revolt which = 316 } #Carpathia
                command = { type = revolt which = 325 } #Magyar
                command = { type = revolt which = 326 } #Presburg
                command = { type = revolt which = 352 } #Odenburg
                command = { type = revolt which = 353 } #Pest
                command = { type = revolt which = 367 } #Krain
                command = { type = revoltrisk which = 44 value = 4 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 316 value = 2 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 325 value = 2 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 326 value = 2 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 352 value = 2 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 353 value = 2 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 367 value = 4 }
                command = { type = CAV which = -2 value = 10000 }
                command = { type = setflag which = Wladislaw } 
                command = { type = trigger which = 258100} #POL: Wladislaw elected King of Hungary (vassalage to Poland)
                command = { type = trigger which = 179101 } #HAB: Civil War in Hungary
                  }
       action_b = {
                name = "Ladislaus Postumus is rightful King of Hungary"
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = XXXXX } #Elizabeth of Luxemburg (Regent)
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = XXXXX } #Frederick of Styria (Regent)
                commant = { type = stability value = -2 }
                command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 100 }
                command = { type = relation which = PRM value = 100 }
                command = { type = revolt which = 317 } #Ruthenia
                command = { type = revolt which = 323 } #Transylvania
                command = { type = revolt which = 324 } #Maros
                command = { type = revolt which = 354 } #Banat
                command = { type = revolt which = 355 } #Serbia 
                command = { type = revoltrisk which = 160 value = 4 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 317 value = 3 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 323 value = 3 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 324 value = 3 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 354 value = 3 }
                command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 355 value = 3 }
                command = { type = setflag which = Ladislaus }
                command = { type = trigger which = 179102 } #HAB: Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus (vassalage renewed)                                 
                  }
} 
#Loyalist Victory
event = {
      id = 188102
      trigger = { 
              flag = Wladislaw
              OR = { owned = { province = 353 data = HAB } #Pest
                     control = { province = 353 data = REB }
                   }
              OR = { owned = { province = 324 data = HAB } #Maros
                     owned = { province = 325 data = HAB } #Magyar
                     control = { province = 324 data = REB } 
                     control = { province = 325 data = REB }
                   }
              OR = { owned = { province = 316 data = HAB } #Carpathia
                     owned = { province = 317 data = HAB } #Ruthenia
                     owned = { province = 326 data = HAB } #Presburg
                     control = { province = 316 data = REB } 
                     control = { province = 317 data = REB } 
                     control = { province = 326 data = REB }
                   }
              OR = { owned = { province = 323 data = HAB } #Transylvania
                     owned = { province = 354 data = HAB } #Banat
                     owned = { province = 355 data = HAB } #Serbia
                     control = { province = 323 data = REB } #Transylvania
                     control = { province = 354 data = REB } #Banat
                     control = { province = 355 data = REB } #Serbia
                   }
              OR = { owned = { province = 366 data = HAB } #Croatia
                     owned = { province = 367 data = HAB } #Krain
                     control = { province = 366 data = REB } #Croatia
                     control = { province = 367 data = REB } #Krain
                   }
              NOT = { war = { country = HUN country = HAB }} #War needs to be over, otherwise there could be weird consequences
                }
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "Victory of the supporters of Ladislaus Postumus"
      desc = "Since most of Hungary has been captured by the Hapsburgs and their Hungarian supporters, support for King Ulászló and Janos Hunyadi is fading and Ladislaus Postumus is commonly acknowledged as rightful King."
      style = 1
     
      action_a = {
               name = "Accept Ladislaus"
               command = { type = vp value = -150 }
               command = { type = breakvassal which = POL }
               command = { type = wakemonarch which = XXXXX } #Elizabeth of Luxemburg (Regent)
               command = { type = wakemonarch which = XXXXX } #Frederick of Styria (Regent) 
               command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 06262 } #Ulászló I
               command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 06282 } #Interregnum
               command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 06283 } #General-Captains of Hungary
               command = { type = sleepmonarch which = 06299 } #Janos Hunyadi
               command = { type = sleepleader which = XXXXX } #Ulászlo I
               command = { type = trigger which = 179103} #HAB: Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus II 
               command = { type = independence which = SIE } #Hunyadi fights on
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 316 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 325 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 326 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 352 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 353 value = -2 }          
               command = { type = stability value = 2 }
                }
      action_b = {
               name = "Never, Ulászló is rightful King!"
               command = { type = stability value = -3 } 
               command = { type = war which = HAB }
                 }
}
#End of civil War
event = {
      id = 188103
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "End of civil war"
      desc = "Elizabeth of Luxemburg, the mother of Ladislaus Postumus, who had tried to secure the Hungarian throne for her 
son against Wladislaw Jagiello, died on December 13th 1443. With Emperor Friedrich V lacking the energy and ability to 
continue the efforts for the crown of St. Stephen, the Pope encouraging a settlement that would allow for a Hungarian crusade
against the Ottomans and fortune in battle against the supporters of Ladislaus, the succession conflict in Hungarian was 
practically ended by this. Ulászló and Janos Hunyadi were finally able to devote most of their energy towards a campaign 
against the Ottomans and attempt to stop them from overrunning the Balkans."
      style = 1
      
      action_a = {
               name = "Now let's take care of the Turks"
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 316 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 325 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 326 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 352 value = -2 }
               command = { type = province_revoltrisk which = 353 value = -2 }  
               command = { type = revoltrisk which = 10 value = -4 } #neutralises the +4 from HUN 2
               command = { type = stability value = 1 }
               command = { type = casusbelli which = TUR value = 12 }
                 }
}
#Ulászlo's death
event = {
      id = 188104
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "Death of King Ulászló"
      desc = "When on November 10th 1444 King Ulászló was killed in the battle of Varna against the Ottomans and Janos Hunyadi 
merely escaped alive, Hungary was plunged into another crisis. Succession of the dead King was unclear, a huge part of the 
Hungarian nobility had died in the battle, many magnates were glad to have no central authority over them. Austria, reviving 
Ladislaus Postumus' claim on Hungary, occupied the Hungarian border districts, Jan Jiskra seized Spis and the Cilli family 
took control of Slovakia, driving out the supporters of Ulászló I. Once again Hungary was heading for a full blown civil war."
      style = 1
      
      action_a = {
               name = "Ouch"
               command = { type = stability value = -5 }
               command = { type = secedeprovince which = HAB value = 352 } #Odenburg
               command = { type = revolt which = 367 } #Krain
               command = { type = revolt which = 326 } #Presburg 
               command = { type = revolt which = 316 } #Carpathia 
                  }
}
#The National Diet of 1445
event = {
      id = 188105
      random = no 
      country = HUN
      name = "The National Diet of 1445"
      desc = "When the country was about to disintegrate, Janos Hunyadi took the initiative and managed to convene a National
Diet in April 1445. The measure of the crisis can be judged by the fact that for the first time ever Hungarian Towns were 
represented. Pointing out the necessity of united action against the Ottomans, Hunyadi achieved a settlement. The former 
supporters of Ulászló acknowledged Ladislaus Postumus as rightful King and the Diet demanded Emperor Friedrich V to turn over 
Ladislaus, who was kept in Vienna, and the Holy Crown of St. Stephen to the Hungarian people. Until the return of Ladislaus
seven 'Captains' elected by the Diet were to rule the country and to restore law and order. Hunyadi was the first and most 
powerful of these Captains and five of the rest were his supporters. Only the final man to make up the seven was not one of 
his choice; the Hussite mercenary captain Jan Jiskra had built such a strong base in Slovakia and surrounding districts that 
he could not be ignored if the Diet and Hunyadi did not want to have to fight him immediately. Despite the balance of power 
being firmly in favour of Hunyadi and his peers this temporary solution worked very well. Even most of the magnates who had 
been hostile towards Ulászló and Hunyadi did at this time not want to risk the Kingdom's very existance. In the following year, 
peace was maintained and relative stability restored."
      style = 1
      
      date = { day = 1 month = april year = 1444 }

      action_a = {
               name = "Save the country"
               command = { type = stability value = 2 }
               command = { type = aristocracy value = -1 } #towns represented at the Diet
               command = { type = relation which = HAB value = 50 } #Ladislaus is accepted
                 }
}
#Hunyadi appointed Gubernator
event = {
      id = 188106
      random = no
      country = HUN
      name = "Janos Hunyadi appointed Gubernator"
      desc = "The settlement achieved at the National Diet of 1444 was quite successful in stabilising the country, but the
Captains managed neither to get Friedrich V to release Ladislaus Postumus nor to recover control over the parts of Upper 
Hungary seized by Jan Jizkra who refused to cooperate despite being one of the seven captains. A more permanent solution was 
needed and a new diet summoned at Pest in June 1446. Hunyadi's supporters among the populace and the lesser nobility very 
vocally demanded his appointment as Royal Regent, leaving the Diet with little choice, and Hunyadi was elected Gubernator of 
Hungary for as long as it would take to free Ladislaus, deliberately passing over the Palatine László Garai. The other 
magnates, distrustful of Hunyadi who had risen from a country squire to the most important person in Hungary within ten years, 
and envying him for his power and popularity, managed to install several limitations on Hunyadi's authority. A regency council, 
composed mostly of opponents of Hunyadi, was to 'assist' him in his duties, Garai stayed Palatine and kept some power and the
magnates during the regency used every opportunity to resist Hunyadi and stall his measures. Nevertheless Hunyadi at the same 
Diet and another in 1447 got a whole series of popular reforms passed, e.g. the decree ordering the demolition of the new 
castles, most of them little better than robber-strongholds, the decree compelling the great officers of state to suspend 
their functions during the session of the diet, the decree declaring illegal the new fashion of forming confederations after
the Polish model, all of which measures were obviously directed against the tyranny and the lawlessness of the oligarchy.
Due to the resistance of the magnates and wars against the Ottomans and Jizkra, most of these measures remained dead letter, 
but still some of them had the intended effect."
       style = 1
       
       date = { day = 1 month = june year = 1446 }

       action_a = {
                name = "Appoint Hunyadi regent and try to reform"
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = 06299 } #Janos Hunyadi
                command = { type = revoltrisk which = 70 value = 3 }
                command = { type = domestic which = serfdom value = -1 }
                command = { type = domestic which = centralization value = 2 }
                command = { type = domestic which = aristocracy value = -1 }
                  }
       action_b = { 
                name = "Appoint László Garai and avoid changes"
                command = { type = wakemonarch which = XXXXX } #László Garai
                command = { type = stability value = -2 } 
                  }
}
Austrian events:
Code:
#Albrecht elected King of Hungary (1437)
event = {  #triggered by HUN18800
      id = 179100
      random = no
      country = HAB
      name = "The crown of St. Stephen"
      desc = "Sigismund of Luxemburg, King of Germany, Hungary and Bohemia, died without male issue. Having faced this for some time, Sigismund had chosen his longtime ally and friend Albrecht of Austria, who had proven to be a capable soldier during the Hussite Wars, as his successor in all three Kingdoms and married him to his sole daughter Elizabeth. The last years of his reign were almost exclusively dedicated to ensuring the succession, and the Hungarian Diet was successfully convinced that the Hapsburg would be exactly the right man to protect the country from the Turks. Following Sigismund's wish and what seemed best for Hungary, Albrecht was elected King of Hungary and crowned in Székesfehérvehár (Stuhlweißenburg) on January 1st 1438. Since he however also inherited Bohemia and the crown of the Holy Roman Empire, he was unable to fully concentrate on ruling Hungary. Thus he relied heavily on the Parliament to rule in his absence and in his short reign conceded numerous privilegues to them."
      style = 1

      action_a = {
               name = "Great"
               command = { type = vassal which = HUN }
               command = { type = alliance which = HUN }
               command = { type = dynastic which = HUN }
               command = { type = relation which = HUN value = 300 }
                  }
}
#Ladislaus Postumus (1440)
event = {
      id = 179101 #triggered by HUN188101A
      random = no
      country = HAB 
      name = "Succession conflict in Hungary"
      desc = "In 1439 Albrecht of Hapsburg, King of Hungary, fell ill, probably of cholera, while campaigning against the 
Ottomans. Within one month he died, leaving two minor daughters and his pregnant wife Elizabeth. For the case of the unborn 
child being male, Albrecht declared that his son would be his successor in all his fiefs just before his death. Based on this
will, Elizabeth attempted to get the Parliament to appoint her Queen Regent for her unborn baby. Still feeling menaced by the 
Ottomans, a majority of the Diet consisting mostly of the middle and lower nobility however did not want to trust the 
country's fortune upon a woman and an unborn child and, led by the Transylvanian noble Janos Hunyadi, desired an adult 
King with a decent powerbase instead. It was Hunyadi who proposed the most obvious choice, Wladislaw of Jagiello, King of 
the other big christian Kingdom in East Europe, Poland. Initially with the consent of Elizabeth, deputies of the Diet 
approached the nineteen-year-old Wladislaw in Krakow and offered him the Hungarian crown. Meanwhile, Elizabeth gave birth 
to a son, the male heir Albrecht and she had hoped for, and called him Ladislaus. Since then, she was determined to secure 
the throne for her child and thus withdrew her approval of the offer to the Polish King. But instructed by Hunyadi and other 
magnates, negotiations continued. When Wladislaw eventually accepted the proferred throne on March 8th 1440 and everything 
seemed ready for his coronation and the union of the two Kingdoms, Elizabeth fled Hungary to Austria with her son and the 
stolen Holy crown of Hungary. She had Ladislaus crowned King in Székesfehérvár on May 1st, more than two months before 
Wladislaw's coronation on July 17th. The scene was set for a civil war between the supporters of Elizabeth and Ladislaus, 
called 'Loyalists' who were strongest in Western Hungary and Slovakia and championed by Ulrich of Cilli on the one side and 
the supporters of Wladislaw, the 'Nationalists', based largely in the East and Transylvania and led by Janos Hunyadi, on the
other."
     style = 1
     
     action_a = {
              name = "Protect Ladislaus' claim on the Hungarian throne"
              command = { type = casusbelli which = HUN value = 48 }
              command = { type = relation which = HUN value = -200 }
              command = { type = relation which = POL value = -150 }
              command = { type = addcore which = 316 } #Carpathia
	      command = { type = addcore which = 317 } #Ruthenia
	      command = { type = addcore which = 323 } #Transylvania
	      command = { type = addcore which = 324 } #Maros 
	      command = { type = addcore which = 325 } #Magyar
	      command = { type = addcore which = 326 } #Presburg
	      command = { type = addcore which = 352 } #Odenburg
	      command = { type = addcore which = 353 } #Pest
	      command = { type = addcore which = 354 } #Banat
                }
     action_b = {
              name = "Accept Wladislaw of Poland as Hungarian King"
              command = { type = relation which = POL value = 100 }
              command = { type = vp value = -25 }
                }
}
#Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus (1440)
event = {
      id = 179102 #triggered by HUN188101B
      random = no
      country = HAB 
      name = "Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus in Hungary"
      desc = "In 1439 Albrecht of Hapsburg, King of Hungary, fell ill, probably of cholera, while campaigning against the 
Ottomans. Within one month he died, leaving two minor daughters and his pregnant wife Elizabeth. For the case of the unborn 
child being male, Albrecht declared that his son would be his successor in all his fiefs just before his death. Based on this
will, Elizabeth attempted to get the Parliament to appoint her Queen Regent for her unborn baby. Still feeling menaced by the 
Ottomans, a majority of the Diet consisting mostly of the middle and lower nobility however did not want to trust the 
country's fortune upon a woman and an unborn child and, led by the Transylvanian noble Janos Hunyadi, desired an adult 
King with a decent powerbase instead. It was Hunyadi who proposed the most obvious choice, Wladislaw of Jagiello, King of 
the other big christian Kingdom in East Europe, Poland. Initially with the consent of Elizabeth, deputies of the Diet 
approached the nineteen-year-old Wladislaw in Krakow and offered him the Hungarian crown. Meanwhile, Elizabeth gave birth 
to a son, the male heir Albrecht and she had hoped for, and called him Ladislaus. Since then, she was determined to secure 
the throne for her child and thus withdrew her approval of the offer to the Polish King. Acknowledging Albrecht's will, the 
Hungarian Diet has followed her wish and terminated the negotiations with Wladislaw. Ladislaus Postumus, as he is called 
since he was born after his father's death, will be crowned King of Hungary in Stuhlweißenburg. Now it's upon Hapsburg to 
defend Europe against the Ottoman threat." 
       style = 1
        
       action_a = {
                name = "Hungary is ours"
                command = { type = vassal which = HUN }
                command = { type = dynastic which = HUN }
                command = { type = alliance which = HUN }
                command = { type = relation which = HUN value = 300 }
                  }
}
#Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus II
event = {
      id = 179103 #triggered by HUN188102A
      random = no
      country = HAB 
      name = "Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus in Hungary"
      desc = "Most of Hungary has been captured by the Hapsburgs and their Hungarian supporters. Support for King Ulászló and Janos Hunyadi is fading and Ladislaus Postumus is commonly acknowledged as rightful King. He has been crowned again in Stuhlweissenburg, this time with almost unanimous support. As soon as he will have come off age, he will rule Hungary." 
       style = 1
        
       action_a = {
                name = "Rule Hungary in personal union with Austria"
                command = { type = vassal which = HUN }
                command = { type = dynastic which = HUN }
                command = { type = alliance which = HUN }
                command = { type = relation which = HUN value = 300 }
                command = { type = vp value = 100 }
                command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 316 } #Carpathia
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 317 } #Ruthenia
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 323 } #Transylvania
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 324 } #Maros 
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 325 } #Magyar
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 326 } #Presburg
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 352 } #Odenburg
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 353 } #Pest
	        command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 354 } #Banat 
                command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 366 } #Croatia
                command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 367 } #Krain
                command = { type = removecore which = 316 } #Carpathia
	        command = { type = removecore which = 317 } #Ruthenia
	        command = { type = removecore which = 323 } #Transylvania
	        command = { type = removecore which = 324 } #Maros 
	        command = { type = removecore which = 325 } #Magyar
	        command = { type = removecore which = 326 } #Presburg
	        command = { type = removecore which = 352 } #Odenburg
	        command = { type = removecore which = 353 } #Pest
	        command = { type = removecore which = 354 } #Banat 
                command = { type = removecore which = 366 } #Croatia
                command = { type = removecore which = 367 } #Krain
                command = { type = badboy value = -5 }
                  }
      action_b = {
               name = "Try to unite Austria and Hungary permanently"
               command = { type = inherit which = HUN }
               command = { type = stability value = -2 }
               command = { type = badboy value = 3 }
               command = { type = revolt which = 316 } #Carpathia
               command = { type = revolt which = 325 } #Magyar
               command = { type = revolt which = 326 } #Presburg
               command = { type = revolt which = 352 } #Odenburg
               command = { type = revolt which = 353 } #Pest
               command = { type = revolt which = 317 } #Ruthenia
               command = { type = revolt which = 323 } #Transylvania
               command = { type = revolt which = 324 } #Maros
               command = { type = revolt which = 354 } #Banat
               command = { type = revolt which = 355 } #Serbia  
                }
}  
#Death of Elizabeth
event = {
      id = 179104
      trigger = { flag = Wladyslaw 
                  NOT = { event = 179103 } #Coronation of Wladislaw II 
                }
      random = no 
      country = HAB 
      name = "Death of Elizabeth of Luxemburg"
      desc = "Elizabeth of Luxemburg, the mother of Ladislaus Postumus, who had tried to secure the Hungarian throne for her 
son against Wladislaw Jagiello, died on December 13th 1443. With Emperor Friedrich V lacking the energy and ability to 
continue the efforts for the crown of St. Stephen, the Pope encouraging a settlement that would allow for a Hungarian crusade
against the Ottomans and fortune in battle against the supporters of Ladislaus, the succession conflict in Hungarian was 
practically ended by this. For the moment, the Hapsburgs gave up their claim on Hungary."
      style = 1
      
      date = { day = 13 month = december year = 1443 }
      offset = 0
      
      action_a = {
               name = "Our claim on Hungary is lost"
               command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 316 } #Carpathia
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 317 } #Ruthenia
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 323 } #Transylvania
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 324 } #Maros 
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 325 } #Magyar
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 326 } #Presburg
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 352 } #Odenburg
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 353 } #Pest
	       command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 354 } #Banat 
               command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 366 } #Croatia
               command = { type = secedeprovince which = HUN value = 367 } #Krain
               command = { type = removecore which = 316 } #Carpathia
	       command = { type = removecore which = 317 } #Ruthenia
	       command = { type = removecore which = 323 } #Transylvania
	       command = { type = removecore which = 324 } #Maros 
               command = { type = removecore which = 325 } #Magyar
               command = { type = removecore which = 326 } #Presburg
	       command = { type = removecore which = 352 } #Odenburg
	       command = { type = removecore which = 353 } #Pest
	       command = { type = removecore which = 354 } #Banat 
               command = { type = removecore which = 366 } #Croatia
               command = { type = removecore which = 367 } #Krain
               command = { type = relation which = PAP value = 50 } #Hapsburgs give up their claim to allow for a crusade
               command = { type = relation which = HUN value = 50 }
               command = { type = trigger which = 188103 } #HUN: End of civil war
                }
     action_b = {
              name = "Maintain Ladislaus' claim on the Hungarian throne"
              command = { type = stability value = -2 }
              command = { type = badboy value = 2 } #Hapsburgs are preventing a crusade against the Ottomans
              command = { type = relation which = PAP value = -100 }
                }
}
Polish events:
Code:
#Wladislaw elected King of Hungary
event = {
      id = 258100 #triggered by HUN188101A
      random = no
      country = POL
      name = "The Hungarian throne"
      desc = "In 1439 Albrecht of Hapsburg, King of Hungary, fell ill, probably of cholera, while campaigning against the 
Ottomans. Within one month he died, leaving two minor daughters and his pregnant wife Elizabeth. For the case of the unborn 
child being male, Albrecht declared that his son would be his successor in all his fiefs just before his death. Based on 
this will, Elizabeth attempted to get the Parliament to appoint her Queen Regent for her unborn baby. Still feeling menaced 
by the Ottomans, a majority of the Diet consisting mostly of the middle and lower nobility however did not want to trust the 
country's fortune upon a woman and an unborn child and, led by the Transylvanian noble Janos Hunyadi, desired an adult 
King with a decent powerbase instead. It was Hunyadi who proposed the most obvious choice, Wladislaw of Jagiello, King of 
the other big christian Kingdom in East Europe, Poland. Initially with the consent of Elizabeth, deputies of the Diet 
approached the nineteen-year-old Wladislaw in Krakow and offered him the Hungarian crown. Meanwhile, Elizabeth gave birth 
to a son, the male heir Albrecht and she had hoped for, and called him Ladislaus. Since then, she was determined to secure 
the throne for her child and thus withdrew her approval of the offer to the Polish King. But instructed by Hunyadi and other 
magnates, negotiations continued. When Wladislaw eventually accepted the proferred throne on March 8th 1440 and everything 
seemed ready for his coronation and the union of the two Kingdoms, Elizabeth fled Hungary to Austria with her son and the 
stolen Holy crown of Hungary. She had Ladislaus crowned King in Székesfehérvár on May 1st, more than two months before 
Wladislaw's coronation on July 17th. The scene was set for a civil war between the supporters of Elizabeth and Ladislaus, 
called 'Loyalists' who were strongest in Western Hungary and Slovakia and championed by Ulrich of Cilli, on the one side and 
the supporters of Wladislaw, the 'Nationalists', based largely in the East and Transylvania and led by Janos Hunyadi, on the
other."
      style = 1
      
      action_a = {
               name = "Poland and Hungary shall be united under one King"
               command = { type = vassal which = HUN }
               command = { type = alliance which = HUN }
               command = { type = relation which = HUN value = 300 }
               command = { type = dynastic which = HUN }
                 }
}
[/COLOR]
 

Classique

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Re: Re: Re: Re: AGC & EEP: Bohemia and Hungary

Regarding the population of Transylvania, it is a very debatable issue.

The Romanians insist upon a Daco-Roman Continuity theory- the Romanians are descendants of the original Dacians and Roman colonists that settled in Dacia. The Romanians in Wallachia, Moldavia, and Transylvania have always been one nation separated by foreigners since ancient times. They say that Transylvania always yearned to be joined with its sister lands of the Danube Principalities.

Hungarians adamantly reject this theory. They insist that when the Magyars first arrived in Transylvania, the land was largely uninhabitated. Hungarians say that the Vlachs only appeared in the land in 1210 after the Mongols had devastated the land. They say that the Vlachs lived in the mountains at first and only started to live in the valleys as Hungarians there were killed during warfare and invasions. As the centuries passed, the Vlach peasants became the majority only by the 18th century. Hungarians reject the claim of Romanian unity, saying that Vlach peasants in Transylvania had no interest in the more severe serfdom in Wallachia and Moldavia, and that the concept of being Romanian is a 19th century invention. Hungarians reject the Romanian theories as nationalistic and falsified, especially those of Stefan Pascu.

I don't know which viewpoint to accept. Romanian theory is difficult to accept because of the nationalistic approach (this land was always ours!), and the Hungarian approach is also questionable because of revanchist feelings (no, this land was ours until you stole it). Romanian and Hungarian posters on the fora are always insisting that their country's view is correct. I have not found many works of a non-Hungarian or non-Romanian origin.

The Vlach peasants had very little rights or powers (the three "nations" of Transylvania were the Hungarians, Saxons, and Szekely), while the nobility was Hungarian. We could make the province magyar and catholic (representing the Hungarians), magyar and orthodox (magyar/romanian mix), romanian and catholic (romanian/magyar mix), romanian and orthodox (representing the Romanians), german and catholic (Germans were the predominant cityfolk) etc. And there is the question of how to treat the Reformation in Transylvania.... *Throws hand in the air*
I don't think that anything chosen will satisfy everyone. The province was never rebellious against the Hungarian kings (and was the redoubt of Hungary during the Turkish years), so make it magyar or give Hungary romanian culture.

Here are links of varying reputability on Transylvania:
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/world/A0861619.html (Infoplease is a free encyclopedia)
http://www.slavweb.com/eng/cee/romania/trans-e0.html (various links)
http://www.hungary.com/corvinus/lib/index.htm (Hungarian views)
http://www.geocities.com/transmagyar/ (Hungarian views)
http://www.transylvanianet.com/ (Hungarian views)
http://ardeal.20megsfree.com/ (Romanian views)
http://www.turism.ro/transyl.htm (Romanian tourism)
http://www.rotravel.com/romania/transylvania/index.htm (Romanian tourism)
http://www.sibiweb.de/index_eng.php3 (Saxon)
http://www.sibiweb.de/geschi/karten/ (maps)

EUII links:
Hungarian cultures
Siebenburgen...
Hungary is misrepresented in EU2
Knights and Transylvania
Arguments Against An Independent Transylvania
Territorial claims - Ethnic mixes - Transylania/Siebenbuergen/Erdely
Moldavia, Wallachia and Siebenburgen... So what?
 

unmerged(9145)

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Originally posted by Twoflower
It's probably subject to testing though. If it would cause Hungary to go on an annexation spree on the Balkan, we should refrain from it, otherwise it makes a lot of sense.

I've tried it in a few games now with 1.07b. Hungary does attempt to annex the rest of the Balkans, and sometimes succeeds. It's long-term fortune, however, depends on how the Ottomans fare. Also, for reasons I don't understand Hungary seems to have more than it's fair share of revolts in conquered provinces, and it doesn't seem to respond terribly well to putting them down (often the provinces break away).

Wasn't the majority of the peasantry always Vlachs?

Another poster offered up a lot more information on the matter. All I'd add is that if you put aside current-day nationalistic arguments, what we call Transylvania was always a mixed bag until the invasions. Even afterwards (when most of the Saxons/Germans had fled) there were still two majority cultures in the area.

In any event, the idea of 'romanian' culture is, so far as I can see, an invention that post-dates the game.

The issues of giving German to Hungary and the province culture of Odenburg are connected. Hungary should get full income from Odenburg, therefore if the province stays German, Hungary should have German culture.

Actually, what I was suggesting is that Odenburg remain magyar unless the Austrians inherit. From what I can tell the province was mostly magyar with a strong German minority; this minority became the majority *after* the Austrian inheritance. Without the Austrian influence and settlement, you could argue either way, i.e., the Germans would've remained a minority, or settlement would've occurred anyway.

So I'd suggest that it start the game as magyar, and switch to german if the Austrians inherit. If the Austrians don't inherit, it remains magyar (this assuming that the germans remain a minority because there is no Austrian influence at work).

Because the Hussite revolt was violently anti-German. One of the main reasons for it was dissent against the growing German influence. Hussite fanatics persecuted, expelled and killed every German they could find. Bohemia would get the culture back after the end of the revolt.

This I like. Lose the culture during the revolts, get it back after. This works and doesn't cripple Bohemia. Well, any more than Bohemia is currently crippled (I never see it do anything of note, other than get eaten by its neighbors).

The fact that the largest gold producer of Europe has no gold mine while Styria, Toledo and Armenia do always seemed ridiculous to me. If Hungary gets no gold-producing province, these three provinces should loose their mines as well.

Precisely why I put the gold province in Carpathia. Taking out the Toledo gold mine can really put the hurt on Castille/Spain if under ai control, so it seems more balanced to add the gold mine to Hungary.

Maybe let Austria not get Czech culture until very late in the game?

I'm not sure the Austrians should get czech culture at all. From the moment they took control of Bohemia they instituted a policy of oppression against the czechs and forced germanization of the area (often on religious grounds) which continued right up until World War I. It has to be one of the most miserable chapters in the Empire's history, and one of the most brutal.

It might, however, be necessary for play balance.

Edit: I really like your events, btw. I've never been satisfied with how Paradox handled this whole tangled affair.

Max
 

Atreides

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Opinions

For what they are worth, I'd like to add my opinions here.

I have been lurking in the EEP/AGC forums for quite some time, and see this project as being an excellent idea - while I have no event writing experience I do have a few thousand hours of playtesting the various mods people have made.

Humble Opinions:>

Should Hungary get German culture?

Odenberg seems to be the main culprit here - change Odenberg to Magyr in 1419 and give Hab an event in the mid 1500's that changes the culture of Odenberg (assuming they own it and have kept the core on it).

Should Hungary get slavonic culture?


Slavonic would definitely power up the Hungarians in dealing with the Turks - probably not something that is good for the game.


Should the province of Transylvania be romanian?


Either/or situation - Magyar and Romanian can be equally argued, and neither one necessarily 'harms' or 'helps' the game play to any great degree. If Hungary does not get Slovanik, I would have Trans be Magyar. If Hungary does get Slovanki I would have Trans be Romanion.


Should the province of Odenburg be magyar?


Most definitely.



Should Banat turn slavonic by some event for the resettlement of Serbian fugitives?Yes, if the triggers for the event make sense


Certainly sounds like an interesting idea, and I have no clear argument against it, so sure.


Should the balance between czech and german provinces in Bohemia be changed in any way?


I am not sure about the real world setup, but having Silesia being Czech instead of German at the outset would certainly help Bohemia deal with agression from Brandenburg, Austria and Hungary. Perhaps an event (like with Odenberg) that later changes the province back to German.


Should Austria get Magyar culture? If yes, when?

Should Austria take the 'B' Choice where she attempts a 'Permanent Union' with Hungary, she should be granted Magyay Culture.


Should Austria get Slovak culture? If yes, when?


Considering that Carpathia should have a gold mine, I think giving Austria Slovak culture could be dangerous to gameplay.


Should Austria get Czech culture? If yes, when?


Yes, tie it in either to the Inheritence event, or create a new event set up in the 1600's that grants it.


Should Austria get Slavonic culture? If yes, when?


No. Can not see any game play reason for this.
 

Atreides

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Event Comments

Ladislaus Postumus (1440)
event = {
id = 179101 #triggered by HUN188101A
random = no
country = HAB

action_b = {
name = "Accept Wladislaw of Poland as Hungarian King"
command = { type = relation which = POL value = 100 }
command = { type = vp value = -25 }
}

Can we work on the B choice here? If there are two choices and one is so clearly better then the other that only the AI would choose "B" then gameplay definitely suffers. Either the "B" choice needs to be improved sufficiently that it has sufficient merits to be chosen, or it should be removed.


#Coronation of Ladislaus Postumus II
event = {
id = 179103 #triggered by HUN188102A
random = no
country = HAB

*REALLY* well done. Both choices have their own merits and penalties - looking forward to this events inclusion.


#Death of Elizabeth
event = {
id = 179104
trigger = { flag = Wladyslaw
NOT = { event = 179103 } #Coronation of Wladislaw II
}
random = no
country = HAB


"B" seems clearly better then "A" here - could we consider adding a BB loss for Choosing "A" - the Austrians are relinquishing their claims for the good of "everyone" after all - a BB loss would represent that collective good will.

The 2 BB gained on "A" is offset by the BB reduction from Permanent Causus Belli as well as the 0 cost for 'acquiring' these lost Hungarian provinces. The other option could be to increase the 2 BB hit for keeping the claim to 5 or so.

My comments aside, this looks to be a great event set.