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    Real Strategy Requires Cunning

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trekaddict

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Ehran and ViperhawkZ, you both raise valid and good points, but as a citizen of tiny and former West Germany I must point out that a quick look at the map reveals that Canada has as is more strategic depth than we ever had. True, there mightn't be as many rivers to aid the defence as in central Europe, but taking the speed of advance shown in works like Red Storm Rising and The Last War we should see a drawn out conflict. True, cities like Vancouver will fall almost immediately, but for example Hamburg was within 160 miles of the border....

With all due respect to Hackett, I believe his "World War Three" novel is overly optimistic in regards to the performance of the Red Army. To a certain degree that will be true here too, but it's true, any War scenario would see Canada temporarily loose most of it's population centres. It wouldn't be an easy war by any means, but at the same time it wouldn't be over as soon as some seem to fear.


EDIT: Of course that would mean that for a time the core of Canada would consist mostly of Quebec.... :D
 
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stevep

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That's what I've argued on another board when various yank-wankers talk about how easily and quickly they could conquer Canada. Especially in the sort of time periods 1860-1920. For most of that period the US didn't really maintain an army so it would have to raise train and equip one 1st. Also since the RN would control the oceans, barring serious crisis in Europe, that would enable both reinforcements from Britain and elsewhere and at least some blockade to disrupt their activities. Under such circumstances some areas, such as the Maritimes, would be very, very difficult to storm.

Furthermore taking is one thing. Holding is another. So the US occupies about 1/2 million miles of territory, which they now have to garrison in the face of a bitterly hostile population. At the same time having a huge frontier zone from which raiders are picking away at the occupation forces and their supply lines. With the long, thinly populated 49 border probably accompanied by occasional raids into the US itself. Simultaneously waging a conventional war against British and rump Canadian forces in the east. While every coastal state is reluctant to release any men and demanding massive coastal defences to protect against British bombardments and raids. And every businessmen is complaining about the blockade meaning external markets lost, imports being impossible and war taxes to pay for the continued conflict.

Properly organised Canada, at least before about 1940 OTL is going to be a pain in the arse for an aggressive US that it will ultimately almost certainly find too expensive, in men, material etc to maintain.

Steve

Ehran and ViperhawkZ, you both raise valid and good points, but as a citizen of tiny and former West Germany I must point out that a quick look at the map reveals that Canada has as is more strategic depth than we ever had. True, there mightn't be as many rivers to aid the defence as in central Europe, but taking the speed of advance shown in works like Red Storm Rising and The Last War we should see a drawn out conflict. True, cities like Vancouver will fall almost immediately, but for example Hamburg was within 160 miles of the border....

With all due respect to Hackett, I believe his "World War Three" novel is overly optimistic in regards to the performance of the Red Army. To a certain degree that will be true here too, but it's true, any War scenario would see Canada temporarily loose most of it's population centres. It wouldn't be an easy war by any means, but at the same time it wouldn't be over as soon as some seem to fear.


EDIT: Of course that would mean that for a time the core of Canada would consist mostly of Quebec.... :D
 

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Agreed. Especially from the AAO-verse 1970s when the Theatre Nuclear Weapons treaty eliminates tactical nukes and thus forces both sides to plan for a drawn out conventional war.

EDIT: A lot of what we can surmise about the Red Army is of course hindsight that we wouldn't have were the Cold War still going on, but that's no reason to take it as a basis for estimating what might happen in the scenario proposed.
 

unmerged(241632)

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Ehran and ViperhawkZ, you both raise valid and good points, but as a citizen of tiny and former West Germany I must point out that a quick look at the map reveals that Canada has as is more strategic depth than we ever had. True, there mightn't be as many rivers to aid the defence as in central Europe, but taking the speed of advance shown in works like Red Storm Rising and The Last War we should see a drawn out conflict. True, cities like Vancouver will fall almost immediately, but for example Hamburg was within 160 miles of the border....


EDIT: Of course that would mean that for a time the core of Canada would consist mostly of Quebec.... :D

it just looks like strategic depth because there is nothing of actual value up there. the population and the industrial centres are almost all along the border. most of the ones further north are just a matter of driving north to them with effectively neither armed forces nor terrain to hinder the attackers.

that said occupying the country would likely prove to be a nightmarish experience for the yanks. if even a modest proportion of the population decided to actively resist it would be very ugly very quickly as unlike afghans etc we are actually rather good at the whole make them dead in job lots thing. aid from britain and the RN chewing on their merchant marine would also no doubt distress them considerably.
 

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it just looks like strategic depth because there is nothing of actual value up there. the population and the industrial centres are almost all along the border. most of the ones further north are just a matter of driving north to them with effectively neither armed forces nor terrain to hinder the attackers.

that said occupying the country would likely prove to be a nightmarish experience for the yanks. if even a modest proportion of the population decided to actively resist it would be very ugly very quickly as unlike afghans etc we are actually rather good at the whole make them dead in job lots thing. aid from britain and the RN chewing on their merchant marine would also no doubt distress them considerably.

Well, that and the fact that the Allied Armies will be fighting (Canucks, Brits, Germans, Poles, you name it.) tooth and nail for Canada. A hundred miles might not look like much, but (and I hate using fiction as references, but meh) most people believed that the advance of the GSFG would have been measured in daily single digits. Either way this wouldn't be a short war.
 

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Chapter 281​

The Battle for Rangoon was now, three days after the first Allied units had crossed the city limits far different from what the Allies had expected. The Japanese were far more numerous on one hand and on the other the presence of the civillians did not deter the Japanese from falling back on the tactics that they had used in China, far from it in fact. General O'Connor still prevented the use of medium bombers in the battle, but the Japanese defenders soon began to fear the shape of the Hurricanes of the Royal Indian Air Force that were seemingly everywhere, firing their rockets into occupied buildings.

While the Allies were teaching the Japanese a lesson about the proper application of Air power and frontline Artillery support, the Civilians in Rangoon suffered.

0620654.jpg

Hawker Hurricane Mk. IVs of the No.59 Squadron, belonging to the RIAF War Memorial Squadron, 2010[1]


However the Japanese were throwing many things into this battle, including the aircraft that were stationed in Siam at the time. Forty-seven Ki-21 and Ki-49, escorted by almost sixty Naval A6M Model 32 that, while being phased out on the Navy's Carriers, were deemed appropriate against the 'minor' Air Forces the British were putting up in the South-Western theatre.[2]

In what turned out to be the biggest raid of the day the Japanese were trying to smash the hastily built Allied supply dumps west of Rangoon that fed the grinding and extremely bloody advance by the Allies in the city towards the harbour.

The lack of a viable RDF chain in central Burma allowed the Japanese to reach Rangoon without being detected, but over the city they ran into 35th 'Black Cat' Squadron of the newly reconstituted Republic of China Air Force. Flying ex-RIAF Spitfire Mk..VI (the tropical version of the basic Mk.V[3]) that had been replaced in RIAF service with the Mk.VIID, these pilots had something to prove to themselves and to the British, and that they hated the Japanese with a passion didn't hurt either.

Albeit only numbering fourteen aircraft (one pilot was missing in action, the second in the hospital) the Chinese fliers immediately threw themselves at the hated Japanese and attacked the vastly superior Japanese formation.

Coming in from two o'clock high they broke through the outer fighter screen before the Japanese even knew they were there and downed five bombers in their first pass.

The Japanese recovered quickly, and soon the Chinese pilots were embroiled in a fierce dogfight with their Japanese Counterparts. Slowly they were being overhwhelmed by superior numbers, loosing three more of their number for two Zeroes in return.

What they did accomplish however was that their attacks scattered the Japanese formation into the four winds, some of the bombers had even dropped their load and were now running for home, and gain time for more Allied aircraft to arrive.

These reinforcements came in the persons of No.1, No.20 and No.22 Squadrons, Royal Indian Air Force. Between them they brought fifty-five Spitfires as all had already suffered losses in the last few days. However this fresh influx of British Air Power decided the action as the head-on attack by the Indians broke up the two main groups the bombers had seperated into and managed to break through to the embattled Chinese.

sunDSC_0187-1.jpg

RIAF Spitfire pursuing a Japanese Zero.[4]
Especially No.1 Squadron earned itself the enduring friendship of the Chinese Air Force (as evidenced in the Regimental Affiliation between No.1 Squadron and the 35th, the first non-Commonwealth one established by the RIAF) as their Spitfires set upon the ball of Japanese and Chinese fighters and allowed the tired and exhausted 'Black Cats' to extract themselves with nine of their numbers still alive. They would need several weeks of rebuilding but their action had thrown the Japanese plans into complete disarray.

The three new Squadrons made short work of the rest of the raid, and in the end the Japanese Army Air Force and Naval Air Service had lost close to twenty aircraft for eight Allied ones and a few bombs falling onto supply dumps that on the whole suffered only light damage. It was the last large-scale raid flown over the Rangoon area until Operation Take-Ichi in 1945.

At sea the situation was a foregone conclusion, as the Japanese Light Forces were no match for the British now that the Royal Navy was making a concerted effort at clearing the seas, and the ageing Thames Class Gunboats[5] were getting their last hooray before the new Ganges class, exclusively built on Indian yards and used in the Far East. These boats were far larger and more heavily armed than anything the Japanese still had in the Indian Ocean.


HMS Zambesi was the newest of the Thames Class Gunboats which showed in the relatively young age of her guns and the presence of a relatively advanced RDF set. It was a surface search set and right now it detected her two sisters and more importantly six Japanese MTBs (developed copies of the British 60ft MTBs, after plans obtained in 1936 via a honey trap run through the Japanese trade mission).

Lieutenant Commander David McKenna was somewhat junior for this command, but Zambesi had been rushed out of the yard where she was having some superficial damaged fixed and he had been the only Officer in convenient range.

He had served aboard HMS Severn as a fresh young Subbie and after her destruction and a promotion been sent to the Far East, spending most of 1942 aboard one of the Destroyers patrolling the convoy lanes. He actually was delighted at having been given this command. For some time at least he would get out of the most boring duty station the Fleet had to offer (in his estimation) and being back in small craft doing the kind of thing an Officer in the Queen's service was supposed to be doing when at war.

He glanced over the shoulder of the RDF operator and then turned towards his signalds officer.

“Flags, tell Clyde and Spey to assume Chevron formation, half a mile. Weapons free.”

“Aye aye, Sir.” came the curt reply.


The two other gunboats moved out of line formation and increased speed temporarily to take positions, half a mile ahead and to the port and starboard of the Zambesi. Their forward turrets were trained onto where their own RDF sets had detected the Japanese. The Japanese gunboats were as of yet unaware that the British were out here as the lack of RDF and the pouring rain prevented any sighting until the two forces where within almost half a mile of each other.

While Weapons free had been given, the conditions affected the British also. The MTBs were too small a target to allow for accurate RDF guided gunnery with the outdated RDF sets the gunboats sported and visual gunnery was out of the question until the range closed.

In the end mother Nature intervened as during the time when the Japanese and British slowly closed with each other the rain coming from above slightly let up and almost immediately the Japanese spotted the hulks of the British gunboats. Both side opened fire almost at the same time. The British 4.7'' guns barked whereas the Japanese, coming at the British from an angle, fired their torpedoes.

Instantly spotting the wakes, the three British Gunboats turned, throwing off their gunnery solutions.

However at a distance of little more than a quarter of a mile this was not going to help much. Being the closest, HMS Ganges had barely managed to put her rudder full over when she caught two Japanese 'fish' and disintegrated in a massive explosion.

Zambesi herself did not go unscathed either. Even though she did not suffer a direct hit, but debris from the Gamges showered her upper decks. This did cost her two of her .50 calibre Brownings and three crewmen killed.

Still, her 4.7inchers barked immediately in reply. While they did not hit anything they broke up the Japanese formation and allowed the Clyde to close with her damaged flagship. The British ships turned and so did the Japanese. The MTBs mounted a small 2pounder gun aft and these guns barked in defiance even though the armour on the gunboats while far too weak to withstand even their own guns was far too thick for the low-velocity 2pounders that the Japanese had intended for use against boats and assorted civilian craft. The only real defence the Japanese had lay in their speed and both they and the British knew this. The twin 5inchers forward however gave the Royal Navy vessels a disproportionate advantage in firepower and they used this to great effect.

elco_80_footer_at_speed_lo_res_copy.jpg

Even as the Japanese began to disperse towards the Japanese lines east of Rangoon and the Light Forces base the Zambesi and the Clyde kept up their fire, by unspoken consent concentrating on the two nearest MTBs that began to draw away but were hampered by having to manoeuvre and the sea state.

The first and only hit that the Zambesi landed on 'Motor Torpedo Gunboat No.11' of the 'Type 36' Class was more by pure chance than skill, if the No.11 had not zagged to the right she would have survived but this way she ran right into a shell fired by Zambesi's No.2 turret which blew her into a thousand tiny bits.


The next loss for the Imperial Japanese Navy in this action came by skill though as No.11 had seemingly opened the floodgates. The Japanese CO aboard No.23 was wounded when the sudden motion of his command caused him to loose his footing and his Number One took command. Being a most aggressive Officer he instantly turned and attacked again, intending to fire the second and last salvo from the torpedo tubes. That this played right into the hands of the British did not occur to him.

It brought the Japanese gunboats into range of the Twin Bofors guns on the upper gun deck. The licensed copies of Sweden's first big contribution to the war opened up somewhat early, but eight of them, coming from two ships steaming in a comedic copy of the Line of Battle put up a virtual wall of hot lead. Two Japanese gunboats fell prey to this and the remaining three, No.23 among them, turned away again and attempted to open up the distance. To McKenna it showed that the Japanese commander had either to be a blithering Idiot or inexperienced.

McKenna would have fired his fish on the first run, losses be damned as at this distance hits were virtually guaranteed. He was however not prepared to let this opportunity pass and all the guns that could be brought to bear fired on the Japanese, even the .50s, spat out lead and fire into the broadside of the Japanese that had still not completed their turn. Another MTB was holed by a dozens of .50 calibre from Clyde, coming to a halt, with all of her crew dead, which was all the better as the the boat was on fire scant seconds later.

The two remaining MTBs however were, while damaged, able to extract themselves from the envelope of the small guns, figuring with good reason that avoiding the heavy 4.7'' guns was easier than the fully automatic smaller ones. McKenna decided not to turn but instead rather more decided to increase speed to the best speed possible, but the action was over sooner than expected as on the second run No.23 was wiped from the surface of the sea by the Clyde, and suddenly the lone remaining boat was very reluctant to press the attack, having whitnessed the demise of the CO in the light of the still burning fire of one of the other MTBs.

In the end a few more shots were traded before the remaining MTB withdrew.

Tactically the action had in spite of the losses been a victory for the Japanese as it forced McKenna to withdraw towards his base, but overall it did not make a difference in RN operations in the area. McKenna and 3 Patrol Squadron were but one of six such Squadrons scouring the coast of occupied Burma that night and overall the Japanese losses mounted and would continue to mount over the coming weeks. It did entrench in both the Royal Navy and the IJN the value of Light Forces and both sides would put the knowledge and experience gained to good use later in the Dutch East Indies, the Phillipines and along the Chinese coast.

What became clear to the RN Indian Ocean Station was that the Japanese had indeed all but abandoned the Indian Ocean, something that sat perfectly well with them. Lacking any Carriers and anything heavier than two 8'' Cruisers (Cumberland and Sussex) fighting the Battleline or the Carriers was a nightmare that haunted them often enough.


[1] I know it's a IIc but there's surprisingly few pictures of the Hurricane in SEAC markings on the web.

[2] Of course the RAAF and the RIAF would seriously object to being called minor, never mind the Dutch and the Chinese.

[3] In Europe the British are busy replacing the Mk.V with the Mk.X, which is in essence the OTL Mk.XIV. With the Vulture being axed early and the generally better condition of the British economy and infrastructure the two-stage supercharger was fitted to the base model.

[4] No idea what model of Spit this really is, but according to KiwiZac over at the whatif modellers board who took this picture it's an honest to god flyable Zero and not a rebuilt T-6. Picture taken during an NZ Air Show in 2010.

[5] For those who have forgotten, made out of bits and pieces left over from de-commed WW1 and inter-war DDs, built using small ship building capacity that IOTL was used for the Black Swan Class among other things and that is not needed for that here.
 
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unmerged(241632)

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Well, that and the fact that the Allied Armies will be fighting (Canucks, Brits, Germans, Poles, you name it.) tooth and nail for Canada. A hundred miles might not look like much, but (and I hate using fiction as references, but meh) most people believed that the advance of the GSFG would have been measured in daily single digits. Either way this wouldn't be a short war.

depending on the time frame the conventional war for canada would probably be over before anyone in europe managed to mobilize their troops much less get them to canada. the simple truth is that the canadian army is nowhere near big enough to stand off the yanks for very long. even our op plans would have us launching spoiling attacks on american forces massing for the attack to buy time us to mobilize. rather doubt any canadian pols would have the balls to let them do that though.

interesting my information was that nato expected that the russians would be staring across at the white cliffs of dover 12 to 14 days from the balloon going up at the fulda gap. that was back late 70's early 80's when the american army was in awful shape and the defense would have rested mostly on the germans and the baor.
 

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depending on the time frame the conventional war for canada would probably be over before anyone in europe managed to mobilize their troops much less get them to canada. the simple truth is that the canadian army is nowhere near big enough to stand off the yanks for very long. even our op plans would have us launching spoiling attacks on american forces massing for the attack to buy time us to mobilize. rather doubt any canadian pols would have the balls to let them do that though.

interesting my information was that nato expected that the russians would be staring across at the white cliffs of dover 12 to 14 days from the balloon going up at the fulda gap. that was back late 70's early 80's when the american army was in awful shape and the defense would have rested mostly on the germans and the baor.


I am talking late 1980s and how it would have been in the 1990s and beyond. I suggest you really read TLW (link via PM if desired) for a realistic take on that.

Anyway, re Canada, you should bear three things in mind:

1) This isn't OTL. This Canadian Army never went through the disastrous cuts of the 60s and 70s, is larger to begin with (thanks to a larger population, no Quebec conscription crisis and a bigger economy) and has been preparing for this war since the 1930s. I haven't worked out the actual size of the post-war Canadian Army, but we're talking at least six Divisions peace-time here. (Yes, seems like a lot, but the Bundeswehr peace-time strength in 1989 was twice that, and Canada has near 50 million population here by 1990. The refugees after the Civil war the Americans had were a flood, and all that post-war emigration that went to the US IOTL goes to Canada instead. That, co-ed military by 1986 and a healthy desire by everyone to defend their country makes it possible.)

2) As was the case with NATO in Germany substantial Allied forces and Equipment are already pre-positioned in Canada. TTL's variant of REFORGER (Return of Forces to Germany) is in place since the 1950s. Germany for example would, if mobilized have close to a million men in the field, as per OTL, only on the other side of the Atlantic. The logistics of all this would be very similar to OTL, only going in the other direction and without the Reuben James* defending them.

*yes, that is an RSR reference.

3) What you are saying pre-supposes strategic and tactical surprise which my scenario doesn't. When I say "This or that would/might happen" I am always pre-supposing the Allies have at least two to three weeks of warning to mobilize. And frankly, between Recon Sats, SR-71 (Avro 730, featured in one of my side stories.) and god knows what else people have come up with OTL and that is therefore legitimate for me to use I can't see the necessary buildup or troop movements remaining secret. The Canadians alone will be watching like hawks for this. Trust me, Canada won't allow itself to be caught unaware.
 

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Hopefully the RAF and it's sister will forces have learnt the best way to dogfight a Zero - don't! With a twin supercharged Merlin Spit they will have power and speed to burn compared to a Zero, use those to full effect and losses will drop considerably.

I just wonder what the pilots will name the tactic. Somehow I just can't see a moustached RAF wing commander discussing 'Boom and Zoom', that kind of talk would get a chap laughed out of the mess! :D
 

ViperhawkZ

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The lack of a viable RDF chain in central Burma allowed the Japanese to reach Rangoon without being detected, but over the city they ran into 35th 'Black Cat' Squadron of the newly reconstituted Republic of China Air Force.

Woah, woah, woah, slow down there, buddy. Reconstituted ROC Air Force? That's a bit of a jump from last time you and I spoke about the Chinese, but I assume you mean Chinese defectors from the puppet stae, or maybe some sort of ROC GIE? 'Splain?
 

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El Pip They learned that lesson the hard way over Burma and Malaya, and also over the DEI. What it's called I have no idea yet.

ViperhawkZ Well, it's as it was the last time, a few Squadrons of Chinese defectors/recruited PoWs, the term "RoC Air Force is mostly propaganda, but the British are striving to establish a RoC GIE.

Dr. Gonzo Aye, that be true!
 

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Well, the Brits have the air and naval supremacy in their pocket. Now, time to finish the Japanese land forces.
 

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Good update. Sounds like Rangoon is going as we expected, i.e. a bloody slog. Superior fire-power and logistics should win it for the allies but going to be very bad for the civilians. Especially if the Japanese start using them as human shields.:mad:

I'm a bit surprised that the Japanese are able to mount a major air attack on Rangoon as late as 45. I know things are still hairy for the empire and also the Japanese have, albeit reluctantly, the Chinese are on-side. However we know that some deal will be sorted out with the Soviets rather than a march on Moscow. When that happens the Japanese are facing off against America, the Soviets and a very powerful British empire and allies.

Checked up on Take-Ichi, because I was wondering if a parallel to the planned sub-based air attack on the Panama canal but that was obvious a different name. [Looked on Wiki and Take-Ichi OTL was a convoy carrying two divisions of reinforcements to the Philippines and further south broken up by US subs so obviously it's going to be a radically different operation TTL].

Great sea combat although pity about the Ganges.:( I think you made a typo here as that's the name of the new class and just before combat opens the commander refers to the other ships as the Clyde and Spey so presumably that should be the Spey being hit by the torpedoes? Given that there is 1/2 mile between the ships it must have been a hell of an explosion to do so must blast damage to Zambesi :eek:

Steve
 

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I would have to agree with Elran about what seemed to be the common view in the 70's and early 80's about a fairly early Soviet advance to at least the Rhine in the event of a conventional war. True we have learnt a lot since then about the weaknesses of the Red army but that definitely seemed to be the view at the time.

Would agree however that, once the Soviet threat was gone and with America still dodgy, I could see the empire and allies forward deploying forces and supplies in Canada. Not sure about the Germans as from you're own TL there is reluctance for them to deploy forces outside Germany [from both within and without]. However definietly would be tough for both sides. [Wouldn't like to try and maintain a major operation and supporting logistics across the Atlantic. :(

What are TRW and RSR? Other AARs?

Steve

I am talking late 1980s and how it would have been in the 1990s and beyond. I suggest you really read TLW (link via PM if desired) for a realistic take on that.

Anyway, re Canada, you should bear three things in mind:

1) This isn't OTL. This Canadian Army never went through the disastrous cuts of the 60s and 70s, is larger to begin with (thanks to a larger population, no Quebec conscription crisis and a bigger economy) and has been preparing for this war since the 1930s. I haven't worked out the actual size of the post-war Canadian Army, but we're talking at least six Divisions peace-time here. (Yes, seems like a lot, but the Bundeswehr peace-time strength in 1989 was twice that, and Canada has near 50 million population here by 1990. The refugees after the Civil war the Americans had were a flood, and all that post-war emigration that went to the US IOTL goes to Canada instead. That, co-ed military by 1986 and a healthy desire by everyone to defend their country makes it possible.)

2) As was the case with NATO in Germany substantial Allied forces and Equipment are already pre-positioned in Canada. TTL's variant of REFORGER (Return of Forces to Germany) is in place since the 1950s. Germany for example would, if mobilized have close to a million men in the field, as per OTL, only on the other side of the Atlantic. The logistics of all this would be very similar to OTL, only going in the other direction and without the Reuben James* defending them.

*yes, that is an RSR reference.

3) What you are saying pre-supposes strategic and tactical surprise which my scenario doesn't. When I say "This or that would/might happen" I am always pre-supposing the Allies have at least two to three weeks of warning to mobilize. And frankly, between Recon Sats, SR-71 (Avro 730, featured in one of my side stories.) and god knows what else people have come up with OTL and that is therefore legitimate for me to use I can't see the necessary buildup or troop movements remaining secret. The Canadians alone will be watching like hawks for this. Trust me, Canada won't allow itself to be caught unaware.
 

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stevep, I hope you don't mind that I answer all your valid questions and points in order of numbers?

1) I'm not sure how the forum rules are about in this regard, so let's just say yes, it will be very bad.

2) The Japanese ability to mount a large-scale air-raid in 1945 is something that I can't explain fully just yet, but it will be epic to behold.

3) European Russia will see extensive combat, most importantly Leningrad and a few others. Moscow..that I can't reveal yet, but I can assure you now that both Bonaparte and Adolf from our timeline will be very jealous.

4) The Japanese actually did better in the game than I expected considering what they had against themselves. The US AI was something I discounted, but they did better than I expected and the Soviets worse. Apparently the Soviet AI isn't made to fight a two-front war that isn't against the Germans.

5) The operational name was actually randomly selected from a wikipedia list on Japanese military ops.

6) It actually isn't a typo. A small scene that was cut (by acciden tbh) had the Captain of the Ganges reflect on how this would be his last cruise on her.

7) The torps detonated her magazines which were full to the brim with 5" and small arms ammo.

8) You are of course correct, but what I am saying is always with the benefit of hindsight of twenty years of analysis and access to some Russian Archives. Of course the Allies don't know that here, nor ar things in the American Army ever as bad as they were in the Soviet Army. However, that still doesn't mean that the Allies will abandon Canada to her fate. They will fight in spite of the odds, World War Two taught them the need for that.

9) THe current side story has actually the intention to explain just how and why the Germans changed their mind over this and how they come to be present in Canada with such a force. Suffice it to say, TTL's Germans are wired somewhat differently than my countrymen are in RL, and that is meant in a good way.

10) Well, it worked in WW2 and the Americans are doing it every day right now. True, this would be on a tiny scale, but we are talking about a British Empire that has to be able to do it just to keep from falling apart, and with most of Europe's Navies and Merchant fleets supporting the effort it should be doable.

11) TLW is 'The Last War' about a conventional World War Three breaking out between NATO and a surviving Warsaw Pact in 2005, Red Storm Rising is Tom Clancy's masterpiece about the same set in 1985/86. Reuben James is a frigate in RSR.
 

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[4] No idea what model of Spit this really is, but according to KiwiZac over at the whatif modellers board who took this picture it's an honest to god flyable Zero and not a rebuilt T-6. Picture taken during an NZ Air Show in 2010.

After some thinking, I would say that it's a Spit Mk IX. Or a XII...
 

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I committed a massive error: The Brit Gunboats are supposed to have 4.7" and not 5...
 

ViperhawkZ

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Eh, 1/3 of an inch, easy retcon. :p
 

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stevep, I hope you don't mind that I answer all your valid questions and points in order of numbers?

No problem, thanks for the detailed response.

1) I'm not sure how the forum rules are about in this regard, so let's just say yes, it will be very bad.

Ugh:( On the forum rules I had a look after that post from the bloke labelled a moderator a few days back. Think their hard on any posts with symbols from a certain German political party but can't remember anything about other groups. Probably some limits on how much detail you can be but hopefully you don't need to be too graphic. You're covered a lot of the horrors of war pretty well.

2) The Japanese ability to mount a large-scale air-raid in 1945 is something that I can't explain fully just yet, but it will be epic to behold.

I wait with anticipation.:)

3) European Russia will see extensive combat, most importantly Leningrad and a few others. Moscow..that I can't reveal yet, but I can assure you now that both Bonaparte and Adolf from our timeline will be very jealous.

Interesting. I thought from the fact the SU continued for quite a while after the war and some comments in chapters about manpower requirements that some deal would be made which brought the war to a end after the Nazis were taken out.

Given what you say above this is going to be interesting indeed. Although, while the two egomaniacs mentioned might not be jealous by it getting to Moscow and getting out without losing the bulk of the army.

4) The Japanese actually did better in the game than I expected considering what they had against themselves. The US AI was something I discounted, but they did better than I expected and the Soviets worse. Apparently the Soviet AI isn't made to fight a two-front war that isn't against the Germans.

Interesting. I got a copy of the game a few years back but never actually got around to playing it - like so many other games.:eek:o Really ought to have another look at it.

5) The operational name was actually randomly selected from a wikipedia list on Japanese military ops.

:)

6) It actually isn't a typo. A small scene that was cut (by acciden tbh) had the Captain of the Ganges reflect on how this would be his last cruise on her.

The problem is you mention 3 ships and in the paragraph above the torpedo attack have the other two referred to as the Clyde and Spey?

7) The torps detonated her magazines which were full to the brim with 5" and small arms ammo.

Oops!:eek:

8) You are of course correct, but what I am saying is always with the benefit of hindsight of twenty years of analysis and access to some Russian Archives. Of course the Allies don't know that here, nor ar things in the American Army ever as bad as they were in the Soviet Army. However, that still doesn't mean that the Allies will abandon Canada to her fate. They will fight in spite of the odds, World War Two taught them the need for that.

I suspect that what will avoid conflict will be Torchwood. If nothing else once that is in place then no matter how weak Canada is attacking it would be very risky and you need neither a total nutter in charge in Washington, along with no one willing to risk defying him or some real screw up.

A lot would depend as well on how the US [or whatever it's called, forget the name] develops. OTL the US had about 130-140M during WWII and has since exploded to >300M. Also it's a massive internal market with a very good educational system. TTL it will have a lower population in WWII due to the civil war and mass escapes. This will continue after the war with some people trying to get away and it won't be the big target for immigrants. Coupled with a soviet system in place for a couple of generations and you will see a lot of corruption, waste and demoralisation so it will struggle with a lot of high tech stuff and with motivating people. Coupled with as you say Canada being richer and more populated. You could well have a situation like China/Taiwan, before Mao's death but less extreme as the population and resource disparity is going to be much smaller. With Canada at ~50M it could only be 3-1 or so.

9) THe current side story has actually the intention to explain just how and why the Germans changed their mind over this and how they come to be present in Canada with such a force. Suffice it to say, TTL's Germans are wired somewhat differently than my countrymen are in RL, and that is meant in a good way.

Again interesting. I'm looking forward to reading more on that. Sounds like their going to get dragged into something which will make them a lot more interventionist.:)

10) Well, it worked in WW2 and the Americans are doing it every day right now. True, this would be on a tiny scale, but we are talking about a British Empire that has to be able to do it just to keep from falling apart, and with most of Europe's Navies and Merchant fleets supporting the effort it should be doable.

It will be tough against a mobilised US but as mentioned above that depends on how strong the latter is. Also with a unified and modernised empire behind it Britain will be able to throw a lot of weight about.

11) TLW is 'The Last War' about a conventional World War Three breaking out between NATO and a surviving Warsaw Pact in 2005, Red Storm Rising is Tom Clancy's masterpiece about the same set in 1985/86. Reuben James is a frigate in RSR.

Thanks for clarifying. I've read RSR, albeit a couple of decades about. TLW doesn't ring a bell and set in 2005 I presume means some changes in OTL by the 80's at the latest.

Steve