Advertised as Diplo Depth but falls short (Conclave)

[GUmby_Aaron]

This DLC Conclave touts a Diplomatically overall for added game depth and was one of the main reasons I purchased it. However while their is some Diplo overall it falls flat for the price being asked with an incomplete favour game mechanic.

The new favour mechanic is utterly useless if you are not a part of a consul. You can only diplomatically influence Betrothals/Marriage/Concubinage and that is the BIG Diplo overall. You may not use your favours to influence any plots, factions or if you have an alliance with a dynasty you can't influence them to honour it. If you are owed a Papal favour you may not use it for any religion action including the nomination of bishops if you don't have free investiture, excommunications or divorces.

DLC SHOULD ONLY TOUT IMPROVED COUNCIL MECHANICS as all other diplo actions are basically unaffected with this gimped favour game mechanic. If you were looking for more diplomatic game depth this DLC doesn't have it for the price tag being asked.

 

[Anonymous01]

It's a new feature. Paradox never adds many features at once, preferring polish and stability over quantity, an approach I don't necessarily agree with but which has obvious merits. I bet that over time they'll add to the favor feature.

 

[riadach]

This DLC Conclave touts a Diplomatically overall for added game depth and was one of the main reasons I purchased it. However while their is some Diplo overall it falls flat for the price being asked with an incomplete favour game mechanic.

The new favour mechanic is utterly useless if you are not a part of a consul. You can only diplomatically influence Betrothals/Marriage/Concubinage and that is the BIG Diplo overall. You may not use your favours to influence any plots, factions or if you have an alliance with a dynasty you can't influence them to honour it. If you are owed a Papal favour you may not use it for any religion action including the nomination of bishops if you don't have free investiture, excommunications or divorces.

DLC SHOULD ONLY TOUT IMPROVED COUNCIL MECHANICS as all other diplo actions are basically unaffected with this gimped favour game mechanic. If you were looking for more diplomatic game depth this DLC doesn't have it for the price tag being asked.

Actually, you can use favours to make others join your faction. Of course, you can also use favours to get npcs/alliances and to educate foreign heirs, so yes it does in fact influence diplomacy especially with the new alliance system where alliances are honoured automatically.

 

[R'hllor]

It's a new feature. Paradox never adds many features at once, preferring polish and stability over quantity, an approach I don't necessarily agree with but which has obvious merits. I bet that over time they'll add to the favor feature.

Polish and stability certainly don't come to mind first when thinking of Paradox and new mechanics...

 

[Anonymous01]

Polish and stability certainly don't come to mind first when thinking of Paradox and new mechanics...

When you consider how often they release expansions, paradox games are definately more polished and stable than almost every other company's. But its at the cost of features and player choice again, so it's a tradeoff.

 

[brown111]

Buying favors makes Conclave very easy game at hard level (i haven't tried "normal" of course).
I wonder what's happened at "very hard". Unfortunatelly there is no chance to raise difficulty in started game...

 

[JonathanOfArc]

It's a new feature. Paradox never adds many features at once, preferring polish and stability over quantity, an approach I don't necessarily agree with but which has obvious merits. I bet that over time they'll add to the favor feature.

Whaaaaaaaaat? Haha that really made me chuckle. Their expansions always come out a mess and need to be retweaked before they're actually reasonable to play with in the game. I don't know who the hell they have over there play testing these expansions but they must be god damn daft as hell. There are usually extremely obvious problems, not just little intricate issues that are in there on release. I love this game, and I love what the company does, but wow these expansions releases are it's black stain.

 

[R'hllor]

When you consider how often they release expansions, paradox games are definately more polished and stable than almost every other company's. But its at the cost of features and player choice again, so it's a tradeoff.

I wonder if you have actually played the new patch and dlc or if you are only defending Paradox out of pure fanboyism.

Aaaanyway the new patch really is a mess, moreso than any other I've played with. Many new mechanics are not only bad ideas to begin with, but the implementation is also just horrible. I have hopes for eventual fixes for all the nonsense, but damn is there quite a bit to fix.

 

[brown111]

I have hopes for eventual fixes for all the nonsense, but damn is there quite a bit to fix.

Fortunately, Paradox read the comments and maybe there is a 5% chance that at least one beta tester will be emloyed...

 

[Anonymous01]

I wonder if you have actually played the new patch and dlc or if you are only defending Paradox out of pure fanboyism.

Aaaanyway the new patch really is a mess, moreso than any other I've played with. Many new mechanics are not only bad ideas to begin with, but the implementation is also just horrible. I have hopes for eventual fixes for all the nonsense, but damn is there quite a bit to fix.

No one who regularly reads my comments here would mistake me for a 'fanboy.'

As I said, given the number of expansions and the long development cycles (far more and longer than most game developers), paradox games are highly polished and stable comparatively. This holds true for the current expansion. I understand that you don't like some of the new features and that your dramatic response is probably just a way to vent your displeasure, but you (and especially @JonathanOfArc ) are grossly exaggerating. Paradox has had far worse ck2 expansion launches than this, and in terms of polish and stability, their worst is better than most companies' best efforts. I say this as someone who has many problems with paradox's engine, style, and content, as anyone who has read me here before will recall.

 

[Xinkc]

if you have an alliance with a dynasty you can't influence them to honour it.

Allies automatically join your wars upon declaration in my experience. You're not even given the option to reject a call.

 

[JonathanOfArc]

Paradox has had far worse ck2 expansion launches than this, and in terms of polish and stability, their worst is better than most companies' best efforts. I say this as someone who has many problems with paradox's engine, style, and content, as anyone who has read me here before will recall.

Oh yeah, there has been worse. The problem is that it's par the course of action for them.
It could have been a lot worse, but it could have been a lot better. The issue there is that "meh, good enough for now" is their release model.

 

[Secret Master]

Actually, you can use favours to make others join your faction. Of course, you can also use favours to get npcs/alliances and to educate foreign heirs, so yes it does in fact influence diplomacy especially with the new alliance system where alliances are honoured automatically.

Yep. But you left a big use of favors out: prevent realm peace. For vassals with claims within the realm, it's the only way to fly. I got so good at expanding inside my realm that my liege stopped ever getting favors from me when I would use favors to block realm peace.

There's also the whole "Press my claim because you own me a favor, liege" mechanic.

Not only that, but I've noticed the AI makes decent use of favors. I've seen my rivals in the same realm use favors to try and block my activities. Doesn't always work, but I had to learn the hard way that mmy liege was enforcing realm peace so much because the Duke of I-Hate-You-And-Will-Destroy-You-Land kept asking him to with favors.

I have noticed I don't use them as much as others, because once you get too powerful, everyone knows what the consequences of a favor from you entail. And the AI tells me to piss off.

 

[brown111]

Simply question - how can I use Pope's favor?

 

[Darky]

This DLC adds enough other features to be worthwhile to buy.

 

[webslug]

I was quite disappointed with this DLC.